Why no 1301 20 gauge

[Ben_G]

This is very interesting. Reading the tea leaves, I am going to say this translates to "not if, but when." Here is my reasoning. When we have discussed the 20 for defense in the past, the answer has been "no Flite Control, no semi that shoots as soft and is lightweight as a 1301 in 12." Now we have Flite Control, and a Beretta guy posting in the thread. With the Patrol and 1301 mods, Beretta clearly wants to keep its leadership in defensive shotguns. Finally, TC who has been posting in the new 20 Flite Control thread, and generally posts on defensive shotguns and Beretta, is conspicuous by his absence.

Y'all are reading wayyy too much between the lines on me haha. I saw a thread that was question about the 1301 and thought it'd be bad taste to ignore it since I'm active here.

I was a bit short on the answer because I'm flying out for SHOT tomorrow and there's a LOT flying around for last minute prep (it's pistols for me this year). I'd bet TC and MH are busy for similar reasons (I know MH is since I'm seeing him this weekend).

I thought no comment would be a safe funny answer but before this spins out: a less coy answer to the original question of:

So...you're telling me there is a chance?

Sure, I guess there is. There's no technical reason it wouldn't work, but I wanted to be clear it's not exactly a small technical resources lift to do right. If that project was going to happen there'd be a big capex requirement as well in order to get the furniture up to par with out current standards. All that means years of development work with an open schedule and as you'll all see next week, that team hasn't exactly been sitting on their hands.

I certainly like the concept of this kind of gun, and yes I've discussed it with folks in the past; I personally do think it'd be a neat little gun. I'll be very curious to see how the new federal load performs in the correct length barrel. I'm with you all on this personally, and it's neat seeing other thoughts on this type of gun that I hadn't considered.

Professionally though, I'm not in a position to say anything about the future officially one way or another. I can just comment on stuff from the past, present public items, and some SME side general industry info.

[Caballoflaco]

I wonder if there would be much of a market for a 21” Turkey/Upland 20gauge ?

At least with the dudes I know who Turkey hunt locally 20 gauge has been more popular than 12 for the last couple of years.

[LHS]

I've long said that the 20ga could be a nigh-ideal defensive shotgun IF the ammo question is fixed the way it has been for 12ga. With 20ga FFC on the horizon, I truly hope that we start seeing the top names in defensive scatterguns embrace it. That said, like Ben pointed out, it's not as easy as taking a chop saw to an a400 hunting gun. But I'm hoping that the advent of 20ga FFC can spur enough interest in the medium gauge to make it financially viable to introduce proper, modern, 20ga fighting guns.

[MickAK]

Professionally though, I'm not in a position to say anything about the future officially one way or another. I can just comment on stuff from the past, present public items, and some SME side general industry info.

Too late, I already told my wife and one of my dogs that's what they're getting for Christmas.

[MandoWookie]

When it comes to the 'what does 20 do that 12 can't?' & 'what's the market?'

Well, I have 2 recent trends to point to:
1: 10mm handguns.

2: 5.7x28 firearms.

I've never seen good arguments for either, yet 10mm has seen a revival that surpasses its original hype, & 5.7 has even more so seen success that is frankly befuddling considering how much different a gun it demands than even 10mm, which is usually just a rechambered .45.

Neither of these had the in built demand or history of 20ga, it was created by marketing.

[GJM]

Twenty gauge was always my favorite bird hunting choice, and I spent many a happy hour with a Beretta over and under 20 gauge behind a happy Vizsla.

[Lunker]

Twenty gauge was always my favorite bird hunting choice, and I spent many a happy hour with a Beretta over and under 20 gauge behind a happy Vizsla.

+1 on that 20 gauge and happy Vizsla for pheasant.
And a lightweight, light recoiling gun is an arthritic shoulder’s best friend.

[LHS]

FWIW, I talked to one of the ammo guys at Federal last week at SHOT.

This fellow told me that the 20ga load was engineered specifically to get 12"-15" penetration in calibrated gel, which is why they had to go with 1325fps rather than a more sedate velocity. He also said he was getting about a 10" pattern @ 25 yards out of one of the test shockwaves, which is pretty solid performance.

[mmc45414]

Years ago the local shop had a used 1187 20 gauge youth gun. I handled it a couple times but it was gone by the time I decided to buy it.

Just reread this and remembered I even had that exact thing bought once. I think I had a rifled slug barrel and a 21" youth barrel, and I liked the youth stock also. But some other shiny object distracted me and I sold it, now it holds a place in my Wish I Had Every Car, Gun And Motorcycle I ever Traded Away mantra...

[Wes Peart]

The argument against 20 gauge in a defensive shotgun has been the 1301 is lighter, recoils less, is better featured than 20 gauge shotguns, and launches Flite Control buck.

Seeing that Federal is releasing 20 gauge Flite Control, it makes me wonder why no 1301 in 20 gauge. It could be handier, recoil less than the 12, while still delivering effective buck loads. Plus, the Brenneke 20 gauge slugs are available.

There something your M2 20ga is coming up short in that makes you want a 1301 or is it just because?

Buying a 20ga gun with the intent of shooting FFC buckshot is a pretty poor idea given Federal's proclivities for discontinuing the best stuff they've come up with. I can see 20ga FFC going the way of their 8 pellet OO load or their FC #1 Buck load which was one of the best defensive buck loads ever made but that didn't stop them from shit canning it. I don't really like the idea of shooting buckshot in a 20 but I could get behind a semi 20ga SBS for chucking Brennekes at dangerous 4 and 2 legged mammals...