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Thread: Best Hard-Use AR15s in 2022?

  1. #201
    I was primarily considering a Daniel Defense DD4 RIS III (16" midlength) and a 14.5" DD M4A1. I spoke with a guy who's worked at Daniel Defense for 17 years and asked him about midlength vs carbine. He said that several tests have been conducted in the past several years and that, while the results are not public, the midlength outperforms the carbine length in every way in terms of reliability and durability. While my carbine gas LE6920 has been extremely reliable, I figure I'll give midlength a go this time, since Daniel Defense basically wrote the specs on how to properly gas a midlength barrel with their URGI contract.

    So now it's between the RIS III Mlok, or a DD M4v9 with a freefloat quad rail. I've been partial to quadrails my whole life (my LE6920 still has a KAC RAS M4 and my M16A4 surplus upper will has the KAC RAS M5), I like how bombproof they are and in military testing they still outperform even the toughest Mlok rails tested in terms of deflection. But I realize the future is now and Mlok is the standard. The v9 is also about $1600 while the DD4 RIS III would end up about $2300. That's enough difference for a couple of cases of ammo, or some ammo and a good optic.

    A few months ago I was out shooting my LE6920 at the range, with the KAC quad rail and all. Someone came up to me and said how it was a cool "retro" AR, and I was confused at first. When I got this gun and set it up, it was cutting edge. Now it's considered "early GWoT retro". I'm only 30 years old and I feel old.

  2. #202
    Member Wake27's Avatar
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    Best Hard-Use AR15s in 2022?

    Quote Originally Posted by SwampDweller View Post
    I was primarily considering a Daniel Defense DD4 RIS III (16" midlength) and a 14.5" DD M4A1. I spoke with a guy who's worked at Daniel Defense for 17 years and asked him about midlength vs carbine. He said that several tests have been conducted in the past several years and that, while the results are not public, the midlength outperforms the carbine length in every way in terms of reliability and durability. While my carbine gas LE6920 has been extremely reliable, I figure I'll give midlength a go this time, since Daniel Defense basically wrote the specs on how to properly gas a midlength barrel with their URGI contract.

    So now it's between the RIS III Mlok, or a DD M4v9 with a freefloat quad rail. I've been partial to quadrails my whole life (my LE6920 still has a KAC RAS M4 and my M16A4 surplus upper will has the KAC RAS M5), I like how bombproof they are and in military testing they still outperform even the toughest Mlok rails tested in terms of deflection. But I realize the future is now and Mlok is the standard. The v9 is also about $1600 while the DD4 RIS III would end up about $2300. That's enough difference for a couple of cases of ammo, or some ammo and a good optic.

    A few months ago I was out shooting my LE6920 at the range, with the KAC quad rail and all. Someone came up to me and said how it was a cool "retro" AR, and I was confused at first. When I got this gun and set it up, it was cutting edge. Now it's considered "early GWoT retro". I'm only 30 years old and I feel old.
    I think BCM started releasing Keymod en masse around maybe 2013 and MLOK wasn’t long after. The Crane MLOK report was in 2017 according to Wiki, so it’s been on their radar for more than five years at this point and pic rails have been fading for about a decade.

    I’ll be 32 in January and if you’re still using a 6920 with quad rail, the laws of nature adjust so that I’m really half your age.

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  3. #203
    Member TGS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwampDweller View Post
    I was primarily considering a Daniel Defense DD4 RIS III (16" midlength) and a 14.5" DD M4A1. I spoke with a guy who's worked at Daniel Defense for 17 years and asked him about midlength vs carbine. He said that several tests have been conducted in the past several years and that, while the results are not public, the midlength outperforms the carbine length in every way in terms of reliability and durability. While my carbine gas LE6920 has been extremely reliable, I figure I'll give midlength a go this time, since Daniel Defense basically wrote the specs on how to properly gas a midlength barrel with their URGI contract.

    So now it's between the RIS III Mlok, or a DD M4v9 with a freefloat quad rail. I've been partial to quadrails my whole life (my LE6920 still has a KAC RAS M4 and my M16A4 surplus upper will has the KAC RAS M5), I like how bombproof they are and in military testing they still outperform even the toughest Mlok rails tested in terms of deflection. But I realize the future is now and Mlok is the standard. The v9 is also about $1600 while the DD4 RIS III would end up about $2300. That's enough difference for a couple of cases of ammo, or some ammo and a good optic.

