Beretta APX: now with long slide, Centurion RDO, &c. Extended slide catch/mag release

[Thy.Will.Be.Done]

The writing is definitely on the wall for the .357 & .40 since the FBI deemed 9mm better for their uses. Shit always runs down and in the world of law enforcement the FBI is king and was both responsible for the .40 becoming popular and ultimately it's demise. I don't see it ever going away completely as both calibers will always have it's proponents.

That being said, Beretta is not the only maker who has realized the market for .40 is basically no longer valid. CZ does not have ANY .40 SKU's in their lineup AT ALL. SIG only have the P320 in .357 SIG left, I believe... says a lot considering it was their lovechild. It is too bad as IMO, 9mm is fine but leaves a bit to be desired in certain areas of ballistics that both calibers can improve.

[AdioSS]

I don't disagree, but I do see it going away. It really is not a pleasant cartridge to shoot (.40S&W), and .357SIG, while a neat cartridge, is not that much better (I say this as the owner of two 8357 Cougars and a few 229s in .357 for giggles).

FWIW, if there is demand, the .40 will be available, but as of today, the demand does not justify it for most SKUs.

Without earpro or a Suppressor nothing is pleasant to shoot. That’s not the point of it. These are little contained explosions going off in our hands pushing chunks of metal out with the force to destroy whatever is in its path. If it isn’t pleasant to shoot then I’m fairly sure it is much less pleasant to be on the other end of the barrel. Bigger explosions and bigger chunks or metal flying with more force equals to increased damage on the other end. I don’t care about the political reasons for agencies to switch back to a smaller & weaker round. I want to more effective round. If ammo companies put half as much development into the .40 S&W then they’d probably be back to where that round started off. As an upgrade in performance over the 9mm.

Most of my guns are Berettas. And most of those are currently chambered in .40 Smith & Wesson. I have even converted guns that originally fired 9mm to fire .40, like my M9, M9A1, & several 92FS frames. My favorite guns to carry are an 8040D MiniCougar that I added the sear parts to & a factory NP3 coated 96G Centurion with night sights. I have only sold off 1 Beretta (a 9000S in .40 that just didn’t fit my hand right.) My only 9mm Berettas were never offered in .40 (Billennium, frame safety 92 made in Brazil, & the APX Combat.) And I seriously considered converting a 96D Brig slide to go on the Billie. My most recent gun purchase was a CX4 in .40.

[Danjojo]

APX to me makes more sense in calibers larger than 9mm. Put that extra wide slide and heavy chassis to work. The popular 9mm pistols just keep getting smaller and smaller. A soft shooting, long slide APX in 40, 45, or the resurrected 10mm has more of a place in today's market than a 30oz duty 9mm.

Hopefully the APX line picks up steam and brings that.

[Thy.Will.Be.Done]

APX to me makes more sense in calibers larger than 9mm. Put that extra wide slide and heavy chassis to work. The popular 9mm pistols just keep getting smaller and smaller. A soft shooting, long slide APX in 40, 45, or the resurrected 10mm has more of a place in today's market than a 30oz duty 9mm.

Hopefully the APX line picks up steam and brings that.

This is pretty much how I feel about it, I usually only consider 9mm as the best choice for smaller pistols that are either sub-compact or single stack. I think the main problem with people regarding the .40 is they tend to focus only on the recoil, rather than the shooting fundamentals. My first pistol was an FNP-40, chambered in .40 obviously, nobody informed me as to the abhorrant recoil it had and I really liked the way it shot.

Of course, the muzzle would jump when it was fired, but it came right back down quickly and leveled for the next shot... there was no painful abuse. What I really don't understand about the complaints of the .40 recoil is the fact that you can often get .22 trainers or at least a 9mm version if that is not available. Then you can benefit from the cheap and softer shooting ammo while shooting pretty much the same pistol.

Now, I also do feel that many people fire .40 S&W through inappropriate platforms that don't handle the cartridge well. I would wager most of the detractors were shooting it through Glock or some type of concealed carry (sub or single stack) and never bothered to go further down the rabbit hole and just ran back to 9mm crying foul play. I don't have a reference for this but I believe the director of the FBI who made the policy change to .40, still carries the .40 personally.

I wish I had reference for it, but I didn't think to save where I found it. If this is true, it is saying a lot in my opinion. We live in a lowest common denominator society, where mediocrity is the standard and anything that even the most feeble (mentally and physically) cannot use will be discarded. So here we are, 9mm re-enters the world of law enforcement with about as much fanfare as the .40 came along with.

[AdioSS]

Sorry for getting this thread off topic...

I can get one tomorrow.

Is there any chance you got a picture?

[e_stern]

Sorry for getting this thread off topic...


Is there any chance you got a picture?

Yes, see below link. Comapred to the standard slide stop on an FDE Centurion model.

https://imgur.com/a/s08GqDT

[AdioSS]

Thank you again! That should help.

[CanineCombatives]

Without earpro or a Suppressor nothing is pleasant to shoot. That’s not the point of it. These are little contained explosions going off in our hands pushing chunks of metal out with the force to destroy whatever is in its path. If it isn’t pleasant to shoot then I’m fairly sure it is much less pleasant to be on the other end of the barrel. Bigger explosions and bigger chunks or metal flying with more force equals to increased damage on the other end. I don’t care about the political reasons for agencies to switch back to a smaller & weaker round. I want to more effective round. If ammo companies put half as much development into the .40 S&W then they’d probably be back to where that round started off. As an upgrade in performance over the 9mm.

Nothing wrong with being a .40 fan if thats your thing, but calling it the more effective round is silly, after the most extensive, exhaustive, expensive and scientific study into the street effectiveness of modern pistol cartridges ever undertaken proved that it isnt. But even that is not what killed it, the 30% greater recoil energy over 9mm is the real killer. As any professional or national competitor will tell you, recoil is the bane of pistol proficiency, cut and dry physics.

[AdioSS]

Shot per shot, not rapid fire, there’s no way they are the same. Simply firing a round of each shot tell you that. All of that force you feel against your hand, plus some that is absorbed by the mass of the gun & slide cycling back against springs which slow down the force you feel over a few microseconds, is the same energy force applied to whatever the bullet hits. If they were equal, then the recoil would be equal & the only advantages that 9mm would have would be a couple more rounds in the magazine & cheaper ammo.

[pastaslinger]

Are there going to be base pads or mags that make this competitive for carry optics?