German Language RFI

[P30]

@P30 do you know when German schools started the widespread teaching of English as a second language?

Interesting question. I've found an answer in this wikipedia article. According to the article, it started in the decades before 1900 in some parts of Germany and since 1964 in whole Germany in every type of school in the 5th grade.

Since 2004, English classes are offered even in all elementary schools in Germany. In my opinion, this is good. Because children can learn a new language faster than teens and adults.

PS:

"if you say je t'aime ma cherie", you're golden for the night, but if you say ich liebe dich", she'll put her clothes back on and leave.

As a German, I'm cool with that. Because this avoids me to waste my life or a part of it to such a superficial woman. I already wrote: If we Germans give away our heart, it's hard for us to take it back. So we better don't give it to the wrong one.

[revchuck38]

Whenabouts was this? During the Cold War, by any chance?

Yup. Six months in '76, then '78-'81 and '83-'86.

@revchuck38 I wonder if when you were stationed there less Germans were learning English proficiency in schools?

When I was there, most of my German friends and professional counterparts spoke English. I tried to speak German by choice, and they appreciated that. The first time I was there was a long TDY. My first long tour I was primarily interested in motorcycles, and single, and I was riding a BMW R90/6; I was out the gate shortly after COB Friday and usually didn't come back until sometime Sunday. My second long tour I was married and interested in shooting and was one of two GIs with a membership at the Frankfurt city police range. I still have the Hoffman grips that he made for me for my Ruger MKII (UIT Sport Pistol) and 6" M19 (UIT Centerfire Pistol).

[TGS]

Don’t take TGS’s posts as saying that Germans lack humanity or emotion. It’s, just maybe ya’ll are culturally not as outgoing towards strangers. For example, how common would it be for people have a conversation with a complete stranger while you’re waiting in line at the market or in a coffee shop in Germany?

Perfect example......or in most Germanic countries, attempting to sit down on public transit and saying "hi" to someone, attempting to make eye contact, offering a smile and asking if the seat next to them is open. Even interactions with personal associates can be a bit different...like asking someone to come over and watch a movie; that experience is going to be much more interactive in other cultures than with Germans. Or, they might outright say that they don't consider you a friend and do not wish to come over. In the US and other western cultures, that would be extremely odd, direct and "dick-ish" to say, instead of just offering a polite declination that usually gets the point across.

Or, back to the movie thing, some other cultures are more interactive than us and it's annoying to us. Ever go to a movie theater with the French? They'll try smoking and having side-bar conversations. While that's fine in France (or used to be, I haven't hung out with French soldiers in 15 years), even just the side-bar conversation gets you ejected in the US.

On the other end of the spectrum, Pakistanis are so open that it can be outright unsettling or offensive to Americans. They'll quiz you about everyone living in your house and other intimate details to the point if you're not familiar with their culture, you might assume they're gathering intel for ISI or a terrorist group. If you're a married woman but don't have kids, there's a 50/50 shot (if they're "FOB") that they'll offer a reference for a fertility doctor, assuming that's an obvious issue. They're just trying to be genuinely helpful, but we're closed-off enough in our personal interactions that it comes off as offensive to us and they perceive us as being cold. Try getting anything done in that region of the world without getting to know someone and starting off every phone-call or meeting with small talk about your family, the local sports match, etc. If you don't make an earnest effort to do that, you'll be perceived as cold.

On the same side of the coin where TGS grew up (in the north east iirc) is considered to be a lot more stand-offish and less welcoming or open to strangers than where I live down in Alabama.

100%. I don't take offense about it, just different cultures.

[P30]

Perfect example......or in most Germanic countries, attempting to sit down on public transit and saying "hi" to someone, attempting to make eye contact, offering a smile and asking if the seat next to them is open. Even interactions with personal associates can be a bit different...like asking someone to come over and watch a movie; that experience is going to be much more interactive in other cultures than with Germans.

I agree, talking to strangers on public transit is very rare in Germany. I would find it quite odd, if a stranger would start a conversation with me as if he was a friend. Two things come to my mind:

Quite a share - don't know the percentage - of Germans are in a "Verein" - "club" is the corresponding English term, I suppose. For example, a football club or a shooting club. This is where we are more open to each other and have nice talks.

I remember when I was in Spain with my motorbike waiting for the ferry to an island. There was another motorbiker, a Spaniard. It was very easy and pleasant for me to talk to him, probably because I felt, he was like-minded (also a motorbiker). We talked in English, it worked well.

Or, they might outright say that they don't consider you a friend and do not wish to come over. In the US and other western cultures, that would be extremely odd, direct and "dick-ish" to say, instead of just offering a polite declination that usually gets the point across.

I also find, this is rude. Have not done nor seen this here. I had a Chinese co-worker here in Germany for years. For example, we played tennis together with my cousin, who is a very good tennis player (trains it in a club since he was a little boy). Another time we went to a Chinese restaurant with some other co-workers. Very cool thing was that our company sponsored 4 VIP tickets for a great football match, when the Chinese left the company and Germany. It was a great time and now is a beautiful memory.

@TGS, wow, I'm reading between the lines that you have been in many countries and experienced several cultures. Cool, this makes life richer. I did not leave Europe, yet, but here I've been to quite some countries. Years ago, the Chinese offered me to visit him and his family in China. Has not come true yet, would be cool.

[P30]

Great tool:

deepl.com/write

I just started using it to improve my English. Works for German too.