Beretta 92 FS Compact (and general Beretta love lately)

[jkurtz7]

I blew up the pic, although it's not great when enlarged. I think they are 84F's, from the looks of the slide lock lever, and the safety lever.

[1986s4]

D-spring is reliable with anything that you pretty much put in it.


(If you're reloading and you use Tula primers, expect problems, but stock Glocks won't reliably set off those either... Solution? Don't use Tula Primers...)

I've been using Tula primers for a while. About 10,000 now. They have worked in all my pistols, including a D spring equipped 92G. It does have the heavy stock hammer.

1986s4

[Sal Picante]

I've been using Tula primers for a while. About 10,000 now. They have worked in all my pistols, including a D spring equipped 92G. It does have the heavy stock hammer.

1986s4

You sir, are lucky. (http://doodieproject.invisionzone.com/index.php?/topic/349-tula-primers/?hl=tula)

[YVK]

Incidentally, I was testing different springs in my Elite today, and got one light strike in 30 rounds of some cheap russian ammo using a D-spring. With 15 lbs 1911 mainspring and same ammo, the session turned into awesome ball and dummy practice run.
Interestingly, the 15# hammer spring didn't do too poorly with a quality ammo.

[justintime]

What is the upgrades hammer people speak of and where do you buy it? Does it make a big difference like the d spring?

[JV_]

There are (2) Elite hammers. The first one, which shipped with the Elite I, it was very skeletonized. Then a newer version came out, just before the Elite II, which was still skeletonized but had the same weight as the D hammer - but it was heavier than before.

Yea, running a D spring does a lot to bring down the DA pull weight.

[GardoneVT]

What is the upgrades hammer people speak of and where do you buy it? Does it make a big difference like the d spring?

Beretta sells the EII hammer on their website. Its supposed to reduce "lock time", which I must confess hasn't been a sticking point of my shooting. I just hate it when slow lock time ruins my FAST drills. ;)

In all seriousness, the only functional improvement I can deduce is being able to manipulate the slide easier with the hammer down , but that could be psychological.

[JV_]

In all seriousness, the only functional improvement I can deduce is being able to manipulate the slide easier with the hammer down , but that could be psychological.

If you also installed a lighter hammer spring, then you should be able to tell a difference racking the gun. If you're running the same spring, it's probably in your head.

[justintime]

There are (2) Elite hammers. The first one, which shipped with the Elite I, it was very skeletonized. Then a newer version came out, just before the Elite II, which was still skeletonized but had the same weight as the D hammer - but it was heavier than before.

Yea, running a D spring does a lot to bring down the DA pull weight.

Would you say pass on buying the hammer as well? Mostly just trying to make this thing a little easier to shoot for my girlfriend since she likes it so much. The DA pull is pretty heavy

[JV_]

Would you say pass on buying the hammer as well? Mostly just trying to make this thing a little easier to shoot for my girlfriend since she likes it so much. The DA pull is pretty heavy

Save the money on the hammer, but change the spring.

[Sal Picante]

The E2 hammer does look cool tho...

E1 hammer + super light spring (F spring) + federal primers = a noticeable difference :)

[TORCH2J]

Simply so guys could carry cocked and locked.

I guess what I'm trying to ask (and not doing a good job of it) is whether the mod was the one that Todd described, in which case that would make no sense to me, or if they were converted to SAO, in which case that makes a great deal of sense.

For reference, years ago I tried to get along with a SIG X5 SAO, and liked it just fine, except the position of the safety. If Beretta ever made an affordable version, I'd be on it like flies on rice. Unfortunately, I am just not willing to spring the cash for a steel or billenium.

Thanks

[BigT]

I guess what I'm trying to ask (and not doing a good job of it) is whether the mod was the one that Todd described, in which case that would make no sense to me, or if they were converted to SAO, in which case that makes a great deal of sense.

For reference, years ago I tried to get along with a SIG X5 SAO, and liked it just fine, except the position of the safety. If Beretta ever made an affordable version, I'd be on it like flies on rice. Unfortunately, I am just not willing to spring the cash for a steel or billenium.

Thanks


I am 99% sure they werent converted to SAO.Wasnt a standardised thing. Just a mod the guys did to their guns.

[Lon]

Do.any of the compact models have dove tailed front sights? Been thinking about adding one to my collection, but would prefer one I can change the sights on.

[LHS]

Do.any of the compact models have dove tailed front sights? Been thinking about adding one to my collection, but would prefer one I can change the sights on.

I don't believe so. I've never seen a Brig or Vertec compact slide.

[DGI]

With the help of a forum member, my SAO build will now have a Brigadier top end as well :cool:

[Sal Picante]

With the help of a forum member, my SAO build will now have a Brigadier top end as well :cool:

:cool:

Pic or it never happened.

[DGI]

Just so happens UPS just stopped by...

On its way to Josh for fitment to my SAO frame.... Woohooo!!!

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/53D2AC10-6969-444E-879B-CDADCC62B826-7484-0000020E338D3078_zpsd6146588.jpg

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/E0904A15-8271-42C5-8981-BE130BBC9B02-7484-0000020E41B7B56D_zps7e5667ce.jpg

Thanks again WIILSHOOT! Couldnt have done it without ya!

Todd: Im still interested in another should your friend at BUSA have a lead on one for my DAO frame :-)

[YVK]

Here's one on a Vertec:

1703
.

TLG, is that a Shaggy on this Vertec?

[will_1400]

My guess would be they are Taurus 92’s

Actually, they're Beretta 84s as JSGlock said a couple posts above your's.

[ToddG]

TLG, is that a Shaggy on this Vertec?

No. I don't remember what holster it was, actually.

[YVK]

Thanks, I should've guessed. Wishful thinking. That said, now that I can put a Vertec slide on Elite frame, I hope that Shaggy for a regular FS will work.
Interestingly, despite notably slimmer profile, weight difference between the slides is less appreciable at 0.6 oz. I am curious if I'd be able to perceive any difference in cycling.

[DGI]

Home Sweet Home!!!!!

Josh did an outstanding job on her. Im dying to take it to the range! Hopefully these weekend otherwise it'll have to wait until sometime in December (hopefully).

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/25881737-30C6-45C0-BAB5-96F80FB235C6_zpsjqm2nak9.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/25881737-30C6-45C0-BAB5-96F80FB235C6_zpsjqm2nak9.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/10D7C026-567F-4457-8DA8-47DD9CDDB810_zps6nnvvpmo.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/10D7C026-567F-4457-8DA8-47DD9CDDB810_zps6nnvvpmo.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/0BE1C956-72FF-4583-893C-2F9DA268AF5A_zpsbxe1pm6p.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/0BE1C956-72FF-4583-893C-2F9DA268AF5A_zpsbxe1pm6p.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/F9672B1E-7C3D-49B1-AACB-0014C8E4FE0D_zpssivcxa2q.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/F9672B1E-7C3D-49B1-AACB-0014C8E4FE0D_zpssivcxa2q.jpg.html)

And a family pic:

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/12264B28-3551-4577-A4DD-D7DBF7A140E8_zps2c941eju.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/12264B28-3551-4577-A4DD-D7DBF7A140E8_zps2c941eju.jpg.html)

[Sal Picante]

That's pretty baller!

Glad it worked out!

[Tamara]

Home Sweet Home!!!!!

Josh did an outstanding job on her. Im dying to take it to the range! Hopefully these weekend otherwise it'll have to wait until sometime in December (hopefully).

I feel dirty for wanting a Beretta that badly. :p

[DGI]

That's pretty baller!

Glad it worked out!

Thanks! Couldnt have completed the set without you!


I feel dirty for wanting a Beretta that badly. :p

I feel dirty for liking my 92s more and more... the speedbump trigger Josh installed on the SAO pistol is BAD ASS! I never thought I'd feel this level of precision in a 92 Trigger. Im half tempted to bastardize my Novak's 92 with one...

[Gary1911A1]

Very, very nice. Almost makes me want to go out and but another Beretta.

[shootist26]

Slapped a G slide on an m9a1 frame today. I now own a Beretta M9A1-G :cool::cool:

I also like the checkering on the m9a1 grip a lot.

[GJM]

Looks like our budding GM, Wilshoot, is dropping the pizza gun for a CZ.

[Sal Picante]

Looks like our budding GM, Wilshoot, is dropping the pizza gun for a CZ.

I'm keeping quite a few of these pizza pistols (framing the Elite I made GM with, safe-queening 2 others), but have a chance to grab a set of Matt Mink worked over CZ Shadows. I'd be stupid not to with a support base like that! Additionally, Beretta's lack of support is... Well, let's just say, "Because you suck and we hate you"

I've had a really good run with the Pizza Gun - it has been reliable and accurate - though there are aspects, for a competition gun, that other manufacturers may seem to meet.

[DGI]

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=381298704

Inox Brigadier with Langdon Tactical trigger

[YVK]

framing the Elite I made GM with, safe-queening 2 others

Small side track, but congrats on GM, well done.

[Sal Picante]

Small side track, but congrats on GM, well done.

Thanks!

[shootist26]

is there any tangible advantage to a steel trigger vs the polymer coated steel one?

Also, what is this oversized trigger return spring that I received? The normal one is on the bottom.

http://i39.tinypic.com/2m7sxe9.jpg

[YVK]

That does look strange. Where did you buy it from?

[shootist26]

That does look strange. Where did you buy it from?

Midwest Gun Works. I only needed a D spring but Brownells was sold out. Ended up getting the D spring/steel trigger/trigger return spring package from MGW because it was the only thing in stock.

[GJM]

Has anyone experimented with a KKM or other after market barrel in their 92/Elite, and if so, was there an accuracy improvement?

[Sal Picante]

is there any tangible advantage to a steel trigger vs the polymer coated steel one?

Yeah - chicks dig it!
For real? Not really - unless you're a gunsmith and want to weld it, etc.



Also, what is this oversized trigger return spring that I received? The normal one is on the bottom.

Both work - I seem to have had more longevity out of the larger ones, but that's just anecdotal...

[ToddG]

Has anyone experimented with a KKM or other after market barrel in their 92/Elite, and if so, was there an accuracy improvement?

I have a hand-fitted BarSto in my "LTT One" 92G and it definitely tightened up the groups at distance.

[GJM]

Shot my two Elite's and 92G-SD at 25 and 50 yards this morning, using Aguila 124 ball. This is typical of the accuracy of the Elite pistols at 25 yards (shot sitting). POI is a bit low, and I can use a taller rear sight. The 92G-SD shot nearly twice as large groups, and I might check out a KKM, or other after market barrel, for it.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/elite_zpsd213a998.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/elite_zpsd213a998.jpg.html)

[Sal Picante]

Shot my two Elite's and 92G-SD at 25 and 50 yards this morning, using Aguila 124 ball. This is typical of the accuracy of the Elite pistols at 25 yards (shot sitting). POI is a bit low, and I can use a taller rear sight. The 92G-SD shot nearly twice as large groups, and I might check out a KKM, or other after market barrel, for it.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/elite_zpsd213a998.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/elite_zpsd213a998.jpg.html)

That doesn't sound right... The G-SD was shooting easily into a B27 at 25, freestyle standing.

I was feeding it 124 gr over 4.1 of titegroup. I'd try a different lot of ammo. Interestingly enough, 115's seemed most accurate out of it...

[GJM]

That doesn't sound right... The G-SD was shooting easily into a B27 at 25, freestyle standing.

I was feeding it 124 gr over 4.1 of titegroup. I'd try a different lot of ammo. Interestingly enough, 115's seemed most accurate out of it...

Different 92G-SD, haven't shot your SD yet.

[YVK]

That doesn't sound right... The G-SD was shooting easily into a B27 at 25, freestyle standing.

I was feeding it 124 gr over 4.1 of titegroup. I'd try a different lot of ammo. Interestingly enough, 115's seemed most accurate out of it...

I was just about to reply that you're naive to think he has only one SD....;)

[shootist26]

http://i41.tinypic.com/r88i95.jpg

Friday morning steel. You can't beat that.

Broke in my new M9A1-G today. 400 rounds of Blazer aluminum with 0 issues.

[GJM]

Friday morning steel. You can't beat that.

Broke in my new M9A1-G today. 400 rounds of Blazer aluminum with 0 issues.

