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  1. #1
    Member
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    Feb 2012
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    Walker,La.

    After 4 Years North Carolina is dropping the M&P.

    There are reports that North Carolina Highway Patrol is having mechanical issues with their M&P .357 Sig pistols that S&W can not resolve.
    They are looking at other pistols in .357 Sig and word is they would like to go back to the Sig 229.

  2. #2
    Member
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    USA
    Quote Originally Posted by JBP55 View Post
    There are reports that North Carolina Highway Patrol is having mechanical issues with their M&P .357 Sig pistols that S&W can not resolve.
    They are looking at other pistols in .357 Sig and word is they would like to go back to the Sig 229.
    I lived in NC when the NCHP adopted the M&P. A buddy of mine hit a deer one night and called NCHP. NC law states that if your are carrying, you have to notify law enforcement on first contact. My friend's disclosure led to a roadside conversation with the NCHP officer about pistols. The officer said that Glock and M&P were the two final pistols under consideration. Glock offered to throw in one sub-compact for every full size service pistol NCHP purchased. S&W offered to throw in one holster for every pistol purchased. The bean counters realized that Glock's offer would force them to buy 2x as many holsters so they went with the M&Ps. I think that's how the story went. Looks like they might have been better off buying holsters.
    Last edited by pangloss; 08-19-2013 at 10:56 PM. Reason: typo

  3. #3
    That's the buzz on a local forum. I spoke with my LE rep a couple months ago and he said that they were offering to replace every NCSHP M&P with a new, updated one...for free.

    The media report indicates an extration problem (or some type of mechanical problem) and includes a video of the PIO talking about a tap,rack, ready. However, the very infrequent issue that they've had since they've had the pistol is a dead trigger, which is remedied by a tap, rack, ready.

    I don't see them going back to the Sig simply because they got rid of that very pistol because some folk were having problems manipulating the trigger (small hands I guess). At any rate, it'll be interesting to see if S&W is able to get it done or if they drop the ball and lose to Glock, or some other manufacturer. Of interesting note, I was told that when they first thought of dropping the Sig for the M&P that Glock was in the mix. However, the Glock was said to have some issues after extended testing...though I can not remember what it was.

  4. #4
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    Sep 2012
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeeFus View Post
    That's the buzz on a local forum. I spoke with my LE rep a couple months ago and he said that they were offering to replace every NCSHP M&P with a new, updated one...for free.

    The media report indicates an extration problem (or some type of mechanical problem) and includes a video of the PIO talking about a tap,rack, ready. However, the very infrequent issue that they've had since they've had the pistol is a dead trigger, which is remedied by a tap, rack, ready.

    I don't see them going back to the Sig simply because they got rid of that very pistol because some folk were having problems manipulating the trigger (small hands I guess). At any rate, it'll be interesting to see if S&W is able to get it done or if they drop the ball and lose to Glock, or some other manufacturer. Of interesting note, I was told that when they first thought of dropping the Sig for the M&P that Glock was in the mix. However, the Glock was said to have some issues after extended testing...though I can not remember what it was.
    If the only P229 problem was trigger reach. one would think they would install there short trigger and or there new grip to improve reach.

    After talking to a LE/Sig armorer about there P229 and he is also in touch with 3 other departments.

    The only problems they had was with the mag disconnect. Other than that no P229 jammomatics


    BTW
    Its strange one LE reports good luck with there brand pistol then another LE agency changes to a different brand pistol.
    Sometimes I think its about other things besides major problems.

    Seems to me S&W could do a number on glock with there M&P pistols and AR15 combo

  5. #5
    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    If the only P229 problem was trigger reach. one would think they would install there short trigger and or there new grip to improve reach.
    True, but I believe the Sig's they had were of the DAK trigger variety. Can those triggers be shortened? I have no clue.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    Its strange one LE reports good luck with there brand pistol then another LE agency changes to a different brand pistol.
    Sometimes I think its about other things besides major problems.
    It does seem that every time a new firearms instructor gets assigned there is an issue with the previous model. My agency got rid of Glock 21's about 10 years ago because the chief at that time thought the HK USP 45 compact was the shizzle...even for patrol...blah!

    NCSHP and S&W have worked together to resolve the dead trigger issue. I see them staying with the free M&P replacements if they stick with the 357Sig caliber pistol.

  6. #6
    I received a few emails this morning in regards to this issue. It appears that the replacements were failures as well.

    One of the emails reads, in part: "A random firing of 5 of the 30 guns on the S&W range resulted in failure of all 5. This was on the S&W range using ammunition supplied by S&W. Our problems were not isolated to a few of the 300 weapons we purchased. It also appears that the frames are out off spec and do not fit into the holsters properly, meaning that the weapons will not be issued. Reportedly, these were the 'replacement' weapons from S&W.

    It's interesting to see the disparity of information available from S&W and the actual end-users.

  7. #7
    Wow, that is pretty darned bad.

  8. #8
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    Aug 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeeFus View Post
    True, but I believe the Sig's they had were of the DAK trigger variety. Can those triggers be shortened? I have no clue.



    It does seem that every time a new firearms instructor gets assigned there is an issue with the previous model. My agency got rid of Glock 21's about 10 years ago because the chief at that time thought the HK USP 45 compact was the shizzle...even for patrol...blah!

    NCSHP and S&W have worked together to resolve the dead trigger issue. I see them staying with the free M&P replacements if they stick with the 357Sig caliber pistol.
    The DAK can be used with the short trigger. Our 229 DAK's all have the short trigger. The DAK guns can also use the slim line grips which reduce the girth and trigger reach by eliminating the decocking lever bump, however, one of the big institutional issues with the p229 is ruined frames due to stripped out grip screw holes. It is my understanding this was part of the reason for NCHP switch to the M&P as well as part of the reason for SIG developing the E2 grip. We go through grip screws and loctite like crazy.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rich View Post
    Seems to me S&W could do a number on glock with there M&P pistols and AR15 combo
    NCHP bought both.

  10. #10
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    Aug 2011
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    Quote Originally Posted by KeeFus View Post



    It does seem that every time a new firearms instructor gets assigned there is an issue with the previous model. My agency got rid of Glock 21's about 10 years ago because the chief at that time thought the HK USP 45 compact was the shizzle...even for patrol...blah!

    .
    You are on to something here ....

 

 

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