The yellow star of gun ownership

[JDM]

I'll preface this with two things: I'm not a Jew, nor do I argue much on the Internet.

This is, in my opinion, in incredibly poor taste. The persecution the Jewish people have suffered over the last several thousand years is many orders of magnitude greater than the scrutiny we (as in modern American gun owners) find ourselves under today.

Nearly 7 million men, women and children were exterminated in the 1940s because they practiced a particular faith. We, at the very most, stand to lose ability to purchase rifles and pistols that can hold a specific number of bullets. There is a huge departure between these two things.

Now I am as staunchly pro 2A, and anti AWB as the rest of you guys. What I am not, is under the impression that our struggle is nearly as bad as what the Jewish people have persevered through. It's not in the same ballpark. Hell, it's not even the same game!

Do what you will, and being as though we live in the only country in the world where this freedom is still mostly guaranteed, I'm certain you will. However, 7 million dead is drastically different than no 30 round AR magazines.

Carry on.

[Suvorov]

I'll preface this with two things: I'm not a Jew, nor do I argue much on the Internet.

This is, in my opinion, in incredibly poor taste. The persecution the Jewish people have suffered over the last several thousand years is many orders of magnitude greater than the scrutiny we (as in modern American gun owners) find ourselves under today.

Nearly 7 million men, women and children were exterminated in the 1940s because they practiced a particular faith. We, at the very most, stand to lose ability to purchase rifles and pistols that can hold a specific number of bullets. There is a huge departure between these two things.

Now I am as staunchly pro 2A, and anti AWB as the rest of you guys. What I am not, is under the impression that our struggle is nearly as bad as what the Jewish people have persevered through. It's not in the same ballpark. Hell, it's not even the same game!

Do what you will, and being as though we live in the only country in the world where this freedom is still mostly guaranteed, I'm certain you will. However, 7 million dead is drastically different than no 30 round AR magazines.

Carry on.

I see your point and I agree that many will find it in bad taste or even offensive. I however strongly disagree with you that this is about being able to purchase rifles and +10 round magazines. This whole this is about doing as much damage to the 2A as possible with the end goal of taking away every firearm that has the ability to be used to resist tyranny. While I am not a Jew either, I am the first American born son of a family who witnessed over 20+ million slaughtered by their government, a government that shared the same basic ideology as the prime movers behind this current offensive on our rights. This offensive has been prepared with media battle plans drawn up years ago just waiting for the first big tragedy post November 2012 and the propaganda media brute squad they have created is enough to make Goebbels or Chairman Mao proud. While you are correct in the statement that we have not suffered on the same level as the Jews in the 1940s eventually did, that is quite frankly the direction we are heading if the folks stoking the fires have their way.

[Dagga Boy]

I am a Jew. My family came to this country to flee persecution in Europe. What was left was finished up by being buried alive by the Nazi's. They share the plight of many in that they are first disarmed, then they get to wear a little star and then they get herded somewhere to be exterminated. I would wear a Gun Owner yellow Star of David in a minute to remind people of what happens to stigmatising a group, especially a group you are targeting for disarmament. The bottom line is conservatives (especially of the "Tea Party" type) are being demonized by the media and our politicians, and blamed for everything bad in our country. If you can't see the similarities, you are blind. Yellow Stars and "Juden" in windows-maps showing where "the gun owners" live. Wanting all gun owners "registered". Where does it end.

This is really not about magazines anymore. Like everything in today's world, we are dealing in all or nothing in our "fundamental transformation". Do I pray that our economy doesn't collapse and our way of life comes to a grinding halt......yes. Am I prepared for possibility that we may have some major upheaval in our society and a response to that upheaval that is scary in many ways-yes.

[TGS]

In terms of sensitivities, if anyone wants to produce this patch it may be considerate to contact the Jews for the Preservation of Gun Ownership. Not that they're contracted by God to speak for all Jews, but it might be a good place to get an opinion from. They might back it completely, at which point it not only adds credibility to the idea being presented, but also allows you to "explain yourself" a little bit more reasonably if someone confronts you.

I think I appreciate the idea of the patch, because frankly it could help break the stigma of gun owners and those who care about the Constitution as being the flannel wearing, "ehrmagurd! dey took ur jerbs!" crowd. In addition, it adds context for people to understand why the 2nd Amendment exists, and how relevant it still is and always will be. But, of course, this idea is also fraught with the ability to be taken incorrectly out of context and/or piss people off.....which is why I would not recommend going forth with this unless you have JPGO's backing.

[TCinVA]

Speaking personally, the idea of a yellow star will be completely lost on the sort of people who need the lesson in the first place...so I don't see much of an upside to it.

[NETim]

Speaking personally, the idea of a yellow star will be completely lost on the sort of people who need the lesson in the first place...so I don't see much of an upside to it.

Sad but true. The Warsaw Ghetto uprising stands as a good example of what armed citizens with the right attitude can do. And I seriously doubt that our opposition is aware of this event. They've only time to tweet about killing NRA members.

http://www.history.com/topics/warsaw-ghetto-uprising

If anyone's interested, Leon Uris' book, "Mila 18" concerns this event and is a good read.