I was out shooting this morning, but we have less snow than you. I shot two 5 shot groups at 50 yards with my Elite II, from sitting in the snow, and got one 4 and one 5 inch group. Not sure if Beretta put more care into the Elite pistols, but my two Elite pistols definitely shoot well.

"M9A1-G." I have been wondering what is the best of the current Beretta models for daily carry -- M9A1, 92A1, 92FS or the M9? I like the 92A1 as it accepts Trijicon HD sights, and am curious why you went with the M9A1? I assume Josh did the conversion?

[shootist26]

I was out shooting this morning, but we have less snow than you. I shot two 5 shot groups at 50 yards with my Elite II, from sitting in the snow, and got one 4 and one 5 inch group. Not sure if Beretta put more care into the Elite pistols, but my two Elite pistols definitely shoot well.

"M9A1-G." I have been wondering what is the best of the current Beretta models for daily carry -- M9A1, 92A1, 92FS or the M9? I like the 92A1 as it accepts Trijicon HD sights, and am curious why you went with the M9A1? I assume Josh did the conversion?

I slapped a 92G slide that I had on an M9A1 frame. The G slide has trijicon night sights from Tooltech. I couldn't find a 92A1 locally and holsters are more limited. M9A1s will fit in vertec holsters as well.

[ToddG]

Not sure if Beretta put more care into the Elite pistols...

No. Just like Glock uses the same internals in a G26 as a G34 and SIG uses the same internals in a run of the mill P226 as one of their "Uber Elite Rainbow Dark Specials," Beretta follows the parts is parts philosophy. FWIW, in my experience Berettas are pretty accurate stock guns. Their reputation for being mediocre comes from shooting M882.

[Gary1911A1]

http://i41.tinypic.com/r88i95.jpg

Friday morning steel. You can't beat that.

Broke in my new M9A1-G today. 400 rounds of Blazer aluminum with 0 issues.

I understand why you shot Aluminum Blazer. Not much chance of finding most of your brass in that.

[GJM]

I recently bought a beautiful 92G Centurion. The lower has the Wolff TRS installed, and I don't care for the feel of the trigger compared to stock. What is involved in returning it to the stock TRS -- just the stock TRS or additional parts/mods?

[johnson]

I just finished making my own overtravel stop with blue painter's tape and the difference is tremendous. It passes the dime drill with ease now.

Beretta 87 Cheetah .22 LR
http://i103.photobucket.com/albums/m127/johnson_n/IMG_2192_zpsc2748a78.jpg

[DGI]

Some pics of my recent SAO build from AGW's FB page:

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/4D117E89-7737-4D0A-8AEA-7B96A9D7E365_zpsjfd8r2bk.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/4D117E89-7737-4D0A-8AEA-7B96A9D7E365_zpsjfd8r2bk.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/84A0EE25-C986-4849-955C-BC309CBB3917_zpsimgyehem.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/84A0EE25-C986-4849-955C-BC309CBB3917_zpsimgyehem.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/FD4A0C28-0200-4572-BC81-7042CC33178B_zpshot51jog.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/FD4A0C28-0200-4572-BC81-7042CC33178B_zpshot51jog.jpg.html)

[LHS]

I'll be in my bunk.


Some pics of my recent SAO build from AGW's FB page:

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/4D117E89-7737-4D0A-8AEA-7B96A9D7E365_zpsjfd8r2bk.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/4D117E89-7737-4D0A-8AEA-7B96A9D7E365_zpsjfd8r2bk.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/84A0EE25-C986-4849-955C-BC309CBB3917_zpsimgyehem.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/84A0EE25-C986-4849-955C-BC309CBB3917_zpsimgyehem.jpg.html)

http://i302.photobucket.com/albums/nn89/prez1967/Guns/FD4A0C28-0200-4572-BC81-7042CC33178B_zpshot51jog.jpg (http://s302.photobucket.com/user/prez1967/media/Guns/FD4A0C28-0200-4572-BC81-7042CC33178B_zpshot51jog.jpg.html)

[Padwan]

Nice! Did you have AGW thin down the grip tang/beavertail area just a bit? It looks like it was sculpted to give a slightly higher grip.

[DGI]

Not to my knowledge. The pistol feels and shoots great. The speedbump trigger that was installed is unbelievable! I have a skeletonized trigger on my M9A1 but have a feeling it will get replaced with one of AGW's units soon. Top notch work...

[1986s4]

I recently bought a beautiful 92G Centurion. The lower has the Wolff TRS installed, and I don't care for the feel of the trigger compared to stock. What is involved in returning it to the stock TRS -- just the stock TRS or additional parts/mods?

I converted mine to the Wolff unit some time ago. The trigger return doesn't seem as crisp as the stock unit but I've gotten used to it. Pretty sure all you need is the stock Beretta TRS. You must have the steel trigger since the Wolf unit doesn't work with the plastic clad trigger.

[Sal Picante]

Not to my knowledge. The pistol feels and shoots great. The speedbump trigger that was installed is unbelievable! I have a skeletonized trigger on my M9A1 but have a feeling it will get replaced with one of AGW's units soon. Top notch work...

Dude... That's nice.

Glad to help!

[jetfire]

Dat thumb safety tho

[GJM]

I had picked up a 92D Centurion a few months back, that I got around to shooting. After shooting it, I have to say that I prefer the classic Beretta DA/SA trigger.

On a lark, I grabbed a regular 92 lower and put it on making a slick side, no de-cock DA/SA Beretta. Bill Wilson had told me about this. Liked it much better with the classic lower, and boy is it a slick package!

[Rack]

I had picked up a 92D Centurion a few months back, that I got around to shooting. After shooting it, I have to say that I prefer the classic Beretta DA/SA trigger.

On a lark, I grabbed a regular 92 lower and put it on making a slick side, no de-cock DA/SA Beretta. Bill Wilson had told me about this. Liked it much better with the classic lower, and boy is it a slick package!

Interesting. Does the firing pin safety (or is it the hammer safety?) fully engage upon manually lowering the hammer? I've never thought of this combo.

[GardoneVT]

Interesting. Does the firing pin safety (or is it the hammer safety?) fully engage upon manually lowering the hammer? I've never thought of this combo.

On my DA/SA 92, the trigger must be held to the rear while the hammer is lowered. Thus deactivating the FP block .

[DGI]

How would you safely decock this pistol?

Your far better off having a low profile single sided safety put on your FS slide and running a D hammer IMHO...

[GJM]

On my DA/SA 92, the trigger must be held to the rear while the hammer is lowered. Thus deactivating the FP block .

Not so on my 92G, Elite II, 92G-SD and 92G Compact.


How would you safely decock this pistol?

Umm, just like a CZ with a thumb safety or HK 45 with a variant 9 plate. Place support thumb between hammer and frame, hold hammer with your other thumb, press the trigger, release the trigger, and lower the hammer.

As far as "far better off," I think this falls into the area of individual taste. I got a picture a day or two ago from Bill Wilson, of a 92D, he modified this way.

[DGI]

Interesting... Whatever works for you indeed. FWIW: im a huge fan of the D slide!

[Magic_Salad0892]

Why not like a 1911? Unload pistol, verify clear. Point in safe direction. Pull trigger. (Safety on, in the Beretta's case?) Re-insert loaded magazine. Don't rack the slide.

[jetfire]

Not so on my 92G, Elite II, 92G-SD and 92G Compact.



Umm, just like a CZ with a thumb safety or HK 45 with a variant 9 plate. Place support thumb between hammer and frame, hold hammer with your other thumb, press the trigger, release the trigger, and lower the hammer.

As far as "far better off," I think this falls into the area of individual taste. I got a picture a day or two ago from Bill Wilson, of a 92D, he modified this way.

So let me just double check: you put a "D" slide on an FS frame, correct? Because that sounds pants-tighteningly radical. That would mean you'd have an FS hammer for DA/SA shooting, but no stupid safety to snag on things.

/me starts looking at Gunbroker for D series guns now.

[GJM]

So let me just double check: you put a "D" slide on an FS frame, correct? Because that sounds pants-tighteningly radical. That would mean you'd have an FS hammer for DA/SA shooting, but no stupid safety to snag on things.

/me starts looking at Gunbroker for D series guns now.

Yep.

[jetfire]

That sounds hot...and oh look, a 92D on gunbroker for way less than my tax return.

I hate you.

[GardoneVT]

So let me just double check: you put a "D" slide on an FS frame, correct? Because that sounds pants-tighteningly radical. That would mean you'd have an FS hammer for DA/SA shooting, but no stupid safety to snag on things.

/me starts looking at Gunbroker for D series guns now.

Here's another advantage: on my 92FS, if I pull the trigger, release it, then lower the hammer it will fall to the half cock notch instead of all the way to the FP.To deckock it manually all the way to the FP I have to hold the trigger back.

Thus, on a "92FS-D", you can start out at half cock instead , similar to how a Sig pistols hammer doesn't rest on the FP when decocked.

[jetfire]

I don't want one for anything like serious social work, I just want to make one because it sounds hella rad. What would be really tits would be throw a 92D Compact slide on one of the new 92 Compacts they're making and have a slick side no-safety/compact.

[DGI]

Im sti trying to figure a safe way to completely lower a D hammer on a live round with the trigger pulled to the rear.

I agree that slick slides rock!!!! I cant picture a sexier pistol. I have spare Centurion and full size D slides as a result (and may be convinced to part with some) but safety first...

Looking around on Beretta forum, this topic has been discussed plenty apparently.

I really dig my DAO Centurion and how it carries and shoots. Im gonna go fondle some steel now...

[Rack]

On my DA/SA 92, the trigger must be held to the rear while the hammer is lowered. Thus deactivating the FP block .

So, the FP block does NOT spring back into place after releasing the trigger (after lowering the hammer)? In other words, if you lower the hammer and the FP block is deactivated, it wouldn't be safe to carry.

[ToddG]

So, the FP block does NOT spring back into place after releasing the trigger (after lowering the hammer)? In other words, if you lower the hammer and the FP block is deactivated, it wouldn't be safe to carry.

This is incorrect.

As you pull the trigger, the FP block is disengaged. Thus if you pull the trigger in order to decock, you are basically pulling the trigger and if the hammer falls to the firing pin because you slip, whatever, you get The Big Noise.

Once you release the trigger back forward the firing pin block engages just as it would if you fired a single shot from the gun on purpose.

When you use the decocker on a gun like a SIG or Beretta, the hammer gets dropped and the firing pin block remains in place during the operation. That's why it's safer.

[jetfire]

So if I'm understanding this correctly, if you thumb-decock the 92FS like Riggs does in Lethal Weapon, it's just like thumb-decocking a CZ - if you slip, you get loud noise.

[ToddG]

'zactly

[Matt O]

This is incorrect.

As you pull the trigger, the FP block is disengaged. Thus if you pull the trigger in order to decock, you are basically pulling the trigger and if the hammer falls to the firing pin because you slip, whatever, you get The Big Noise.

Once you release the trigger back forward the firing pin block engages just as it would if you fired a single shot from the gun on purpose.

When you use the decocker on a gun like a SIG or Beretta, the hammer gets dropped and the firing pin block remains in place during the operation. That's why it's safer.

I completely agree that using a decocker to lower a hammer is a more fool proof method than doing so manually. That said, for competition or range guns that may not have a decocker, one benefit of a fpb-equipped gun is that once the hammer clears the half cock notch, if you let the trigger and firing pin reset before lowering the hammer the rest of the way, you're doing so on a firing pin that is blocked and can't set off a primer. This is of course assuming you want to decock to a hammer fully at rest position. Decocking to the half-cock notch just requires you to depress the trigger, slip the full cock notch, release the trigger and slowly let the hammer slide onto the half cock notch.

[ToddG]

Understood.

You've got a round in the chamber, you don't want it to go off, but you pull the trigger. This, to me, is not an ideal thing. :cool:

I've had enough CZ shooters in class to see it done a million times and I've never seen one make a mistake yet. It's not something I'd ban from class or anything. But personally, it wouldn't be the way I'd run a gun. If I were to shoot a CZ I'd get a DA model which is far more in line with how often/when I like to decock the pistol, anyway. Each to his own so long as he is safe.

edited to add: When I was teaching for both Beretta and SIG we were adamant about using the decocker specifically because of the numberer of times people had discharged weapons accidentally by lowering the hammer manually. So while it might be fine for switched on guys you see at intermediate/advanced classes, it's still an increased risk and one I don't think should be looked upon casually (not saying you were). How many times have you done it, say, during a multi-day class where it's pouring heavy rain every minute of every day?