    A few months ago I was out shooting my LE6920 at the range, with the KAC quad rail and all. Someone came up to me and said how it was a cool "retro" AR, and I was confused at first. When I got this gun and set it up, it was cutting edge. Now it's considered "early GWoT retro". I'm only 30 years old and I feel old.
    Your KAC rail was replaced in the SOPMOD program by the RIS II before you were even of age to legally buy that gun, and even KeyMod came out 10 years ago when you would've been about 20. There's no way it was cutting edge when you built that gun unless you were a middle schooler and your dad was buying it for you.
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  4. #204
    Site Supporter rob_s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SwampDweller View Post
    So now it's between the RIS III Mlok, or a DD M4v9 with a freefloat quad rail. I've been partial to quadrails my whole life
    I admit to having had to google those. So to help other similarly challenged, I assume we’re taking about these?

    https://danieldefense.com/ddm4-v9.html
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    Vs

    https://danieldefense.com/dd4-riii.html
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    I admit to also preferring picatinny to the Brazilian solutions, but I also strongly dislike handguards that extend to the muzzle device as well. I prefer some exposed barrel. Don’t really care enough to defend or explain it either.

    Also fwiw I’m not buying a 14.5in barrel non-NFA gun (or for that matter, wasting the time and cost on an NFA version).

    I’d probably choose the RISIII model. Although I’d have a hard time explaining to myself why I spent $1k more than the Colt 6960…
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    Does the above offend? If you have paid to be here, you can click here to put it in context.

  5. #205
    Member TGS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    I’d probably choose the RISIII model. Although I’d have a hard time explaining to myself why I spent $1k more than the Colt 6960…
    Name:  5269F115-6928-43B4-AAD1-499F92377D86.jpg
Views: 373
Size:  21.8 KB
    How dare you, it deviates from the M4 TDP!
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  6. #206
    Member Wake27's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    I admit to having had to google those. So to help other similarly challenged, I assume we’re taking about these?

    https://danieldefense.com/ddm4-v9.html
    Name:  961FD05C-4E31-42FA-A1C5-7FECD5FFC1D5.jpg
Views: 378
Size:  25.8 KB

    Vs

    https://danieldefense.com/dd4-riii.html
    Name:  39D97663-9079-4676-AE92-6A0FE417349B.jpg
Views: 378
Size:  20.2 KB


    I admit to also preferring picatinny to the Brazilian solutions, but I also strongly dislike handguards that extend to the muzzle device as well. I prefer some exposed barrel. Don’t really care enough to defend or explain it either.

    Also fwiw I’m not buying a 14.5in barrel non-NFA gun (or for that matter, wasting the time and cost on an NFA version).

    I’d probably choose the RISIII model. Although I’d have a hard time explaining to myself why I spent $1k more than the Colt 6960…
    Name:  5269F115-6928-43B4-AAD1-499F92377D86.jpg
Views: 373
Size:  21.8 KB
    The RISIII is the latest hotness so bonus points for that but your bottom line is why I tend to shy away from DD. I hate their furniture and prefer BCM’s so I’d have to swap the stock and grip. Even before that additional expense, I just haven’t convinced myself that DD was worth the price they demand over a roughly comparable BCM. If I’m paying $2k or more for a base gun, it’s going to be a KAC. Or at least a KAC upper.

    The one exception was the MK18 upper when on sale from Brownells but even then, I replaced the RISII with an MCMR just because the balance on it was horrible.


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  7. #207
    S.L.O.W. ASH556's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by HCM View Post
    Geissele started strong but their QC issues with barrels and receivers changed that. A Geissele rifle or upper is a crap shoot right now. Hopefully they will get back to their prior QC levels but with the amount of .GOV contract work they have recently taken on I'm not holding my breath.

    Colt barrels are fine, but there are better (more accurate / more durable) barrels out there. What ever DD's stylistic choices, the barrel and BCG are the heart of the rifle. Microbest is the standard for BCG, but when it comes to barrels DD CHF is hard to beat.

    PS: IME The best strategy for anyone wanting either BCM or LMT is to snag complete uppers and lowers in the configurations you want.
    I'm familiar with the Geissele barrel issues. What's up with the receivers?
    Food Court Apprentice
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  8. #208
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    Quote Originally Posted by ASH556 View Post
    I'm familiar with the Geissele barrel issues. What's up with the receivers?
    Out of spec magwells.

  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by rob_s View Post
    Pretty much mirrors my impression as well.

    I was honestly unsure if I had just stopped following all the gun celebrities and so was just not aware of the larping classes being offered today, or if they had actually died out.
    Yeah, the Larpers have pretty much moved on to night vision stuff. Now to be a larr you not only need a plate carrier but $1000 worth of helmet and $5,000 to $10,000 worth of night vision devices.

    Not everybody in the night vision game is a LARP her but that’s where the LARPers are now.

  10. #210
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    I was bored the other day and bought LWRC-IC-DI. Shoots well and most importantly, looks cool and different! The new hotness with ambi everything is meh. The only non-traditional feature I like is a short throw safety (prefer non-ambi, or with a thin lever on the right side).

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