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Thread: IS Leader al-Baghdadi Killed in US Raid

  1. #71
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    Quote Originally Posted by wvincent View Post
    Attachment 44133

    He's a good boy! A VERY good boy!

    I think he deserves his very own parade.
    Quote Originally Posted by JohnO View Post
    I'll bet he got or is getting a JUICY STEAK!
    He does but he will likely get a well done steak with ketchup at the WhiteHouse....

  2. #72
    Member Baldanders's Avatar
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    I applaud the skills of our military.

    Of course, with thousands of men ready to take his place, the death of this one man means absolutely nothing to the actual security of this country or the safety of its citizens beyond a month or two.

    https://fabiusmaximus.com/2019/10/27...r-al-baghdadi/

    The generation of terrorists we are breeding now will make the current batch look like rank amateurs.

    https://fabiusmaximus.com/2015/07/09...ratchet-87079/
    REPETITION CREATES BELIEF
    REPETITION BUILDS THE SEPARATE WORLDS WE LIVE AND DIE IN
    NO EXCEPTIONS

  3. #73
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    I applaud the skills of our military.

    Of course, with thousands of men ready to take his place, the death of this one man means absolutely nothing to the actual security of this country or the safety of its citizens beyond a month or two.

    https://fabiusmaximus.com/2019/10/27...r-al-baghdadi/

    The generation of terrorists we are breeding now will make the current batch look like rank amateurs.

    https://fabiusmaximus.com/2015/07/09...ratchet-87079/
    Killing leaders matters. More so founders. Remember War is politics by other means. Symbols matter.

    The Darwinian arguments are no reason NOT to kill these guys. Yes some survive but that can be because they are the luckiest or the most cautious, not necessarily "the best" either way they are fewer which impedes them and will eventually break them as an effective fighting force.

  4. #74
    Four String Fumbler Joe in PNG's Avatar
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    People have used the "Mandate of Heaven" idea with regards to China, but it's pretty universal.

    People like success, and being part of something that is successful. People don't like losers* and being part of something that is unsuccessful.

    The Germans were happy to be Nazis when their armies were marching into Paris- not so much when the Soviet armies were marching into Berlin.


    *sportsball teams excluded
    "You win 100% of the fights you avoid. If you're not there when it happens, you don't lose." - William Aprill
    "I've owned a guitar for 31 years and that sure hasn't made me a musician, let alone an expert. It's made me a guy who owns a guitar."- BBI

  5. #75
    Site Supporter Kanye Wyoming's Avatar
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  6. #76
    Member Baldanders's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    Killing leaders matters. More so founders. Remember War is politics by other means. Symbols matter.

    The Darwinian arguments are no reason NOT to kill these guys. Yes some survive but that can be because they are the luckiest or the most cautious, not necessarily "the best" either way they are fewer which impedes them and will eventually break them as an effective fighting force.
    Because that totally worked in Vietnam. Yeah, I know, if we'd just kept up the pressure, it would have worked eventually......

    To quote "V for Vendetta," "ideas are bulletproof." Unless you kill them all, or so many that there is NO leadership, it doesn't do anything but slow things down temporarily.

    What insurgencies or revolutionary groups have been ended by a slow grinding down in the past 100 years? You break them NOW, or it never happens.

    After Al-Qaeda fell in influence , we got ISIS, which actually managed to take territory, hold it for a time, and show a revolutionary Islamist state is quite feasable, and international co-operation on a massive scale was required to stop them (for now) and it took years.

    I'm sure the counter-insurgency operations we are running in 70% of the countries on planet Earth will all slowly grind down all the threats we don't know about yet.

    The United States: undefeatable in battle, unable to win a war since 1945. No, turning Iraq into a more chaotic, pro-Islamist state is not a victory. Nor was doing the same in Libya.
    REPETITION CREATES BELIEF
    REPETITION BUILDS THE SEPARATE WORLDS WE LIVE AND DIE IN
    NO EXCEPTIONS

  7. #77
    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    I applaud the skills of our military.