[GJM]

When I started shooting a thumb safety CZ, I was quite concerned about the de-cocking process. Now it seems very routine, and I place my support thumb between the hammer and firing pin to avoid loud noises if I slip at the wrong moment. So routine, that I have to stop myself from de-cocking a Beretta and Sig the same way as the CZ.

However, I think the de-cocker is the way to go on a defensive CZ, especially given how good the triggers can be made on de-cocker models, and have de-cocker versions in the works.

[Matt O]

You've got a round in the chamber, you don't want it to go off, but you pull the trigger. This, to me, is not an ideal thing. :cool:

Not ideal, no. To clarify though, for a comp gun where you'll be decocking in a safe environment and which is easier to break down for maintenance/cleaning due to the simplified non decocker sear cage, I'd say it's no big deal (as you said, assuming one is safe).

For carry though? Assuming the pistol isn't carried C&L, I think a decocker model is absolutely the way to go.

[ToddG]

Not ideal, no. To clarify though, for a comp gun where you'll be decocking in a safe environment and which is easier to break down for maintenance/cleaning due to the simplified non decocker sear cage, I'd say it's no big deal (as you said, assuming one is safe).

I'll just never be the "comp gun this, carry gun that" guy so it's hard for me to wrap my brain around. :cool:

[TCinVA]

So if I'm understanding this correctly, if you thumb-decock the 92FS like Riggs does in Lethal Weapon, it's just like thumb-decocking a CZ - if you slip, you get loud noise.

On the rare occasions when I have to manually decock a handgun I wedge my weak thumb between the hammer and frame/slide and then pull the trigger just long enough to let the hammer go forward...then I immediately release the trigger and gently guide the hammer forward as I remove my thumb.

[Matt O]

I'll just never be the "comp gun this, carry gun that" guy so it's hard for me to wrap my brain around. :cool:

Well in this case I'm referring to two subtlely different permutations of the same thing. As you said though, each to his own. :D

[ToddG]

Well in this case I'm referring to two subtlely different permutations of the same thing. As you said though, each to his own. :D

Matt -- I honestly hope you don't think I'm picking on you but I'd like to explore this a bit further if you don't mind.

I don't think it's a subtle permutation, especially in terms of playing games. I play those games to work on my actual skills and I try, within reason, to shoot and manipulate the gun in the manner I want to "for real." Specifically, if I'm running from Box A to Box B, I'm going to safe/decock my gun because that's what I'd do once I dismounted from a neutralized target and decided to move to another location. IDPA, USPSA, etc. are a great place to get into that habit. You do so much moving and because it's so tempting to keep the gun in SA mode and build a complacency borne of what works in that "safe environment," as you put it. But it is the wrong habit to develop for real gun handling.

[GJM]

Well in this case I'm referring to two subtlely different permutations of the same thing. As you said though, each to his own. :D

Since I neither carry the CZ cocked and locked, nor use the thumb safety, I run the de-cocker and thumb safety models the same way.

As long as we are discussing CZ pistols, I continue to be wowed by how good the little P01 shoots. Here it is, pictured with, what else a P229.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/P01_zps93158ff3.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/P01_zps93158ff3.jpg.html)

[GJM]

I have never seen a single person de-cock their pistol in a USPSA match.

I've never seen a Grizzly bear.


I have never seen a person de-cock their DA/SA at Rogers, after reloading while waiting for the next wave.

I have, and more than just me. Then again, my first trip to Rogers was with the instructor cadre for a special group out of Ft. Bragg running Berettas...


If we are going to do a tactical discussion, we ought to throw in the mix the consideration of the risk when intermittently de-cocking, what happens when you think you are de-cocked but are not, and trigger a shot prematurely.

I don't think I've ever missed the decocker and not known it. That's the difference between making it a ritual and making it a choice. To me, it's like putting on my seatbelt. I don't do it sometimes. I do it every time.

[Matt O]

Matt -- I honestly hope you don't think I'm picking on you but I'd like to explore this a bit further if you don't mind.

Not at all - my comments were made in the spirit of ongoing discussion. I do apologize for continuing to derail the thread though.


I don't think it's a subtle permutation, especially in terms of playing games. I play those games to work on my actual skills and I try, within reason, to shoot and manipulate the gun in the manner I want to "for real." Specifically, if I'm running from Box A to Box B, I'm going to safe/decock my gun because that's what I'd do once I dismounted from a neutralized target and decided to move to another location. IDPA, USPSA, etc. are a great place to get into that habit. You do so much moving and because it's so tempting to keep the gun in SA mode and build a complacency borne of what works in that "safe environment," as you put it. But it is the wrong habit to develop for real gun handling.

I think you make a good point, but we'd have to clarify why an individual was playing a particular game. For me personally, as I'm not particularly interested in IDPA and would prefer USPSA, my inclination for gun games would run more towards practice of pure firearms manipulation under pressure, not so much "for real" use of cover or other more real life encounter-esque approaches.

That said, admittedly I hadn't given much thought to decocking in between target arrays as that sort of situation hasn't really played into my mental preparation for a likely self defense scenario (extended Nairobi mall attacks not-withstanding), but perhaps I should - I'd have to think about that a bit more. In terms of firearms manipulations that don't provide a competitive disadvantage, I wonder if decocking as such might be something worth testing out. I have a decocker CZ on the way so I'll give it a try on the timer and see what the outcome is.

[GJM]

I've never seen a Grizzly bear.



I have, and more than just me. Then again, my first trip to Rogers was with the instructor cadre for a special group out of Ft. Bragg running Berettas...



I don't think I've ever missed the decocker and not known it. That's the difference between making it a ritual and making it a choice. To me, it's like putting on my seatbelt. I don't do it sometimes. I do it every time.

OK, this is weird. Todd has posted, but the post shows as coming from me, GJM.

Next thing someone is going to suggest I should wear concealment to a USPSA match, not carry 4 or 5 extra magazines, use JHP ammo, not reload charging targets, and to stop taking on 42 bad guys.

[Rack]

This is incorrect.

As you pull the trigger, the FP block is disengaged. Thus if you pull the trigger in order to decock, you are basically pulling the trigger and if the hammer falls to the firing pin because you slip, whatever, you get The Big Noise.

Once you release the trigger back forward the firing pin block engages just as it would if you fired a single shot from the gun on purpose.

When you use the decocker on a gun like a SIG or Beretta, the hammer gets dropped and the firing pin block remains in place during the operation. That's why it's safer.

This is what I was hoping to hear.

[Rack]

GJM,

If you are so inclined, I would love to see some pictures of your 92FS-D.

[GJM]

GJM,

If you are so inclined, I would love to see some pictures of your 92FS-D.

I have a picture of a gorgeous 92D, so converted by a friend, but since it is his pistol, with a bunch of neat mods, I am not comfortable posting it until he gives the go ahead. I don't have one of these converted yet, just a 92D Centurion to serve as base gun for such a project.

[FotoTomas]

As a side note to the slick slide 92Fs...Years ago I had a plethora of Berettas and still keep a couple in the house. My agency issued 92D Centurions with magazine disconnects and I support that idea as I liked having a DAO pull and a "kill" switch" on my pistol for the unique enviroments I patrolled. I also liked a manual safety as an additional step between me and a gun grab gone really bad.

Well I took a pair of Centurions, my 92D Disconnect and a 92Fs and put the 92Fs Centurion slide on the "D" frame and had the best of both. Disconnect AND manual safety with a DAO lockwork. In addition Beretta marketed the 92Ds model for awhile. A DAO with slide safety.

Now days My Beretta's in the house are D models and no swapping out of parts. Getting old and curmudgeonly has me trying to simplify my life.

[Jared]

Couldn't a person make a "DS" by swapping out the hammer on a standard FS for a D hammer and removing the single action sear?

[ToddG]

Couldn't a person make a "DS" by swapping out the hammer on a standard FS for a D hammer and removing the single action sear?

For the first year (maybe two) of DAO production, all Berettas were in fact DS models and the only changes were to remove the sear, replacing it with a spacer in the frame, and I thin bob the hammer. But to be honest I wouldn't swear the hammers were bobbed at first, even.

[LHS]

FYI, there are a couple of police trade-in 92Gs on Gunbroker for like $330. I bought a pair from the same company last year with no issues.

[Jared]

For the first year (maybe two) of DAO production, all Berettas were in fact DS models and the only changes were to remove the sear, replacing it with a spacer in the frame, and I thin bob the hammer. But to be honest I wouldn't swear the hammers were bobbed at first, even.

Is the frame spacer in place of the sear a must have? I am genuinely curious.

[DGI]

Is the frame spacer in place of the sear a must have? I am genuinely curious.

Many do not run the spacer... not sure what, if any, support it provides. I see it more as a place holder, although there doesn't seem to be anything that would fall out of place should it be missing.

[LangdonTactical]

Is the frame spacer in place of the sear a must have? I am genuinely curious.

The spacer in the frame is really taking the place of the decocking lever that the safety pushes and releases the hammer. It sits in the frame right next to the firing pin block lever. The sear is just simply removed on the D model guns, no spacer there on the guns I have seen. The frames are the same and as Todd said some of the D hammers do/did have sear notches in them so they will work in the DA/SA mode.

[Jared]

Thank you, Mr. Langdon

[LangdonTactical]

And I found out yesterday that Beretta made a 92G Vertec Centurion! I did not know such a thing existed. So a compact slide, G, with a dove tail front sight! That would be the bomb on my 92 Compact or an M9A1 Compact!

[justintime]

That's exactly what I want out of a beretta

[GJM]

I played with this one a bit at AUSA and spoke with the BUSA rep at the booth. This gun was labeled "M9A3 Prototype". It had the captured guiderod spring and internal buffer of the 92A1. It also had safety/decocker levers which went higher than 90 degrees when in the 'fire' position. (This photo seems to show the lever in between the safe and fire position) The rep said that was to reduce the chance of accidentally putting the gun on safe when racking the slide.

I would think that the internal buffer might help a bit with durability. I'm not convinced the safety/decocker lever position would make much of a difference, but it would be interesting to hear from someone who has actually shot a Beretta with that feature.

This, with a G lever, would be a perfect new Beretta introduction.

[GJM]

On another note, I thought this was an interesting looking Beretta displayed at AUSA...

https://scontent-a-iad.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/1381177_10151732363027877_871914030_n.jpg

oops, here is the picture.

[YVK]

And I found out yesterday that Beretta made a 92G Vertec Centurion! I did not know such a thing existed. So a compact slide, G, with a dove tail front sight! That would be the bomb on my 92 Compact or an M9A1 Compact!

I would just take it as is, and get rid of my 19s/p30s/czs in bulk.

[Crow Hunter]

I would just take it as is, and get rid of my 19s/p30s/czs in bulk.

So would I.

Glock 19 sized, aluminum framed, DA/SA, decocker only, and a CTC grip with Tritium sights and Beretta beautiful trigger is my dream gun.

[HCL3]

Why doesn't Beretta make more of the 92G models? Todd - any insight from your time working there?

[ffhounddog]

Well I did find a 92G Vertec. Shot well that was at 20 yards both hands, strong hand only, and other strong hand only shots.


http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c68/ffhounddog/a976d4b2-3ee4-46b9-9216-56c29cf24bb5_zps85695468.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/ffhounddog/media/a976d4b2-3ee4-46b9-9216-56c29cf24bb5_zps85695468.jpg.html)

http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c68/ffhounddog/1e031c00-0342-41ee-9a1c-6155e9bafa52_zps1e1db005.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/ffhounddog/media/1e031c00-0342-41ee-9a1c-6155e9bafa52_zps1e1db005.jpg.html)

[Clobbersaurus]

Damn this thread. I broke down and just sent the cash for this.

Finding a holster for a Brigadier in Canada is going to be a problem.

If one of you nice kindred spirits has an OWB kydex job gathering dust and wouldn't mind shipping it to the great white north, name yer price....eh?
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/7853d3ca-f451-460c-a990-e2f0fdefd7f7_zpsa1575206.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/7853d3ca-f451-460c-a990-e2f0fdefd7f7_zpsa1575206.jpg.html)

[GJM]

Blade-Tech sells an OWB for the Elite, which fits the Brigadier. Can you get one from them?

