That’s our thinking too.Originally Posted by JHC
She has a Sabre air horn can that’s labeled “bear horn”. I think any canned air horn would work just as well.
https://a.co/eAkGSWu
That’s our thinking too.
She has a Sabre air horn can that’s labeled “bear horn”. I think any canned air horn would work just as well.
https://a.co/eAkGSWu
“There is no growth in the comfort zone.”--Jocko Willink
"You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
Missed this.
Warning shots are aggressive behavior intended to startle and frighten. If you're going to be aggressive you should be aggressive. That means moving forward. I wouldn't do it the way he did it because that can trigger a defensive charge but I do move forward confidently. Unless she already has the cubs up a tree in which case you either kill her or find another way around.
I don't know where the video was taken but there can be a big legal hassle involved in a DLP shooting and while I don't agree with the methods some people really don't want to orphan bear cubs and deal with legal repercussions.
The first time I saw a bear in Alaska I was walking with a guy who had a couple years experience up there. Upon seeing the bear he ran full speed straight at it. Being new, I ran with him. He chased it until it got up a tree then started climbing the tree after it and throwing rocks at it's nuts. When he connected the bear let out a bellow and took a big wet fish wormy shit all over his head (which was just justice IMO). When he came down he told me "Dern, that never happened before".
I guess the point of the previous story is that just because people have a lot of successful experience with something doesn't mean they have any idea what they're doing.
This by far the best thing I have ever read on the internet.
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
This happened a few miles from me.
https://bonnercountydailybee.com/new...f-defense-snp/
Just a few observations from a recent trip to the Kodiak archipelago with @Clusterfrack. While neither of us could claim to be an old Alaska hand, both have had fairly extensive experience with wilderness travel in areas where bears are present. With the exception of a 10-day backpack through the Coal Creek area of Glacier, all of my experience has been with black bears in the Sierra Nevada, Cascades, and Sawtooths. In my experience the PNW bears are wary; the Sierras are full of aggressive, human-habituated animals. We believed that species-specific behavior plus the remoteness of the location that we visited argued for a wary bear model to build our strategy around. That, like any safety regimen, is based on awareness and avoidance. To the extent that the terrain we travelled permitted, our routefinding avoided areas of dense cover or attractive forage. We maintained an awareness of the prevailing wind direction related to our direction of travel, and took ample advantage of the glorious silence of the place to listen for movement. When the environmental factors tilted agains us due to things like proximity to running water, wind noise or wind shifts we verbally acknowledged same and adjusted our alertness accordingly. The steepness of some of the terrain we travelled made the bill of my ball cap an impediment to forward vision, so I was at times forced to reverse my hat.
Guns were always going to be a part of the equation for us. We also discussed and researched the use of bear spray and concluded that it would not have a place in our kit, mainly due to the condition-specific requirements for its effective use. The outfitter for our transportation to and from the cabin was very spray-positive, but apparently missed the irony of self-immolation being part of an AAR they related about an attack being successfully interrupted by (full credit to the Forum member who coined this great phrase) blessing the deserving with the hot sauce. We remarked on several occasions in our time on the trail how unsuitable the conditions were for aerosol use.
So, guns. How big and how many? Handguns were going to be a given; based on anecdotes from folks with extensive experience we decided that long guns would add considerable value and would also be making the trip with us. We started to work toward a solution with the understanding that instantaneous incapacitation would almost certainly be required to reduce a critical encounter, either via CNS or skeletal damage. That meant that handgun ammo had to be capable of reliably penetrating a bruin's brain pan, which led me to Lehigh Defense's 10mm 190gr. monolithic copper penetrator. I was able to get them to run a bit better than 1100 fps. out of a G20 over Power Pistol in the time I had available to work up a load. Big thanks to @Clusterfrack who had done extensive work sorting out various reliability issues with that platform under heavy loads. At his suggestion I swapped the stock recoil spring assembly on my Gen. 3 pistol for a tungsten guide rod and 24# spring, as well as adding enhanced springs and shims from .460 Rowland. The gun ran like a champ for the 500 or so rounds I got through it before we departed.
For a long gun, I seized upon an actual excuse to add something that I've always kind of wanted and picked up a complete upper receiver in .458 SOCOM. There's a dearth of really good load development information available out there for that platform, as well as some horribly misguided information posted by people for whom "was not fragged by exploding upper receiver" and "no pressure signs" are apparently synonymous. I ended up with Lehigh Defense 302gr. penetrators running about 1800fps. I got right about 200 rounds downrange in the course of load development and practice. Magazines were a bit fiddly at first, but good old USGI 20 rounders soon rose to the top of the heap and ran flawlessly for me.
