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  1. #1
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    History of pistol shooting techniques

    I'd like to see a discussion of who was most influential and how we went from this



    to this

  2. #2
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    The middle seat.
    This is an excellent thread idea and I look forward to the more knowledgeable answers out there.

    From where I sit on the outside looking in, not being in the industry nor a real competitive shooter, I think we really have 3 groups to thank for the evolution of the "modern handgun technique"

    - The first were the pioneers in the 50s and 60s like Cooper, Weaver, and others who had military or law enforcement experience and realized that the old "bullseye" technique was lacking for any serious purposes. Add to that the NRA who came up with the first of the "combat" oriented matches with the PPC that opened the door for IPSC and all the others to follow.

    - Second were the mostly civilian "combat action" competitors who in their never ending search for an edge and to shave a few tenths of seconds, threw common practice out the window and embraced the isosceles stance, press out, and other techniques. Unencumbered by department and institutional SOPs and equipment, they weren't afraid to try new techniques as the only thing they had to loose were matches. This proved to be a perfect breeding ground for new ideas to spring up and techniques to come to fruition.

    - Lastly were the elite HSLD military and LE units that looked to the civilian competition shooters and training centers like Gun Sight to train their soldiers and then cross pollinated the more poguish units with their new found knowledge. There was no way that the big Army would ever look to the civilian action shooters for advice and the AMU was largely too involved in traditional shooting matches to be developing new styles, but the guys from SFOD-D and other like units were open minded and embraced change. Once the average soldier saw how the "cool kids" were shooting they wanted to do the same. The past 10 years has brought an abundance of real world combat shooting that has given these guys real world feed back which they in turn fed back into the world of training with guys like Kyle Lamb, Paul Howe, and others decimating their wisdom.

    As a side note, I will say that while the Euros might have had some influence (at least with the formation of HSLD units), this evolution of combat shooting style could ONLY HAPPEN in a nation with a healthy civilian gun culture. Ironic when you think that the latest techniques an SAS trooper is using, came from a nation who's gun laws the average Brit would find horrific.
    Last edited by Suvorov; 06-02-2012 at 09:02 AM.

  3. #3
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  4. #4
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    IMHO, Col. Cooper was the most influential. Not due to his adaptation of the Weaver stance, but due to Gunsite. He was the first guy (IMHO) to both create a specific site for training and used his influence at Peterson's Publishing to get recognition and publicity.

    Side note - Lucky McDaniel was one of the first guys to travel the country teaching folks how to shoot better.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucky_McDaniel

  5. #5
    A happy confluence of timing, his intellect, his interest, and his ability to write not just generally, but specifically about shooting, hunting, fighting and competition.

  6. #6
    harden the f#ck up
    Join Date
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    TEXAS
    Two quick points on this:

    On the L/E side-The legendary instructors at LAPD in SWAT/SIS/Metro Div., cut their teeth at Gunsite. They took the Modern Technique and adapted it for use in a highly restrictive environment in which they had lawyers who targeted them on every single shooting. They are some of the most successful police gunfighters in the country, and those they have trained have had similar results. Those same instructors also provided the training to the USMC Force Recon community with great success. You could also add the work of Pat Rogers in this regard as well.

    On the Army Special Operations side, I will quote a guy who was there in the early years-"Until Ken Hackathorn came along, nobody shot a 1911 like they do today". Ken totally changed how the pistol was shot and ran. Ken was also a Gunsite vet., and had a ton of influence on many of today's top trainers.

    I know that with my time dealing with the West Coast Naval Special Warfare community in the late 80's, they were heavily influenced by John Shaw and his three gun based shooting style.

    While most I have talked to have said that the Modern Technique needed some tweaks when adopted into use in the Military and L/E communities, it was a solid foundation to build on. While poo poo'd by many, I can attest first hand how successful the LAPD Metro adaptation of the Modern Technique has flat worked in putting down bad guys in actual street shootings with higher hit rates than anything else I have seen. Keep in mind, it is not treated as a "shooting" system, but a balance of the weapons handling requirements for street operations that are heavily search and evaluation based and marksmanship requirements that emphasize proper application of lethal force (with US Federal Court standards) based over pure shooting. For pure shooting performance, there are better evolved ways to do things.
    "If I had a grandpa, he would look like Delbert Belton"

    Co-Owner-Hardwired Tactical Shooting

  7. #7
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    May 2011
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    Columbia SC
    Nyeti, good to see you back.

  8. #8
    harden the f#ck up
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    TEXAS
    Quote Originally Posted by Al T. View Post
    Nyeti, good to see you back.
    Never left, just tend to read and not post any more. I just happened to have some unique insight on this one.
    "If I had a grandpa, he would look like Delbert Belton"

    Co-Owner-Hardwired Tactical Shooting

  9. #9
    S.M.E. & STAFF
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    Palo Alto, CA
    nyeti--I always enjoy your cogent posts, as they are always fact based and full of wisdom...

  10. #10
    DB, that period of Gunsite inspired SoCal Law enforcement has to go down as the heart of the golden age of law enforcement shooting development. Larry Mudgett was also a "student" in my first class at Gunsite, API 270, and the cross pollination of Gunsite and LAPD was on display at most every class I took at Gunsite in the 90's.

    I should also point out that I noticed the camel sneaking his nose under the tent on the shooting versus fighting argument.

 

 

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