[Clobbersaurus]

Yeah, I'm looking at their website now. They do ship to Canada I believe.

Wilson Combat makes one that would work as well, but they don't do international shipping.

[GJM]

Yeah, I'm looking at their website now. They do ship to Canada I believe.

Wilson Combat makes one that would work as well, but they don't do international shipping.

excellent holster, the WC kydex one, but feels a smudge tight with the Brigadier slide. I believe Willshoot campaigned the Blade-Tech, and also perhaps a Comp-Tac (no longer in production if their website is right) to his GM classification before he went Czechnology.

[LHS]

excellent holster, the WC kydex one, but feels a smudge tight with the Brigadier slide. I believe Willshoot campaigned the Blade-Tech, and also perhaps a Comp-Tac (no longer in production if their website is right) to his GM classification before he went Czechnology.

Comp-Tac used to at least make the MTAC for the Brig-slide 92. I should have bought another one for a spare, just in case.

[GJM]

Stumbled onto this great old thread, featuring TLG, last night:


http://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-25308.html

And this:

http://www.familyfriendsfirearms.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-1140.html

http://beretta.squawk.com/vertec.html ... Beretta Vertec
from Todd Louis Green
Accokeek, MD (October 27, 2001) - The next step in the evolution of the 90-series Beretta pistol has arrived.

Take the world's most tested and trusted pistol, the Beretta 92/96 series. Add new capabilities in response to the demanding needs of our law enforcement and military customers without compromising the quality, reliability, and safety for which the Beretta pistol is already famous. The result is the revolutionary new Beretta Vertec.

The Vertec (which was called the "Evolution" internally during development) began at a Beretta Law Enforcement division meeting late in 2000. At that time, an unofficial committee was formed to produce the specifications for a new version of the Beretta 90-series pistol which would address the evolving needs of American law enforcement and military personnel. The group determined that certain features of the now famous Beretta Elite-series pistols, along with innovative new changes to the existing design, would best meet those needs without a significant change in manufacturing cost (and thus price).

The group identified two specific areas which needed to be addressed as priorities: Trigger reach. With the increasing number of small-handed police officers, military personnel, and private firearms enthusiasts, the long trigger reach on the Beretta pistol was seen as a hindrance. In response, Beretta's Production department created a prototype pistol with a completely straight ("vertical") backstrap. With the addition of a short-reach trigger and innovative grip, this prototype pistol was tested by people of all hand sizes. Experienced Beretta shooters such as Ernest Langdon and Todd Louis Green tested the modified backstrap to guarantee that the natural pointing characteristics of the pistol would not be affected adversely.
Accessory rail. A common request of both law enforcement and military operators, the Beretta Vertec uses a newly engineered frame design complete with integral accessory rails. These allow the user to attach a wide variety of popular white-, IR-, and laser-light modules to the gun. Rather than create a new proprietary mounting system, the Beretta Vertec uses the same rail dimensions as the popular "Glock" handguns and is therefore compatible with the same flashlight and laser attachments from such companies as SureFire and Insight Technology.[/list]In addition to these two major modifications, the Beretta Vertec also offers these features:[list] Removable front sight. Using the standard 90-series slide, Beretta USA has redesigned the front sight area to allow a drift-adjustable, removable front sight. This will allow end users to replace the factory configuration sight with any number of tritium "night sights" and other specialty devices.
Flush-fitting stainless barrel. Decreasing the overall length of the pistol and providing a cleaner look, the Vertec follows the tradition of the Elite-series pistols by using a 4.7" flush-fitting stainless steel barrel. Standard Vertec pistols will come with a black (Bruniton coated) stainless barrel, while Inox versions of the pistol will of course be produced without the black coating.
Beveled magazine well. First seen on the Beretta Elite, this feature will now be standard for all Vertec pistols. The beveled magazine well allows operators to perform faster, smoother reloads under stress.
No lanyard loop. The standard Vertec pistol will not have a lanyard loop. However, special limited runs of the pistol may be produced with lanyard loops to accommodate specific mission profiles of military and law enforcement units.
Dual-textured thin polymer grips. Designed by a team of experienced pistol shooters, the innovative new grip panels on the Beretta Vertec have two different style gripping surfaces. Checkered at maximum friction points and pebbled exactly in those places where you need some freedom of movement, this revolutionary design improves both controllability and comfort. The 92FS and 96F versions of the Vertec are expected to be available within 30-60 days (as well as 'D' and 'G' configuration pistols for law enforcement and military customers). Inox versions will follow in 2002. Pricing has not been set as of yet, but is not expected to be considerably greater than current 92FS and 96F base model pistols.

Stay safe!

[Up1911Fan]

That appears to be a coated 92A1.

[Clobbersaurus]

It arrived, extra mags and holsters ordered.

I'm less impressed with the DA an SA pulls than I thought I would be, especially when compared to some recent Sig's I've shot. VZ grips are amazing for the little bit of texturing they did. I need more coverage, so will likely stipple the original grips that came with it. The factory checkering feels good. The extended mag release works well. Mag insertions at speed are very smooth. I fixed the front and rear sights with some fine painting. Decocker is VERY stiff, hopefully it breaks in with some use. Testing soon.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/d0945ebf-49d5-450b-b318-8f6492fc5d4c_zps02d55f08.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/d0945ebf-49d5-450b-b318-8f6492fc5d4c_zps02d55f08.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03528_zpsc89c53db.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03528_zpsc89c53db.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03525_zps720a10e9.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03525_zps720a10e9.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03533_zps1218b3f9.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03533_zps1218b3f9.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03537_zpse964cdad.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03537_zpse964cdad.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03541_zps7d9e04de.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03541_zps7d9e04de.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03542_zps871eb9f9.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03542_zps871eb9f9.jpg.html)

[Dagga Boy]

I just got my Vertec frame today to mate with my 92FS slide that has a threaded barrel. All I can say is that Beretta totally screwed the pooch in its inability to get this thing to go. I have been a long time Beretta detractor. The vertex frame has just changed that. My gun is going to be a test bed for the Wilson Beretta 92 upgrades, and I have a feeling this thing is going to be a great shooter. I have a very average size hand and like smaller grips where I can get solid alignment with my forearm. The Vertec frame makes a huge difference to me.

[Tamara]

Stumbled onto this great old thread, featuring TLG, last night:


http://www.m4carbine.net/archive/index.php/t-25308.html

And this:

http://www.familyfriendsfirearms.com/forum/archive/index.php/t-1140.html

I had no idea FF&F was still around. :o

[ffhounddog]

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z411/aftransporter1/b1604ddb-4166-4f51-8af7-bcebb69608e5_zpsc9e67f82.jpg (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/aftransporter1/media/b1604ddb-4166-4f51-8af7-bcebb69608e5_zpsc9e67f82.jpg.html). I like my new yes new 92 EliteII. Shot it better than any beretta before but needs new sights.

My Vertec and 90-Two are real close seconds.

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z411/aftransporter1/WP_20140627_002_zps0cbf9023.jpg (http://s1188.photobucket.com/user/aftransporter1/media/WP_20140627_002_zps0cbf9023.jpg.html)

I find going from LEM to Berettas and back easier than going from LEM to Glock in my opinion.

[Tamara]

I know where there's an Elite II for sale right now for a not-unreasonable price. Y'all are gonna make me do something silly...

[jetfire]

I know where there's an Elite II for sale right now for a not-unreasonable price. Y'all are gonna make me do something silly...

DO IT

[ffhounddog]

I know where there's an Elite II for sale right now for a not-unreasonable price. Y'all are gonna make me do something silly...

You know you want it...I got mine because it matches my shoes.

[orionz06]

I know where there's an Elite II for sale right now for a not-unreasonable price. Y'all are gonna make me do something silly...

Buy it now and when this forum shifts away from the VP9 to a hammer fired gun sell it. You can net in some nice profits.

[RevolverRob]

I know where there's an Elite II for sale right now for a not-unreasonable price. Y'all are gonna make me do something silly...

Well if you don't do it, don't hold back and let some of us looking for Berettas in on the secret.

-Rob

[will_1400]

This thread is making me want to track down a Vertec and get my nerd on by sending it off to DS Grips and make it into a Samurai Edge...

[Clobbersaurus]

First mag (10 rounds) out of the Elite II. 25 yards freestyle, first shot DA. 124g LCW steel cased ammo.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03544_zps17de3bdc.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03544_zps17de3bdc.jpg.html)

Second mag, 7 yards.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03545_zpseb49ceaf.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03545_zpseb49ceaf.jpg.html)

Last 25 yard freestyle group, after 200 rounds of DA press-outs and controlled pairs. I need learn to shoot the dot with these sights, which I'm really not used to with my Glock.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03546_zps03d33050.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03546_zps03d33050.jpg.html)

[theJanitor]

the grail is for sale. I've bought a gun from the seller.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=427201768

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/427201000/427201768/pix343695430.jpg

[Lon]

I put a slightly used M9A1 Compact (stainless one) on layaway at my LGS. Thinking of sending it to WC or AGW down the road. Dang you people for putting these Beretta threads out there.

[GJM]

I have 350 +/- rounds through my WC 92A1 over two sessions. Not a single stoppage, as was to be expected. I absolutely love it -- especially how soft the pistol is having been dehorned by WC. I was hitting an 8 inch steel, support hand only at 50 yards, double action with it on demand, on Saturday. I shot one 7 yard Bill drill with it -- 1.93 clean with a .80 draw. I had three .80 draws in a row to an A zone at 5 yards with it from a BT open top holster. I can't say enough good things about it, except I want WC to make me a spare. For those that haven't messed with one lately, a Beretta 92 is an incredibly easy pistol to shoot well -- close and fast, or far and accurate.

[JTQ]

Anybody feel limited by the fixed front sight on the 92FS?

I can definitely see the advantage to the options available with the dovetailed front sight on the 92A1, but I'd rather not have the rail.

[HeadHunter]

Anybody feel limited by the fixed front sight on the 92FS?

I've been shooting my 92G Centurion in IDPA quite a bit lately. The night sights are 20 years old and useless so I covered the entire front sight with 3M reflective tape. The rear was replaced with a Brigadier rear to correct POI. For my eyes, that's a great combination. Only 2 people out of 63 had lower points down than I did at yesterday's match, which included part of the barricade stage of the IDPA Classifier. So, it doesn't seem limiting to me.

[GJM]

If you are interested, Wilson can mod your front sight to take a FO element. I think a Centurion with a FO front and CT laser grips a great carry combo.

[Lon]

If you are interested, Wilson can mod your front sight to take a FO element.

Answered a question I was going to ask. Thanks.

[JTQ]

If you are interested, Wilson can mod your front sight to take a FO element. I think a Centurion with a FO front and CT laser grips a great carry combo.
Yes I had seen that. The installation looks pretty slick and possibly a little more durable than the typical fiber optic. In addition, I think ToolTech will install tritium in the sights as well.

As a guy with a 1911 with a staked front sight (I have 3 white dots on my 1911 just like the 92FS), I often wonder if I'd actually prefer the fixed front sight of the Beretta 92FS since I wouldn't have to worry about it sheering off.

[Tamara]

Well if you don't do it, don't hold back and let some of us looking for Berettas in on the secret.

-Rob

It was in the showcase for $525 at Shooter's Outpost in Hooksett, NH, but it was gone when we went back, which is probably a good thing.

[SGT_Calle]

the grail is for sale. I've bought a gun from the seller.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=427201768

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/427201000/427201768/pix343695430.jpg

<90 minute drive to Chapin, SC..... Dangit.
So tempting.

[ffhounddog]

I've been shooting my 92G Centurion in IDPA quite a bit lately. The night sights are 20 years old and useless so I covered the entire front sight with 3M reflective tape. The rear was replaced with a Brigadier rear to correct POI. For my eyes, that's a great combination. Only 2 people out of 63 had lower points down than I did at yesterday's match, which included part of the barricade stage of the IDPA Classifier. So, it doesn't seem limiting to me.

Is this the rear with the two red dots?

[HeadHunter]

Is this the rear with the two red dots?

It had two white dots when I bought several from CDNN. I blacked them out with a Sharpie because I don't like dots, front or rear, at all.