For optics, red dots on both platforms. A closed-emitter optic was recommended for the pistol due to the high likelihood of rain, so I went with a Holosun 509 ACSS. It took a little while for the chevron reticle to grow on me. It seemed to draw my eye to it at first, but once I figured out that it was trying to claw back some of my hard-won gains in target focus I got that sorted out. I think that I still prefer a simple dot, but with more time behind it I could very well feel differently. I did encounter the well-documented issue of the battery that ships with the optic being absolute crap. The backup solar panel functioned as advertised, but its performance is entirely dependent on the quality of the ambient light available. I ran an Aimpoint PRO on the carbine for its simplicity and reliability.
Carrying both guns on the trail along with a pack was something that took a little work to figure out. I've got a small mobility issue that requires me to walk with poles over uneven terrain, and I've found that the Kifaru GunBearer to be a great solution. I found my way to it though my disenchantment with scabbard-style packs at hike & shoot events, and while it is designed for full length rifles it worked just fine with a carbine. @Clusterfrack noticed that the position of the muzzle could lead to a serious facial injury in some fall scenarios, but that's about the only downside I'm aware of. The rifle was carried in a cruiser ready condition on the trail (bolt forward, chamber empty). I swapped the Kifaru muzzle retaining strap for an Atlas/Voile style elastic band for ease of use and security of retention. With practice it's possible to get the gun mounted from carry quickly and efficiently. I regularly reminded myself of the condition the gun was being carried in, but would have done well to have including the charging motion in more of my deployment practice work.
I settled on a chest rig for the G20. It's a compromise insomuch as its design emphasizes retention above ease of presentation, but I was able to develop a reasonably effective draw stroke by grasping the large buckle at the top of the harness with my support hand. It's not ideal with regard to proximity to the muzzle, but definitely a movement that can be performed without sweeping that hand, and clearly safer IMO than attempting to draw from a holster that wants to move with the gun. Awareness of your partner's location is critically important to performing a safe draw from this device. It carried exceptionally well with the pack, and wasn't vulnerable to hanging up in brush.
Last edited by Clusterfrack; 08-02-2022 at 02:10 PM.
"The older I get, the more I think that just staying home and drinking the good stuff by yourself is way underrated as a healthy practice." - Totem Polar
"An entire worldview devoted to being offside." - feudist
I don’t have a lot to add, other than some more pics to go with @JCL’s post. I carried my G20.4 in a Safariland ALS drop rig with a T-Rex leg strap. The draw position was close to my USPSA rig and felt very natural. Underbrush and branches treated the Acro p2 very roughly, and the optic had plant matter deep in every crevice. During one hike I had to belly crawl under a conifer thicket, and got hung up. I was worried about breaking the front lens, but it’s apparently fairly tough.
As @GJM commented earlier, carrying a shotgun on a steep hike gets old fast. I opted to leave the 1301 behind on our big 10.5hr day, and was glad I did—except for spotting a bear at a carcass from the peak, and having to hike back within 400yds of its location.
Last edited by Clusterfrack; 07-31-2022 at 08:22 PM.
“There is no growth in the comfort zone.”--Jocko Willink
"You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
Sounds like you two had a great trip!
A few thoughts. While the statistics suggest you probably only need to make the bear think you aren't an easy target, by some combination of warning or body shot, if the bear isn't impressed, you probably will need to strike the brain or spine. Fortunately most bears don't like to be hurt, and discontinue the attack without a CNS hit, or the stats would be much worse.
It is easier to be on full bear alert on a trip, than all year, and compromises end up being made. For my wife and I, unless we are hunting, it is one long gun between us, plus our individual handguns. That we we have the ability to split the load up easier. Whatever a field handgun will do, the Brenneke or rifle caliber projectile does much better. While there are exceptions, I want that long gun in my hands, because many attacks are abrupt.
In the part of AK you visited, deer season is one of the worst times for bears, because they have learned to associate gun shots with down deer!
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
Another issue was keeping my pants from falling down with packbelt over gunbelt. For those of us who suffer from CA (chronic asslessness), this is a constant concern in the best of conditions. I plan to try a low pro battlebelt that doesn’t go in the belt loops. Any ideas other than suspenders are most welcome.
“There is no growth in the comfort zone.”--Jocko Willink
"You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
Before answering that, I noticed you had a UBL or CUBL. I can't use those, because the hard plastic rubs on my hip. I use this set-up, or a variation on it. Even the paddle rubs me on a strenuous hike.
There is no perfect solution to the gun belt and pack belt. Add rain pants, and it goes from bad to worse. With a heavy pack, I mount a Safepacker to the waist belt, but every time you take your pack off, your pistol is on the pack. Even a chest rig competes with your sternum strap. A year ago, I got a Hill People pack that carries a reasonable load and does not have a waist strap. That is my favorite solution, and I will often carry my pistol AIWB with it.
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
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