Originally Posted by caleb
Is it a reasonable assumption that Bob Vogel could have had a good chance of finishing top 5, with a possible shot at closing the gap to "Eric-Land" if he had been on top of his game?
I don't follow USPSA very close but from what I have seen on TV Vogel looks like a cyborg with a glock.
Thank you! I appreciate the explanation, and the examples are very helpful.
I don't think so. I just went browsing around the USPSA results pages and think I can make sense of what I'm seeing.
Thanks again!
"If you run into an a**hole in the morning, you ran into an a**hole. If you run into a**holes all day, you're the a**hole." - Raylan Givens
Bob and Dave are typically about the same skill level.
In the top 5? Possibly. Vogel recently finished 5th in the Limited National Championship, a gnats hair behind Rob Leatham. Sevigny finished 2nd, but there wasn't much daylight between him and Vogel. Had Vogel finished just behind Leatham at the Production Nationals he would have been 5th.
Would Vogel have closed the 5% gap that was between Eric and Ben? No, not likely. He couldn't beat Leatham or Sevigny in Limited a few months ago (see above), so there's no reason to think he would have beaten them in Production. Vogel did beat Ben at the World Shoot in 2011 (in a close one, IIRC). I don't think Ben has been beaten since that World Shoot (except when his gun broke and not counting Eric's wins at the last two year's Production Nationals.) I don't know if Ben and Bob have gone head to head since the World Shoot, but there's no reason to think that Vogel is currently better than Ben, and certainly there is no reason to believe Vogel is significantly better.
No. Not common. Usually the National Championships are more competitive. At the Limited Nationals this year there were seven people within 5% of the winner. Eric won by a wide margin and it shows how good he is. Not just "Eric was the better man today" good, but rather "Eric and Ben could go head to head and Eric will win 9 out of 10 times (if not 10 out of 10). " That good.
Having said that, Sevigny won by 5% in 2010 (and beat Ben by 12%). Ben closed the gap the next year and won. I doubt that Ben has that much room for improvement these days.
You're welcome!
Cheers!
I think you're wrong - he's dedicated full time and has material support from Eric.
Kinda like:
Really? You think Ben will improve 12 percent on Sevigny in one year like he did from 2010 to 2011? (Yeah, that's how I wrote it and that's what I meant. Ben made the jump from middle tier GM in 2010 to top tier GM in 2011. He'll tell you that any improvements will be fewer and farther between and much harder to come by given the level he has reached.)
Heck, Ben didn't come any closer to beating Eric this year than he did last year, and lost some ground to the other Americans compared to 2011.
But maybe he had better competition this year. Last year the person finishing behind him was some A class shooter no one has heard of. This year Sevigny gave him all he could handle.
Last edited by Tirofijo2001; 10-22-2013 at 05:28 PM.
Yes.
I know.
He's spent 3 months with his new Tanfoglio. I think that may have had something to do with it.
I think so - everyone crawled out of the woodwork to shoot Production Nationals.
That's a bold prediction. We shall see.
Also I meant to write "lost ground to other Americans compared to 2012"
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