[RevolverRob]

FYI - I have no association with these guys - Robertson Trading Post in Henderson, Tennessee, has four Beretta 92FS hanging out. They are Benton County Sheriff (Washington State) trade-ins, I picked up one for $434 shipped ($419 + 15 bucks shipping). I emailed with Andy and spoke on the phone with James, either will be happy to help, if anyone is looking for one.

[Crow Hunter]

FYI - I have no association with these guys - Robertson Trading Post in Henderson, Tennessee, has four Beretta 92FS hanging out. They are Benton County Sheriff (Washington State) trade-ins, I picked up one for $434 shipped ($419 + 15 bucks shipping). I emailed with Andy and spoke on the phone with James, either will be happy to help, if anyone is looking for one.

PM sent.

[s0nspark]

I went today to check out the Beretta selection at the local shop... I'm hankering for a Compact but not entirely sold just yet. Whatever I decide on will be shipped to Wilson Combat for the G conversion and other upgrades.

Anyway, I asked to look at a used Vertec in the case and the sales guy asked me what I was after. I told him my intentions and he launched into a tirade about how crap Berettas were, saying how he'd used them in combat and that he'd take a Tokarev over a Beretta any day. I... must have really hit a nerve with him. It was very uncomfortable.

[JonInWA]

I went today to check out the Beretta selection at the local shop... I'm hankering for a Compact but not entirely sold just yet. Whatever I decide on will be shipped to Wilson Combat for the G conversion and other upgrades.

Anyway, I asked to look at a used Vertec in the case and the sales guy asked me what I was after. I told him my intentions and he launched into a tirade about how crap Berettas were, saying how he'd used them in combat and that he'd take a Tokarev over a Beretta any day. I... must have really hit a nerve with him. It was very uncomfortable.

And let's hope that he was slightly more successful in combat than he apparently is as a salesperson....And more knowledgeable about what he's talking about...

Best, Jon

[TCinVA]

saying how he'd used them in combat

Riiiiiiiiiiiight.

[GJM]

No doubt a member of "Delta team six."

[warpedcamshaft]

I went today to check out the Beretta selection at the local shop... I'm hankering for a Compact but not entirely sold just yet. Whatever I decide on will be shipped to Wilson Combat for the G conversion and other upgrades.

Anyway, I asked to look at a used Vertec in the case and the sales guy asked me what I was after. I told him my intentions and he launched into a tirade about how crap Berettas were, saying how he'd used them in combat and that he'd take a Tokarev over a Beretta any day. I... must have really hit a nerve with him. It was very uncomfortable.

That right there... would have been enough for me to just walk away and order what I wanted online. (JG sales has used Beretta 92fs and 92 compacts listed for sale) Even if I had to pay more due to transfer fees...

I hate talking to gun shop employees... Many I have met have irritated me at a level where I can barely keep my mouth shut.

[s0nspark]

That right there... would have been enough for me to just walk away and order what I wanted online. Even if I had to pay more due to transfer fees...

I hate talking to gun shop employees... Many I have met have irritated me at a level where I can barely keep my mouth shut.

I know what you mean ... normally I can overlook the posturing and ignorance in order to find out what I need to know by getting hands on with something. This time, though...

To his credit he was able to readily point out the differences with the Vertec but that didn't make up for the rest! Besides, their price on this well-used gun was $600 which seemed rather high to me.

[Dagga Boy]

Being I have been essentially living on Army bases the last couple of months, I can understand the service members dislike of the Beretta. Everyone I have seen has been in atrocious physical condition, and being they are carried in the field without magazines in very bad weather, I can only imagine what the insides look like. Personally, the military either needs to be serious about arming its soldiers like soldiers and they carry loaded pistols regularly as a personal protection weapon with modern hollow-point ammunition, or dump them all together. But what is going on right now is stupid.

[JodyH]

What's the 92FS Compact empty weight with magazine?
Beretta's web site shows 896g, if so that's stupidly heavy.
Anyone have a dope scale they can weigh one for me?

[GardoneVT]

Being I have been essentially living on Army bases the last couple of months, I can understand the service members dislike of the Beretta. Everyone I have seen has been in atrocious physical condition, and being they are carried in the field without magazines in very bad weather, I can only imagine what the insides look like. Personally, the military either needs to be serious about arming its soldiers like soldiers and they carry loaded pistols regularly as a personal protection weapon with modern hollow-point ammunition, or dump them all together. But what is going on right now is stupid.

Nyeti, this is the new and enlightened military. Loaded weapons might offend the enemy, and dead combatants look bad on CNN. /sarcasm.

May god help us if a national army who knows their kitten attacks us.

[MSparks909]

Nyeti, this is the new and enlightened military. Loaded weapons might offend the enemy, and dead combatants look bad on CNN. /sarcasm.

May god help us if a national army who knows their kitten attacks us.

May God help them. At least in my area. I think there's more guns per square mile than people. On another note, I'm attending a local auction for a sporting goods store that went bankrupt. Many guns are being auctioned off, including several NIB 92FS's. I'd rather have a 92A1 but if I can score a 92FS dirt cheap I will.

[SteveB]

What's the 92FS Compact empty weight with magazine?
Beretta's web site shows 896g, if so that's stupidly heavy.
Anyone have a dope scale they can weigh one for me?

1 lb 15.5 oz. M9A1 Compact

[s0nspark]

Given that the Compact is not reeeally a compact pistol, would I be better off sticking with a full size M9A1? Does the Compact offer or sacrifice anything non-obvious to a first-time Beretta owner?

I *might* carry this pistol AIWB at some point as an alternative to my CZ PCR but primarily this will be for HD or maybe bugout bag duty... Thoughts?

[SteveB]

Given that the Compact is not reeeally a compact pistol, would I be better off sticking with a full size M9A1? Does the Compact offer or sacrifice anything non-obvious to a first-time Beretta owner?

I *might* carry this pistol AIWB at some point as an alternative to my CZ PCR but primarily this will be for HD or maybe bugout bag duty... Thoughts?

For primarily off-body use, I would choose a full-sized pistol.

[DGI]

Beretta 92/M9 pistols actually fit my oversized hands very well. With a "speed bump" trigger and a D spring, they are actually a joy to shoot in DA and SA and they look alot better than all the plastic fantastic handguns out on the market.

I would not give up my Glock 19 as my daily CCW for a 92/M9... but I do have a SME on the way for the Berettas. With a couple smart modifications, it may be a viable daily carry option.

[GardoneVT]

Beretta 92/M9 pistols actually fit my oversized hands very well. With a "speed bump" trigger and a D spring, they are actually a joy to shoot in DA and SA and they look alot better than all the plastic fantastic handguns out on the market.

I would not give up my Glock 19 as my daily CCW for a 92/M9... but I do have a SME on the way for the Berettas. With a couple smart modifications, it may be a viable daily carry option.

When did you get a G19, Sgt. Riggs?

[DGI]

2467

I bought a Hi Power recently as well :cool:

[Tamara]

I hate talking to gun shop employees...

Believe me, your fellow patrons are no fount of clue, either, dude.

[jetfire]

Believe me, your fellow patrons are no fount of clue, either, dude.

I love talking to the employees at Scheels, our local big sporting goods store. For the non-plains folk, Scheels is like a Dicks that sells handguns and has 500 round bricks of .22 LR for 30 bucks. For Midwestern folk, it's like Gander Mountain with more Under Armour.

But anyway, the employees are great because none of them knows a damn thing about guns but they are REALLY. Enthusiastic about saying or doing whatever it takes to get me to buy whatever gun I want. I appreciate good salesmanship, and enthusiast goes a long way. Sure, I could sneer at their ignorance...but I could also read the archives on Gun Nuts and remember there was a time when I thought the Taurus Tracker was the god-king of .357 Magnum revolvers. Those kids at the gun shop are lucky their person derp isn't on the internet for all of eternity.

[Drifting Fate]

There was once a near-mythical land whence I worked at a gun store where the derps behind the counter were true experts and taught me an amazing amount of stuff from hunting rifles, to black powder, to reloading (I was the pistol guy.) Sadly, the family let this land go to pot and I've never seen the likes since, while the stupidity on both sides of the counter is amazing.

Every once in awhile someone, on either side, surprises you and it's a ray of sunshine.

[fixer]

I love talking to the employees at Scheels, our local big sporting goods store. For the non-plains folk, Scheels is like a Dicks that sells handguns and has 500 round bricks of .22 LR for 30 bucks. For Midwestern folk, it's like Gander Mountain with more Under Armour.
.

I've been to the Scheels in the Minot mall. I was impressed that there was a gun store in the mall. I was also impressed at the selection given my visit was in the winter of 2013 when the gun panic was in its crescendo. I suppose -30 and blizzards keeps people from panic-buying pistols.

[GardoneVT]

I love talking to the employees at Scheels, our local big sporting goods store. For the non-plains folk, Scheels is like a Dicks that sells handguns and has 500 round bricks of .22 LR for 30 bucks. For Midwestern folk, it's like Gander Mountain with more Under Armour.

But anyway, the employees are great because none of them knows a damn thing about guns but they are REALLY. Enthusiastic about saying or doing whatever it takes to get me to buy whatever gun I want. I appreciate good salesmanship, and enthusiast goes a long way. Sure, I could sneer at their ignorance...but I could also read the archives on Gun Nuts and remember there was a time when I thought the Taurus Tracker was the god-king of .357 Magnum revolvers. Those kids at the gun shop are lucky their person derp isn't on the internet for all of eternity.

I've been to that store since their renovation. Lotsa good guys in there, but they've got baaaad Intel on this whole handgun thing. If they put someone in charge with some knowledge, that place would be a great shop.

[JHC]

There was once a near-mythical land whence I worked at a gun store where the derps behind the counter were true experts and taught me an amazing amount of stuff from hunting rifles, to black powder, to reloading (I was the pistol guy.) Sadly, the family let this land go to pot and I've never seen the likes since, while the stupidity on both sides of the counter is amazing.

Every once in awhile someone, on either side, surprises you and it's a ray of sunshine.

LOL! There is just a xanadu today. It is in Dawsonville, GA.

[Trooper224]

The range where I do my indoor shooting also has the prerequisite gun shop attached. They aren't the cheapest in town but I do most of my business there. This is primarily because everyone working behind the counter knows what they're talking about, something very rare these days. Most of the employees are half my age but refreshingly well informed on the products they're selling and there's a complete absence of mall ninjas and tactards. Their gun smith on the other hand is a completely incompetent crook of the highest order. Unfortunately he's an old buddy of the owner, so he kind of exists off in his corner office without a lot of customers. On the other hand, a new mecca for the mall ninja just opened downtown. If you want to hit the range looking like you're HALO jumping into Fallujah, or serve as a product placement for Magpul then that's the place for you. They've got every variant of the AK sold by Century Arms up on the wall and I've never seen more flat dark earth velcro geedunk in one place. I spent five minutes in the place and the only impression I got from the three employees present was that I needed to check for wants and warrants.

[warpedcamshaft]

Believe me, your fellow patrons are no fount of clue, either, dude.

Yeah... good point.

[HeadHunter]

My LGS got in one of the WC customized Berettas. That's a nice pistol. I wish the grips were checkered all the way up, though.

I really appreciated the low profile safety. Earlier today, I was shooting the Swiss Concealed Weapons Permit Qualification Course. It requires a chamber empty start, 9x. Plus I did some additional runs to quantify the time loss associated with Chamber empty carry. The safety on my Centurion really made my fingers sore after a few runs.

[GJM]

Wilson Combat dehorned the slide, frame and controls on the 92A1 they recently did for me. Previously, the safety hurt my fingers on fast chamber empty starts, similar to the wings on the new VP9. Now, working the slide on chamber empty starts is a non-issue.

[LHS]

I took a black rhino and a common draft horse, and made a unicorn.

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h103/LordHeadshot/M9A1GCompact_zpsd9904894.jpg

[s0nspark]

I took a black rhino and a common draft horse, and made a unicorn.

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h103/LordHeadshot/M9A1GCompact_zpsd9904894.jpg

SWEEEET :)

[GJM]

Bill Wilson sent me an email earlier today, saying the 92 out shoots EVERY striker gun that exists. I agree with him.

