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Thread: Federal Chamion v. Remington UMC v. American Eagle

  1. #11
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    When you said "plated" I was thinking mild steel
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  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by MikeyC View Post
    When you said "plated" I was thinking mild steel
    I see; we're talking about a copper plating over a lead bullet, rather than the bi-metal stuff that's common with Russian ammo (a copper plating over a steel jacket).

  3. #13
    Member orionz06's Avatar
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    UMC ammo from time to time will have all sorts of weird shit in it. I end up with metal flakes sticking in the target when shot from 5 yards in.
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  4. #14
    Site Supporter Tamara's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by caleb View Post
    At least in .45 ACP, American Eagle uses large pistol primers and Federal Champion uses small primers.
    All the crystal balls I've consulted state that small pistol primers in .45's is the wave of the future; something to do with more overseas contracting of budget ammo to former East Bloc nations. I do not know if this is true, but if so, it makes me sad.
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  5. #15
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    I shoot a lot of Champion because it's cheap, however in the 4,500+ rounds i've put through my Gen4 G26, the only problems i've had have been with Champion ( about 3,000 of the 4,500). With Champion i've had 4 failures to feed, i'm assuming they were under-loaded rounds without enough force to fully cycle the gun.

  6. #16
    Both my .45 Kimber's run great on Remington UMC and American Eagle. They don't like the Federal at all with a 20% FTF and/or FTE issue. Maybe I got a bad batch because the casing rims were all rough to the touch? Nice time to find that out during an IDPA match! That was the only ammo Wal-Mart had at the time and I was getting low so I bought the only two boxes they had. I won't be buying Federal again in .45 ammo.

  7. #17
    Very Pro Dentist Chuck Haggard's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by orionz06 View Post
    UMC ammo from time to time will have all sorts of weird shit in it. I end up with metal flakes sticking in the target when shot from 5 yards in.
    So, do they charge more for the exclusive CQB "spray of death"™ feature, or is that just included as a freebie?


    Maybe it's ammo in the budget line because this isn't the actual "spray of death"™, it's more like the "shoot ur eye out kid" feature.


    On a serious note; We have burned up almost half a million rounds of 124gr AE so far at work, either we got an extra good batch or this is good ammo, no issues noted so far.

  8. #18
    Quote Originally Posted by Tamara View Post
    All the crystal balls I've consulted state that small pistol primers in .45's is the wave of the future; something to do with more overseas contracting of budget ammo to former East Bloc nations. I do not know if this is true, but if so, it makes me sad.
    Actually, its a budget thing. ATK has been trying to push this down everybody's throat, but so far Remington and Winchester have resisted. Let us hope (reloaders, anyway) that this resistance continues.

    Here's the deal... and I know this via a highly-placed contact within ATK.

    Today's propellant "technology" means that .45ACP no longer needs a large pistol primer. Back in the early days of smokeless powder and corrosive priming, it definitely did.

    ATK began, a few years ago, making Federal-headstamped ammunition at the CCI plant in Lewiston Idaho. That facility was not being fully utilized, and with the main Federal plant in Anoka MN running full blast 24/7, it was a sound management decision. The bunter tooling used at the Lewiston plant leaves a curious, and very distinctive, signature... the case head is slightly concave around the primer pocket. You'll see this on the Federal Champion ammunition in the maroon box; American Eagle is made in Anoka.

    At any rate, the story I got is that the engineers at CCI/Lewiston developed the SP (small pistol primer)-loaded .45 initially for the aluminum Blazer line, and adapted it to the brass-cased ammunition. While the cost difference between a small and large pistol primer is certainly negligible, when you're talking tens of millions of cartridges produced it can indeed add up.

    Anyway... according to my contact, and some forwarded e-mails between him and the boffins, its entirely viable and has no downside... except to reloaders. As you might expect, we (reloaders) are very near the bottom of their list of concerns.

    Keeping in mind that this information is about 8 months old, my guy told me that the plan is to make the el cheapo stuff (Champion) with SP and the rest with LP until/if such time as the other big makers "get on board" with the SP concept in toto. ATK markets American Eagle heavily to LE as training ammunition. The Champion line is aimed toward the big box retailers and we citizen hoi polloi.

    FWIW, last year I was seeing quite a bit of this stuff in my range pick-ups, but not nearly so much lately. If you reload .45 you really need to be vigilant regarding this, because trust me when I tell you that an SP .45 case will ruin your day when you're rocking and rolling with your progressive press.

    .

  9. #19
    Speaking of which, I've seen some batches of American Eagle that are small-primer loaded as well.

  10. #20
    Site Supporter DocGKR's Avatar
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    I've watched several hundred thousand rounds of Fed AE and Speer Lawman Training go downrange of late in 9 mm, .40, .45 ACP with nary a problem...

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