    Of course, with thousands of men ready to take his place, the death of this one man means absolutely nothing to the actual security of this country or the safety of its citizens beyond a month or two.

    https://fabiusmaximus.com/2019/10/27...r-al-baghdadi/

    The generation of terrorists we are breeding now will make the current batch look like rank amateurs.

    https://fabiusmaximus.com/2015/07/09...ratchet-87079/
    I only agree with the first sentence.

    Here are my objections to the rest. The death of one man means a lot to the security of this country. Maybe not in a direct sense- organizations have backup leadership. But it means a lot to the perception of US military strength for both our allies and enemies. Our withdrawal from Somalia emboldened Al Qeida to scale up their ambition, leading to 9/11. Our exit from that region after 18 dead signaled in the mind of OBL the US was perhaps not the military superpower it appeared . A hollow point in M. Farrah Aidid’s skull could have saved thousands of American lives.

    There will always be terrorists and enemies of the US. Whether they act on their prejudices or not depends a good bit on what they can expect as a response. Talking smack about the Great Satan is one thing. Act on it and you’re history. I’ve no problem with that being status quo for the “next generation of terrorists”.
    The Minority Marksman.
    "When you meet a swordsman, draw your sword: Do not recite poetry to one who is not a poet."
    -a Ch'an Buddhist axiom.

  8. #78
    Four String Fumbler Joe in PNG's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    Because that totally worked in Vietnam. Yeah, I know, if we'd just kept up the pressure, it would have worked eventually......
    To be fair, the one thing we didn't do in Vietnam was go after the leaders, or much of anything in the North until the Eleven Day War (aka Linebacker II).
    "You win 100% of the fights you avoid. If you're not there when it happens, you don't lose." - William Aprill
    "I've owned a guitar for 31 years and that sure hasn't made me a musician, let alone an expert. It's made me a guy who owns a guitar."- BBI

  9. #79
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    Quote Originally Posted by Borderland View Post
    IIRC it was al qaeda that perpetrated 911.

    How anyone can cut those Islamist assholes any slack I haven't a clue?

    There's a war going on in the ME between Islamists and Muslims. Kurds, for the most part aren't Islamists.

    Few in this country know the difference, including Trump.

    al-Baghdadi was an Islamist.
    I'm quite certain our President knows this but if for some reason he didn't, his advisors told him. But at the end of the day it doesn't matter. This guy was a thug and whether he was a muslim, an islamist, a Christian or whatever, who cares. What matters is that he is gone. Now let's celebrate.

  10. #80
    Abducted by Aliens Borderland's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Baldanders View Post
    Because that totally worked in Vietnam. Yeah, I know, if we'd just kept up the pressure, it would have worked eventually......

    To quote "V for Vendetta," "ideas are bulletproof." Unless you kill them all, or so many that there is NO leadership, it doesn't do anything but slow things down temporarily.

    What insurgencies or revolutionary groups have been ended by a slow grinding down in the past 100 years? You break them NOW, or it never happens.

    After Al-Qaeda fell in influence , we got ISIS, which actually managed to take territory, hold it for a time, and show a revolutionary Islamist state is quite feasable, and international co-operation on a massive scale was required to stop them (for now) and it took years.

    I'm sure the counter-insurgency operations we are running in 70% of the countries on planet Earth will all slowly grind down all the threats we don't know about yet.

    The United States: undefeatable in battle, unable to win a war since 1945. No, turning Iraq into a more chaotic, pro-Islamist state is not a victory. Nor was doing the same in Libya.
    I'm afraid this threw more fuel on the fire. I'm not saying hunting down an Islamist terrorist leader isn't a good idea but it accomplishes nothing in the general scheme of things. Islamist will figure out a way to strike back, you can bet your bottom dollar on that. There are probably some assholes right now in the US or Europe building a bomb to avenge the death of Baghdadi.
    In the P-F basket of deplorables.

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