[Clobbersaurus]

I liking my time with my Beretta. I'm getting used to the DA pull and I really, really, like the reload speeds compared to my Glock.

I did have an issue when dry firing my Elite today though. I had just finished my wall drill and I usually end up that part of my dry fire routine with ten DA presses as fast as I can pull the trigger. I really focus on the front sight, trying my best not to let it move. Anyway, I get about 5 presses in and the trigger goes dead. I thought maybe I broken a trigger spring but I couldn't push the trigger forward to reset. So I popped the mag, ejected the snap cap and popped new mag in. Worked fine after that, including lots and lots of DA pulls. I popped the slide off and everything looks normal.

I'm not sure if I should include this as a malfunction on the 2000 challenge, it didn't happen during firing. I did change out the grips a few nights back but I fail to see how that would affect anything...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/b66019d4-b524-43f5-8d3e-ed963b552819_zps579ae1c8.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/b66019d4-b524-43f5-8d3e-ed963b552819_zps579ae1c8.jpg.html)

[Seven_Sicks_Two]

I recently passed on a Beretta 92D Centurion at $350. All this Beretta talk lately is kinda making me wish I hadn't. :(

[jetfire]

I liking my time with my Beretta. I'm getting used to the DA pull and I really, really, like the reload speeds compared to my Glock.

I did have an issue when dry firing my Elite today though. I had just finished my wall drill and I usually end up that part of my dry fire routine with ten DA presses as fast as I can pull the trigger. I really focus on the front sight, trying my best not to let it move. Anyway, I get about 5 presses in and the trigger goes dead. I thought maybe I broken a trigger spring but I couldn't push the trigger forward to reset. So I popped the mag, ejected the snap cap and popped new mag in. Worked fine after that, including lots and lots of DA pulls. I popped the slide off and everything looks normal.

I'm not sure if I should include this as a malfunction on the 2000 challenge, it didn't happen during firing. I did change out the grips a few nights back but I fail to see how that would affect anything...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/b66019d4-b524-43f5-8d3e-ed963b552819_zps579ae1c8.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/b66019d4-b524-43f5-8d3e-ed963b552819_zps579ae1c8.jpg.html)

What kind of snap cap? I've had caps accidentally trap the firing pin in the void where a primer would go resulting in just the sort of thing you mention.

[Clobbersaurus]

What kind of snap cap? I've had caps accidentally trap the firing pin in the void where a primer would go resulting in just the sort of thing you mention.

Interesting, it was a very well worn A-ZOOM. Thanks for the info. I've been meaning to pick up some replacements, as my current set is probably way past their shelf life.

[s0nspark]

I did change out the grips a few nights back but I fail to see how that would affect anything...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/b66019d4-b524-43f5-8d3e-ed963b552819_zps579ae1c8.jpg

What grips are those? They look... grippy :)

[JHC]

Bill Wilson sent me an email earlier today, saying the 92 out shoots EVERY striker gun that exists. I agree with him.

How long you think before there is a factory compact G model available again? ;)

[okie john]

Bill Wilson sent me an email earlier today, saying the 92 out shoots EVERY striker gun that exists.

The Berettas we had when I was on active duty struck me as being accurate, but I hadn't fired one since 1991. Then, a couple of weekends ago, a guy at the range asked me to test-fire his. At 50 yards, it put three rounds of 9MS into an inch and a half.

Hmmmm. I may need to get one of these.


Okie John

[rob_s]

Seems everywhere I look (slight exaggeration), folks are talking about Beretta pistols. I see an Elite II going for crazy prices on GunBroker, and lots of mention of this new 92FS Compact.

What gives?

Hipsters.

and Millenials

wait...

those are probably mostly the same thing.

This generation of 20-somethings is weird. Every generation before their parents resisted change and innovation. Today's "kids" are the first to be born toa generation that embraces change and "new hotness". That leaves the rebellious whelps with a dilemma. The answer? Go back to whatever came before whatever their parents are currently doing. With no depth or history to their knowledge, they don't know why the world moved on, and since results don't matter (yay, standardized testing!) they don't really care.

Look at music, motorcycles, cars, guns, hobbies.. it's all the same. They just want whatever the people before them aren't using or already threw away or stopped doing. Once enough of them adopt a thing, it almost starts to seem normal, or like a good idea, and it starts to spread. Then the parents start doing it, because the parents get confused and think it's the new hotness, and ruin it for the kids, who then have to go find the old-old-busted to co-opt.

I'm pretty certain there will be a resurgence of 1911s and brown leather by the end of the decade.

Oh, wait...
http://soldiersystems.net/2014/07/29/wolf-wind-leatherworks-wolf-equipment-belt/

[Jared]

I'm pretty certain there will be a resurgence of 1911s and brown leather by the end of the decade.

/[/url]


Will that hurt you in some way?

[jetfire]

Interesting, it was a very well worn A-ZOOM. Thanks for the info. I've been meaning to pick up some replacements, as my current set is probably way past their shelf life.

Mine was with a dummy round purchased from Brownells, but I'd imagine if the plastic "primer" on the a-zoom got worn enough it could do it.

[Clobbersaurus]

Mine was with a dummy round purchased from Brownells, but I'd imagine if the plastic "primer" on the a-zoom got worn enough it could do it.

Again, thanks for the heads up. Checked my snap caps after dry fire tonight, and found this....

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03572_zps26eca93b.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03572_zps26eca93b.jpg.html)

[jetfire]

Again, thanks for the heads up. Checked my snap caps after dry fire tonight, and found this....

http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03572_zps26eca93b.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03572_zps26eca93b.jpg.html)

That would probably do it!

[Clobbersaurus]

What grips are those? They look... grippy :)

Sorry, I missed your post. They are just Beretta factory grips that I stippled. They are very grippy, to the point I had to sand the edges down where the web of my hand makes contact. You wouldn't want to use these if your preferred carry method put the grips in close contact to any part of your body.

[Clobbersaurus]

Hipsters.

and Millenials

wait...

those are probably mostly the same thing.


Based on your post I've started growing a neckbeard, and have ordered a set of those thick rimmed glasses, just for range use.

[s0nspark]

Sorry, I missed your post. They are just Beretta factory grips that I stippled. They are very grippy, to the point I had to sand the edges down where the web of my hand makes contact. You wouldn't want to use these if your preferred carry method put the grips in close contact to any part of your body.


Cool - nice work!

[Lon]

So I picked this up today:

http://i108.photobucket.com/albums/n5/xpd54/6E6639BB-C87F-4CDC-AEEF-411B88BF29C4_zpsgiewr9yj.jpg

Now to have some work done to it. Probably gonna send it to Josh at AGW for some trigger work and to have the hammer bobbed like a D model. Then to Bill Riehl for his metal treatment.

Anyone wanna trade grips for a set of Beretta plastics? Wood makes it too fat in the grip for my taste.

[Clobbersaurus]

I had 2 failure to feeds with my Elite II today:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03575_zps2968c013.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03575_zps2968c013.jpg.html)

In my previous range session I noted that one mag would feed a little slower than the rest when the slide release was depressed from slide lock. It was the same mag that caused the 2 FTF's today. I stopped using the offending mag and had no other problems. When I get some time I'll look into it more, but I'm fairly confident it's a mag issue.

I shot a 48 on dot torture at three yards. I'm confident with a little more trigger time in I'll be able to clean it and move on to 5 yards. So far I have 535rds through it. The new grips worked great as did the three new Mec Gar mags. I was able to pick up a Blade -Tech holster for it. It's a decent OWB holster for the money.
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03576_zps230d4cb1.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03576_zps230d4cb1.jpg.html)

[GJM]

Is the pistol well lubed? Beretta 92 pistols seem to thrive on lube.

[Clobbersaurus]

Is the pistol well lubed? Beretta 92 pistols seem to thrive on lube.

It was very well lubed, but I'm in the middle of a 2000 rnd challenge, so it hasn't been lubed in over 500 rnds.

[Serpico1985]

I'm 860 rounds into my 92a1. Within that time I've already quickly surpassed my performance with my previous training gun a gen 4 17. So far the high point has been cleaning Dot torture at 7 yards on first attempt, something I attempted with the 17 on a few occasions and never got close to:

http://i59.tinypic.com/2vir2ph.jpg

This gun is just shoot-able plain and simple. The only area that the G17 has an edge in is drills like the Bill Drill for me where your maxing out speed. But I’m hoping to close that gap with more work.

[LHS]

I took a black rhino and a common draft horse, and made a unicorn.

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h103/LordHeadshot/M9A1GCompact_zpsd9904894.jpg

I took the Unicorn out to the local club match on Sunday, and it ran like a scalded-kitten ape. It shoots every bit as well as my Elite. I noticed no discernible difference in accuracy or speed, and while the DA trigger (factory, but with a D spring) isn't quite as nice as my LTT-tweaked Elite, it wasn't a hindrance. The match was only 30 total rounds, so it's nowhere near a definitive reliability test, but I made it out with only a single point down. This gun just plain works for me. It's what Beretta should be making right now.

[JSGlock34]

Seemed appropriate to link this here. I had the opportunity to train with Ernie recently (AAR from a prior Advanced Class here (http://pistol-forum.com/showthread.php?1065-AAR-Ernest-Langdon-Advanced-Pistol-Class-21-22-August-2010-Culpeper-VA)) and he mentioned that Beretta would be marking the 30th anniversary of the adoption of the M9. He was kind enough to let me put a few rounds through his custom Wilson/Beretta M9A1, which is a fantastic pistol, and making me think way too much about acquiring another Beretta for the safe. Regardless of what pistol you favor, it is well worth your time to train with Ernie, but I can't think of anyone more knowledgeable on the Beretta 92 in particular.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rIwW0uMCGJI

2517
Photo by Arclight

[Jeep]

Nice video. Personally, I'm a bit ambivalent about the M9. I have smallish hands and thus--like a lot of users--think it should have an option for a smaller grip. More importantly, the stock double action trigger pull (at 12+, and sometimes 14+ pounds) is ridiculous. They ought to put D springs in all of them, along with better trigger springs. The improvement would be immediate. Then if they could find a way to reduce the trigger stacking at the end of the pull, they would have a very nice pistol in my view. With current stock guns, though, I'd take a Sig 226 every time over an M9--and would vastly prefer a Glock 17/19.

In other words, I think that the M9 is much less of a weapon than it could be with only a few tweaks.

[Clobbersaurus]

^^ I think it's important to remember what the M9 was designed for.

A shooting enthusiast can make the M9 into something special by having some light modifications done. But then it's not an M9.

[JTQ]

With current stock guns, though, I'd take a Sig 226 every time over an M9--and would vastly prefer a Glock 17/19.

In other words, I think that the M9 is much less of a weapon than it could be with only a few tweaks.
I've been making the rounds at the gun stores/shows handling a bunch of guns looking for a full size 9MM. I've found the Beretta 92FS to be surprisingly "small hand friendly". I don't know if you handled current production Beretta's, but the models with the indentation on the backstrap (I believe all the 92FS and 92A1's at least, though I don't think the M9 models have the mod) make a big difference. I find these Beretta's more small hand friendly than the SIG P226 with standard grips (the E2 may be different) and I believe the trigger reach is shorter than on a G17 including the Gen 4 models. While I do find the Beretta grip chunky, the controls are reachable.

[GJM]

I really like the 226, but I find the Beretta 92 to be easier to shoot well. That opinion is shared by Bill Wilson, Bill Rogers and Ernest Langdon.

[Jeep]

I've been making the rounds at the gun stores/shows handling a bunch of guns looking for a full size 9MM. I've found the Beretta 92FS to be surprisingly "small hand friendly". I don't know if you handled current production Beretta's, but the models with the indentation on the backstrap (I believe all the 92FS and 92A1's at least, though I don't think the M9 models have the mod) make a big difference. I find these Beretta's more small hand friendly than the SIG P226 with standard grips (the E2 may be different) and I believe the trigger reach is shorter than on a G17 including the Gen 4 models. While I do find the Beretta grip chunky, the controls are reachable.

JTQ: Thanks for the advice. I will have to try the 92A1 and see how it fits. I found the standard 226 to be almost as chunky as the M9, but I put E2 grips on it, which completely eliminated the issue.

[Jeep]

I really like the 226, but I find the Beretta 92 to be easier to shoot well. That opinion is shared by Bill Wilson, Bill Rogers and Ernest Langdon.