[Dagga Boy]

Sad but true. The Warsaw Ghetto uprising stands as a good example of what armed citizens with the right attitude can do. And I seriously doubt that our opposition is aware of this event. They've only time to tweet about killing NRA members.

Why Tweet when its already been published in the Des Moines paper.....

Donald Kaul retired earlier this year. Now he has decided to return to writing occasional opinion columns for OtherWords.org. The Sandy Hook Elementary School shooting in Newtown, Conn. brought out all his ugliness.
In a column that appeared after the shooting with the headline "Kaul: Nation needs a new agenda on guns," he proposed a new liberal agenda: repeal the Second Amendment, declare the NRA a terrorist organization and make membership illegal, and well, make violent threats to Republican leaders and NRA members. The Des Moines Register published this junk on December 29.

"I would tie Mitch McConnell and John Boehner, our esteemed Republican leaders, to the back of a Chevy pickup truck and drag them around a parking lot until they saw the light on gun control," he wrote. Is that a threatening James Byrd reference? "And if that didn’t work, I’d adopt radical measures," he continued.
This was how he spelled out the other agenda items, which included killing NRA members who wouldn't surrender their arms:

"Here, then, is my “madder-than-hell-and-I’m-not-going-to-take-it-anymore” program for ending gun violence in America:

• Repeal the Second Amendment, the part about guns anyway. It’s badly written, confusing and more trouble than it’s worth. It offers an absolute right to gun ownership, but it puts it in the context of the need for a “well-regulated militia.” We don’t make our militia bring their own guns to battles. And surely the Founders couldn’t have envisioned weapons like those used in the Newtown shooting when they guaranteed gun rights. Owning a gun should be a privilege, not a right.

• Declare the NRA a terrorist organization and make membership illegal. Hey! We did it to the Communist Party, and the NRA has led to the deaths of more of us than American Commies ever did. (I would also raze the organization’s headquarters, clear the rubble and salt the earth, but that’s optional.) Make ownership of unlicensed assault rifles a felony. If some people refused to give up their guns, that “prying the guns from their cold, dead hands” thing works for me."
The so-called "news" media love to blame conservatives for the declining civility of our democratic discourse, but the hateful venom spewed by supposedly enlightened liberals like Kaul is as vicious as it gets.
Publishing death threats is bad enough, but doing so in the name of promoting a more peaceful, compassionate society is beyond sick. But this clown will probably never realize the absurdity of his argument.


Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2013/...#ixzz2HIPhWJeU


I agree with with the JPFO. I will probably join this morning to spread my dollars around from the NRA that has gotten the lions share over the years.

[Kyle Reese]

Speaking personally, the idea of a yellow star will be completely lost on the sort of people who need the lesson in the first place...so I don't see much of an upside to it.

Yep- especially when some folks have never heard of the Japanese bombing Pearl Harbor in Dec 1941 (true story), yet they felt compelled to lecture me on the intricacies of the Israeli-Arab conflict(s), post 1948.

[TCinVA]

I think pointing out how dangerous that sort of rhetoric is...and going into great detail explaining just how ***CENSORED*** sick a ***CENSORED*** has to be to even think such a heinous thing is something we ought to be right on top of, and in the context of that conversation mentioning the yellow star briefly makes a damn fine point to a reasonable person. Most aren't reasonable.

Most don't think the way that ***CENSORED*** idiot does, or at least aren't so ***CENSORED*** stupid that they actually pen that nonsense, and if brought up most would simply say that he's a nutcase with silly rhetoric.

...because as a society when violent invective comes from the left we pretty much laugh "Those whacky lefties!" and ignore it. I mean, one of the president's buddies is an admitted terrorist. From the perspective of trying to cause someone who has been drinking from the fountain of the prevailing wisdom of our day, I don't believe the yellow star is going to cause sufficient mental reboot to make them reconsider whether or not what's prevailing is actually wisdom. I think it's more likely that they'll be put off by the indelicacy of placing yourself in with a picture of unimaginable oppression and horror.

I'm not saying that their takeaway is rational, only what I believe it's likely to be. I mean, if we were dealing with abundant reason none of this discussion would be happening in the first place.

If you actually have roots into the horrors of last century...as in you can name relatives who were victims of the Nazi atrocities...then it's a different story. You will have, I believe, a lot more latitude in the use of the yellow star and it might be a useful means of getting someone to listen to your point of view thoughtfully. For the rest of us I see it being perceived as trying to Godwin the conversation than an invitation to think the issue through.

[MechEng]

My $0.02.
Any type of comparison to the persecution of Jews would probably be taken in bad taste and come to bite us in the ass politically. If I were designing some type of patch to label myself I’d stay away from any Jewish symbolism like the Star of David and probably wouldn’t make it yellow. I’d make it square or rectangle; predominantly color it scarlet and just put NRA or RKBA on it. If someone is going to make any connection to Jewish persecution then let the moon bat liberal pundits make it.

Here is an idea, figure out a way subliminally plant the Jewish persecution comparison in “Gaffe-a-minute” Joe Biden’s head and let him say it.