GJM: I look at it from two aspects. First as an old soldier I try to consider how it works for soldiers who get maybe 50 rounds per year to familiarize/qualify with. I think the grip size is a problem not only for women soldiers but probably about 40% of the men as well. My hands are smallish, but not tiny, and I had to work to get a good grip (I've since installed Wilson's shorter reach trigger, which helps). In addition, the very heavy double action trigger pull is hard for inexperienced shooters to master, and I think it is unnecessary. Putting a D spring in the military's M9's would create a more user-friendly weapon (and I think pistols need to be user friendly because you never use them in the service except when you really need them).

As a civilian shooter, I also dislike the trigger stacking. I have a Wolff trigger spring in mine, which cuts stacking some, but I wish I could get rid of it entirely.

I am also not surprised that you, Wilson, Rogers and Langdon all like the M9. It is an inherently accurate design (because of the falling locking block), and you are all far better shots than I am. In addition, I think it really shines as a multiple-shot platform. You might remember during World War II the RAF pilots loved the Spitfire and a fast, maneuverable, fighter. Many however, preferred the older Hurricane. It wasn't as fast or nimble but it shone as a gun platform--it wouldn't shake nearly as much as the Spitfire and thus could deliver a long burst of fire far more accurately.

I think the same of the M9. It's weight and design allow it to fire multiple shots more accurately (in my experience at least) than a Glock or even a 226, which is pretty good at that also.

So I by no means hate the M9. There are a lot of things to like about it. It does frustrate me, though, because while it has a lot of excellent attributes, I think it could be a far better weapon with just a bit of work on Beretta's part and I don't think that those modifications would cost a lot.

[GJM]

One consideration -- where in recent years Glock, the M&P and Sig have suffered from reliability and it functional issues, Beretta seems to have managed to maintain their quality with the 92 series.

My comments as to shootability apply to enthusiast shooters, with a properly set up 92. For LCD use, it is hard to beat a current manufacture, G4 Glock 17.

[EVP]

GJM just curious but what does LCD mean?

Also have you or anyone tried concealing the 92 AIWB? The 92 just seems beasty to me.

[LSP972]

One consideration -- where in recent years Glock, the M&P and Sig have suffered from reliability and it functional issues, Beretta seems to have managed to maintain their quality with the 92 series.

.

Agreed... but what about the locking block "issue"? To wit... the conventional wisdom that says this part WILL fail, sooner probably than later? I have no dog in that hunt, because our pair of 92s are strictly range toys. I ask because both would be pressed into service should The Revolution/zombie apocalypse/EMP attack/choose-your-disaster-scenario come to pass.

.

[Crow Hunter]

One consideration -- where in recent years Glock, the M&P and Sig have suffered from reliability and it functional issues, Beretta seems to have managed to maintain their quality with the 92 series.

My comments as to shootability apply to enthusiast shooters, with a properly set up 92. For LCD use, it is hard to beat a current manufacture, G4 Glock 17.

Is/was it because of higher quality or lower expectations?

If you listen to "everyone" Glocks are perfect and they never malfunction and will go 100,000 rounds without even cleaning and will shoot underwater. Beretta's on the other hand are pieces of junk than only won the pistol trial because they were the lowest bidder.

So your average person going in has a minor issue with a Glock and freaks out running all over the internet telling everyone about it on how their quality has dropped and only some Glock that was around before the Obama buying frenzy will be worth owning because no one had problems then. Same person buys a Beretta and has a minor problem with it. Well, it's a Beretta.:o

Not saying you are wrong, just looking at it from a different perspective.;)

[GJM]

GJM just curious but what does LCD mean?

Also have you or anyone tried concealing the 92 AIWB? The 92 just seems beasty to me.

LCD, lowest common denominator.

I have a new appendix holster from Tony at JM for my 92A1, and it is very comfortable. Also have a JM for my Centurion. Both are suitable for all day wear. Ernest Langdon wore a JM appendix, for his M9A1 lower/Vertec upper, when he arrived at the recent class I attended from him. The 92 grip is shorter than a 226, closer to a 229


Agreed... but what about the locking block "issue"? To wit... the conventional wisdom that says this part WILL fail, sooner probably than later? I have no dog in that hunt, because our pair of 92s are strictly range toys. I ask because both would be pressed into service should The Revolution/zombie apocalypse/EMP attack/choose-your-disaster-scenario come to pass.

.

Beretta has continued to improve their locking blocks and trigger return springs. Bill Wilson and Ernest Langdon commented that between them, with well more than 100,000 Beretta 92 rounds fired, collectively they had broken one trigger return spring and zero locking blocks. In any event, both the locking block and trigger return springs are modestly priced, as part of PM.

YVK just passed 8,000 rounds through his Elite II, purchased used, and has not had a single stoppage (or broken part), and is yet to clean the pistol.

[Malamute]

What degree of accuracy (group size) can be expected of the Berettas?

[Clay]

GJM just curious but what does LCD mean?

Also have you or anyone tried concealing the 92 AIWB? The 92 just seems beasty to me.

I carry a 92FS in a Kramer #2 IWB. No problems.

Sent from my SCH-S738C using Tapatalk

[GJM]

What degree of accuracy (group size) can be expected of the Berettas?


Good shooter, good ammo -- sub five inches at 50. The 92 is my favorite service pistol for shooting 50-100 yard steel.

[JTQ]

I carry a 92FS in a Kramer #2 IWB. No problems.

Sent from my SCH-S738C using Tapatalk
Is that Appendix IWB?

Also have you or anyone tried concealing the 92 AIWB?

I've been intrigued by Kramer's products, as I've read lots of posts on a variety of forum about how their 10+ year old Kramer is as good as the day they bought it. On the other hand, most of those posts have come from guys that bought their Kramer's a long time ago. Not as many posts from guys with recent buying experiences. I've wondered if the current product is as good as the old stuff.

[LSP972]

Beretta has continued to improve their locking blocks and trigger return springs. Bill Wilson and Ernest Langdon commented that between them, with well more than 100,000 Beretta 92 rounds fired, collectively they had broken one trigger return spring and zero locking blocks.



That's encouraging.

My grandson failed to notice a squib once, fired another round right behind it, and bulged the hell out of the barrel midway between the muzzle and breech face. We didn't even realize it until I got home and went to clean the pistol. It never missed a beat.

Intrigued, I went back to the range and put another 100 rounds through it. Not only did it work, accuracy was NOT affected. Color me impressed.

I bought a new barrel/locking block assembly as a matter of course, but still have the bulged one. And I'll wager large that if I dropped it into one of the two pistols we have, right now, it would function fine.

It has always been a bit too large for my hand; but if they offered a Centurion-sized model with the "G" decocker, shorter-reach trigger, and thinner stocks, I'd buy one just because. I realize you can have those mods done to existing pistols, but I don't want one bad enough to expend the time and resources to have it done.

.

[Trooper224]

GJM: In addition, I think it really shines as a multiple-shot platform. You might remember during World War II the RAF pilots loved the Spitfire and a fast, maneuverable, fighter. Many however, preferred the older Hurricane. It wasn't as fast or nimble but it shone as a gun platform--it wouldn't shake nearly as much as the Spitfire and thus could deliver a long burst of fire far more accurately.

I think the same of the M9. It's weight and design allow it to fire multiple shots more accurately (in my experience at least) than a Glock or even a 226, which is pretty good at that also.

This is one of my favorite things about the 92. This summer I've been shooting my 92FS to the exclusion of just about everything else. It's ability to put a lot of rounds on target, both quickly and accurately, has impressed me. A couple of weeks ago I took one of my 1911's to the range and worked with it after I'd finished with the Beretta. The difference shouldn't have surprised me but it honestly did. I've been carrying it in a strongside IWB holster under either a polo or a t-shirt without a problem. After nearly six thousand rounds fired since April without a malfunction, The 92FS is on the verge of becoming my favorite handgun over the 1911 and that's really saying something.

[YVK]

What degree of accuracy (group size) can be expected of the Berettas?

Word on the street is about 6 inches at 50 yards from Beretta Elite and its factory match barrel.

[Clay]

Is that Appendix IWB?


I've been intrigued by Kramer's products, as I've read lots of posts on a variety of forum about how their 10+ year old Kramer is as good as the day they bought it. On the other hand, most of those posts have come from guys that bought their Kramer's a long time ago. Not as many posts from guys with recent buying experiences. I've wondered if the current product is as good as the old stuff.

No AIWB. Greg doesn't make any appendix stuff. My #2 for the 92 is less than a month old. It is identical in workmanship and materials to the #3 I had ten years ago for a Glock.

[Clay]

I just installed a Wilson short reach trigger in my 92FS. Does anyone else that has this trigger notice side-to-side play? I assume this is normal? Honestly I never checked the factory trigger so this may be perfectly normal. It is my only 92, and I'm too lazy to put the factory trigger back in and compare it. It functions fine, and feels quite a bit different than stock. It has a much flatter face. Overall it is very nice, and certainly an upgrade over the stock plastic/metal contraption.

[Jeep]

One consideration -- where in recent years Glock, the M&P and Sig have suffered from reliability and it functional issues, Beretta seems to have managed to maintain their quality with the 92 series.

My comments as to shootability apply to enthusiast shooters, with a properly set up 92. For LCD use, it is hard to beat a current manufacture, G4 Glock 17.

GJM: Good points. How do you deal with the trigger stacking in the double action pull?

[GJM]

GJM: Good points. How do you deal with the trigger stacking in the double action pull?
I saw your trigger stacking comment before and was perplexed. My Wilson 92A1 has the best DA trigger of any DA/SA pistol (CZ, Sig, HK) I own. Not lightest in weight, just best feel. I sometimes decock to make a difficult shot, especially one hand, I like it so much.

I might start by replacing that Wolff thingee and putting a current production trigger return spring in.

[Lon]

I saw your trigger stacking comment before and was perplexed. My Wilson 92A1 has the best DA trigger of any DA/SA pistol (CZ, Sig, HK) I own. Not lightest in weight, just best feel.....

I might start by replacing that Wolff thingee and putting a current production trigger return spring in.

This. My 92A1 has an incredible trigger. No stacking at all.

[Serpico1985]

Just got a JM AIWB for my 92a1. As someone mentioned it does very well AIWB due to the relatively sort grip (think 229) combined with a longer slide/barrel the gun stays tucked in well. For me it conceals better than a G17 appendix.

[s0nspark]

This thread is gonna make me do something my wallet will not like :-/

If I could get grip panels that were "right" I think I'd really like a 92A1.

[GardoneVT]

This thread is gonna make me do something my wallet will not like :-/

If I could get grip panels that were "right" I think I'd really like a 92A1.

I hear the Vertec grip panels are a nice way to slim it down.

Just one word of casual advice to readers-run far away from the older all silver Stainless models, especially if it's used. The new ones with black parts should be safe.

[JV_]

run far away from the older all silver Stainless modelsOther than getting one of the bad extractors (heat treat issues), why?

[GardoneVT]

Other than getting one of the bad extractors (heat treat issues), why?

I thought it was a bad extractor, so I switched it and the spring with a factory new part and changed the recoil spring too. Regrettably that simply reduced the malfunctions from Failure to Eject every magazine to twice every hundred rounds-which is abysmal compared to the blued 92FS which is still running with zero FTEs in over 2500 rounds . Whatever afflicted that pistol went beyond just the extractor.

[JV_]

If the extractor chips or goes bad, replace it with a blued one. I know of no larger systemic issues with an all stainless 92.

You got a bad one, plenty of folks have gotten good ones, including myself.

[Lon]

This thread is gonna make me do something my wallet will not like :-/

If I could get grip panels that were "right" I think I'd really like a 92A1.

This. I put the vertec grips and a short trigger in and it rocks. Even with my small/medium size hands.

[Jeep]

I saw your trigger stacking comment before and was perplexed. My Wilson 92A1 has the best DA trigger of any DA/SA pistol (CZ, Sig, HK) I own. Not lightest in weight, just best feel. I sometimes decock to make a difficult shot, especially one hand, I like it so much.

I might start by replacing that Wolff thingee and putting a current production trigger return spring in.

Now that is interesting. I have a perhaps three-year-old M9. It had trigger stacking with the production trigger return spring, which was reduced, but not eliminated, by the Wolff spring. You can even see the trigger stacking with a trigger pull gauge. The pull weight slightly increases towards the end, get lighter, and then increases again just before the break. It reminds me of some of the poorer specimens of Colt revolvers. Other M9's I've shot seemed to have similar stacking.

I will have to check out a 92A1 and see how that feels. I had just assumed that stacking was a Beretta trait--but apparently not. I find it annoying because, generally speaking, I prefer DA to SA trigger pulls so long as they are smooth.

[Trooper224]

I haven't experienced any stacking with the trigger on my 92FS, either with the original trigger return spring or the Wolff TCU. In fact, one of the things I like most about it is the similarity to a good S&W revolver DA trigger.

[Jeep]

I haven't experienced any stacking with the trigger on my 92FS, either with the original trigger return spring or the Wolff TCU. In fact, one of the things I like most about it is the similarity to a good S&W revolver DA trigger.

That is exactly what I am looking for--a smooth, S&W-like, DA trigger. Sounds like they are certainly out there. I just don't have one, which means that I need to look. As I noted above, there is a lot to like with the Beretta.

[GJM]

Now that is interesting. I have a perhaps three-year-old M9. It had trigger stacking with the production trigger return spring, which was reduced, but not eliminated, by the Wolff spring. You can even see the trigger stacking with a trigger pull gauge. The pull weight slightly increases towards the end, get lighter, and then increases again just before the break. It reminds me of some of the poorer specimens of Colt revolvers. Other M9's I've shot seemed to have similar stacking.

I will have to check out a 92A1 and see how that feels. I had just assumed that stacking was a Beretta trait--but apparently not. I find it annoying because, generally speaking, I prefer DA to SA trigger pulls so long as they are smooth.

I bet Wilson Combat, Josh at Allegheny or Dave Olhasso can fix the trigger pull on your Beretta.

[Jeep]

I bet Wilson Combat, Josh at Allegheny or Dave Olhasso can fix the trigger pull on your Beretta.

That is probably even a better idea!

[Clobbersaurus]

I have 760 rounds through the Elite II. Since I've binned the problem mag I've had no other issues. I got my support hand thumb a little higher than I should have on some speed drills today and managed to flay off some skin with the forward serrations. The blood will have to stay on the gun until I finish the 2000 round challenge. :)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03630_zps270423d8.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03630_zps270423d8.jpg.html)
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/a4e1ab5e-9c7a-4440-b78e-72998c832c08_zpsaaee894b.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/a4e1ab5e-9c7a-4440-b78e-72998c832c08_zpsaaee894b.jpg.html)

[GJM]

Nope, throwing a penalty flag. Where blood is acceptable on a M9, maybe even a. 92G-SD, it is a not permitted on an Elite I or II.

[Clobbersaurus]

LOL! Yeah it pains me too, but 2K challenge rules are quite clear! Besides, it will be a reminder to me to stop being a dumb kitten with my grip.

[Jeep]

LOL! Yeah it pains me too, but 2K challenge rules are quite clear! Besides, it will be a reminder to me to stop being a dumb kitten with my grip.

I thought that an unwritten footnote to the rules clearly allows the removal of exterior bio-hazard stains that have nothing to do with the functioning of the pistol. After all, OSHA would be very unhappy if you potentially expose others to your Ebola. Besides, as GJM points out, it is an Elite, and therefore is clearly subject to a separate interpretative footnote to the rules that also forbids it from being run with blood on the slide.

[Clobbersaurus]

Alright, alright, I cleaned off my Ebola. But only because GJM is probably scouring gun broker right now looking to rescue Beretta Elite's from abusers like myself.

I have to say, dried blood is very hard to get off stainless steel and anodized aluminum. I thought it would rub right off with a little bit of G96. Nope. I had to get out the brass brush. I had to scrub the frame repeatedly with toothbrushes and finally my finger nail.....
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03632_zps0c0b434e.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03632_zps0c0b434e.jpg.html)

I had to use a brass brush on the slide:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/ee7ce689-d9ee-4a26-adf1-32537e2c66fb_zpsc7d6bec0.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/ee7ce689-d9ee-4a26-adf1-32537e2c66fb_zpsc7d6bec0.jpg.html)

There, all DNA removed! I made sure not to let any lube seep anywhere it might help function...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/8bf8f7de-cce9-4c95-8bc0-87816bb1c6c9_zps3695ed6a.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/8bf8f7de-cce9-4c95-8bc0-87816bb1c6c9_zps3695ed6a.jpg.html)

[LHS]

And the gunternet is now mollified.


Alright, alright, I cleaned off my Ebola. But only because GJM is probably scouring gun broker right now looking to rescue Beretta Elite's from abusers like myself.

I have to say, dried blood is very hard to get off stainless steel and anodized aluminum. I thought it would rub right off with a little bit of G96. Nope. I had to get out the brass brush. I had to scrub the frame repeatedly with toothbrushes and finally my finger nail.....
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/DSC03632_zps0c0b434e.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/DSC03632_zps0c0b434e.jpg.html)

I had to use a brass brush on the slide:
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/ee7ce689-d9ee-4a26-adf1-32537e2c66fb_zpsc7d6bec0.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/ee7ce689-d9ee-4a26-adf1-32537e2c66fb_zpsc7d6bec0.jpg.html)

There, all DNA removed! I made sure not to let any lube seep anywhere it might help function...
http://i143.photobucket.com/albums/r151/clobbersauras/8bf8f7de-cce9-4c95-8bc0-87816bb1c6c9_zps3695ed6a.jpg (http://s143.photobucket.com/user/clobbersauras/media/8bf8f7de-cce9-4c95-8bc0-87816bb1c6c9_zps3695ed6a.jpg.html)

[Mitch]

I just picked up a 92fs at my local fun shop.

I told myself I was done getting new pistols this year, but I'm signed up for a class with Ernest Langdon in the fall, and something about doing that with a glock instead of a beretta seemed sacrilege. Need to pick up a holster and a couple more mags for the class now. Truth be told, I'm pretty excited about this. I've had a da/sa itch for the better part of a year now and I'm pretty pumped to run one for a few weeks and then get a class with someone like Ernest.

The hammer for aiwb is a big plus, too.

[GJM]

A few months back, I got this Centurion on Gunbroker. Used but excellent condition. Accurate, reliable and a good trigger. I sent it to Dave Olhasso and he made a good trigger even better, broke the edges on the rear of the slide, beveled the mag well and installed an Elite hammer and Novak rear sight. Added the excellent Crimson Trace military model laser grips, painted the front sight orange, and this is a terrific carry gun in a JM appendix holster. I am considering sending it to Wilson for a fiber optic front sight, G conversion and refinish of the slide.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/Centurion_zps6767d48b.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/Centurion_zps6767d48b.jpg.html)

[Up1911Fan]

Nice Centurion G. It was posted on another forum that someone had confirmation from a Beretta rep they will be offering a limited run of 92G's, according to him, no rail.

[Jeep]

A few months back, I got this Centurion on Gunbroker. Used but excellent condition. Accurate, reliable and a good trigger. I sent it to Dave Olhasso and he made a good trigger even better, broke the edges on the rear of the slide, beveled the mag well and installed an Elite hammer and Novak rear sight. Added the excellent Crimson Trace military model laser grips, painted the front sight orange, and this is a terrific carry gun in a JM appendix holster. I am considering sending it to Wilson for a fiber optic front sight, G conversion and refinish of the slide.

http://i250.photobucket.com/albums/gg251/GJMandes/Centurion_zps6767d48b.jpg (http://s250.photobucket.com/user/GJMandes/media/Centurion_zps6767d48b.jpg.html)

Very nice pistol. How much bulk do the CT grips add to the grip overall?

[JHC]

A fellow on M4C said his Beretta sales rep told him they'd be producing a limited run of G's soon.

[GJM]

A fellow on M4C said his Beretta sales rep told him they'd be producing a limited run of G's soon.

there is a very attractive Beretta variant, limited run, with a "G" amongst other features, that should be available in the next month. Hopefully a bunch more of limited runs to follow.

[JHC]

there is a very attractive Beretta variant, limited run, with a "G" amongst other features, that should be available in the next month. Hopefully a bunch more of limited runs to follow.

Any idea the approximate price point?

[GJM]

Less than a used Elite II or 92G-SD sells for.

[klewis]

there is a very attractive Beretta variant, limited run, with a "G" amongst other features, that should be available in the next month. Hopefully a bunch more of limited runs to follow.

Oh really? Any hints where/when they'll be available or where to find more info? Very interested! :)

[Suvorov]

A fellow on M4C said his Beretta sales rep told him they'd be producing a limited run of G's soon.

I hope they come out before Kalifornia puts the kabosh on single shot exemptions.

[GJM]

Very nice pistol. How much bulk do the CT grips add to the grip overall?

The CT military grips add little bulk and are the best CT grip solution I have felt. Good texture but not sticky.


Oh really? Any hints where/when they'll be available or where to find more info? Very interested! :)

Limited run, great feature set (both the factory pieces and after market parts), less costly than I have paid for most of my similar but used Beretta pistols, and will be available from a known entity with impeccable reputation and association with Beretta stuff. Stand by, as I am sure they will be announced here very soon.

[JDM]

there is a very attractive Beretta variant, limited run, with a "G" amongst other features, that should be available in the next month. Hopefully a bunch more of limited runs to follow.

Interested!

[Pennzoil]

Looking forward to the limited run and i'll probably try to pick one up.

I currently have a M9A1 I'm trying to get AGW to work on.

[LHS]

The CT military grips add little bulk and are the best CT grip solution I have felt. Good texture but not sticky.


I have three generations of CT grips for Berettas. The LG-302s are the most comfortable to actually shoot, but they add considerable bulk to the grip and the side activation is less than ideal (ye olde love handles tend to inadvertently activate it when I'm carrying IWB, which is most of the time). My primary carry gun wears a set of LG-402Ms, which are thinner, front-activated, and mostly hard rather than tacky/rubbery like the 302s. It's not as comfortable for long shooting sessions, but I've only really noticed it being unpleasant after a two-day class, and no more so than factory hard plastic grips.

[Jeep]

The CT military grips add little bulk and are the best CT grip solution I have felt. Good texture but not sticky.



Limited run, great feature set (both the factory pieces and after market parts), less costly than I have paid for most of my similar but used Beretta pistols, and will be available from a known entity with impeccable reputation and association with Beretta stuff. Stand by, as I am sure they will be announced here very soon.

Thanks. Please let us know about that new Beretta when you hear.

[Kyle Reese]

there is a very attractive Beretta variant, limited run, with a "G" amongst other features, that should be available in the next month. Hopefully a bunch more of limited runs to follow.

Definitely interested. Beretta would make a mint if the G variant became a regular production item.

[imp1295]

Well,
23 years in, and I finally succumbed to owning the pistol I've carried in combat for over 40 months of my little life. I carried it in a JMCK with ACUs, but I'm totally shocked how well it carries in cargo shorts.

Now, just to convince household six to let me send it to Wilson for the treatment...

I agree with many others in this thread, this cost me some money.

[Hambo]

I've currently got two: my late '80s vintage Italian 92F and a 92FS Brigadier. I foolishly traded off an Italian 92FS Inox that I used to carry. The next one will be a 92A1.

[Jeep]

Well,
23 years in, and I finally succumbed to owning the pistol I've carried in combat for over 40 months of my little life. I carried it in a JMCK with ACUs, but I'm totally shocked how well it carries in cargo shorts.

Now, just to convince household six to let me send it to Wilson for the treatment...

I agree with many others in this thread, this cost me some money.

Getting Household 6 to sign off is always an issue. Had you thought on signing off yourself with the signature line "For the Commander"? Of course, you will later have to explain that to your 6, but by then perhaps you can arrange a diversion.

[LHS]

According to my contact there, Beretta has just done a run of standard-configuration 92Gs. They are available for order. Part numbers J92G300M (with 2x 15rd mags) or J92G300 (with 2x 10rd mags).

[s0nspark]

According to my contact there, Beretta has just done a run of standard-configuration 92Gs. They are available for order. Part numbers J92G300M (with 2x 15rd mags) or J92G300 (with 2x 10rd mags).

For a Beretta noob can you elaborate on what standard-configuration means in this context? How would it compare to, say, a 92A1?