Why the P30

[GJM]

A properly trained person could run this HK cocked and locked. As one who cut his teeth on 1911s and DA/SA pistols like the Smith 39 series, I would not choose to carry the P30 cocked and locked. I see no advantage, and at the same time, I see a possible risk of ND. I'm not fearful of cocked and locked. I merely do not see the advantage. The properly trained individual would not be handicapped with a DA/SA pistol in my opinion. I was blessed with very large, strong hands and the opportunity to learn double action shooting from a master and on somebody else's dime. Hence my opinion may be biased. I learned here that safety concerns dictate decocking DA/SA pistols after firing during a defense shooting and while waiting for another opportunity to fire. That would not have been my practice but now would be. But, under no circumstances would I suggest switching back and forth between decocking and locking and cocking even though the HK in the post would permit doing so. Choose one or the other.

My concern with the P30 and USP thumb safety is not an ND, it is no discharge.

I get that. However, I feel the same could be said about a de-cock lever.

I could understand that thinking, but the decocker doesn’t bother me the same way.

[CDFIII]

One thing I noticed today and yesterday while shooting the V3s that riding the safety really seemed to help tie me into the gun a bit better( probably makes no sense but I get the same feeling when I run 1911's) than my LEM or standard V3. Another 200rds. today and I am still really liking it.Also as stated by DB the safety is nice for admin. handling. Plus it's always a nice advantage around little ones. I know that no weapon is child proof and never should be left unattended..period.
As far as carry I personally see it being no more of an issue than a 1911 and possibly safer than striker fired guns carried aiwb. Hammer can be held in same manner while holstering with safety on.

[CDFIII]

[QUOTE=GJM;680558]My concern with the P30 and USP thumb safety is not an ND, it is no discharge.
Meaning... you are afraid of not snicking the safety to the off position? At least that is the way I am reading it. Couldn't that be said about any pistol with a manual safety though including 1911 or the EDC9? Or is it something specific to the P30/USP you have noticed?

[willie]

I think he meant that he worried about flicking the safety with force sufficient enough to carry it through the decock position.

[hufnagel]

I think he meant that he worried about flicking the safety with force sufficient enough to carry it through the decock position.

P30's don't decock through the safety lever.

[willie]

Thanks for correcting that.

[Jaywalker]

... I would not choose to carry the P30 cocked and locked. I see no advantage...

For you, there is no advantaged to cocked and locked, but that doesn't mean others might find an advantage you don't. For those with shorter fingers there is a huge advantage. Personally, I wear a golf glove in size "Medium Large Cadet," which means a medium large hand but with shorter fingers; golf shops sell a ton of those things, which means there are a bunch of shooters who could potentially benefit from a shorter trigger reach than the standard DA/SA that Sig, H&K, and Beretta 92 series allow.

I bought two P30 pistols recently, a P30SK with v1 LEM and a P30S v3 DA/SA with a safety in order to evaluate both. I prefer the full-sized DA/SA, but since there's no trigger reach shortener (à la v4.1 for the LEM) for the v3, I will likely carry it cocked and locked. I'll carry it that way until I decide whether to invest in some serious gunsmithing that might lighten the DA stroke enough to possibly make up for my lack of leverage in DA. After that, possibly I'll agree with you.

[GJM]

[QUOTE=CDFIII;680579]

My concern with the P30 and USP thumb safety is not an ND, it is no discharge.
Meaning... you are afraid of not snicking the safety to the off position? At least that is the way I am reading it. Couldn't that be said about any pistol with a manual safety though including 1911 or the EDC9? Or is it something specific to the P30/USP you have noticed?

When my hands grasp a 1911, use of the safety is ingrained after decades of shooting them. Almost every other handgun I shoot is striker, DA/SA or LEM without a thumb safety, hence the potential for confusion when a particular P30 has a safety, and my half a dozen other of them do not. The other issue is I have trained myself to place my dominant thumb over the base of my support thumb, as I recently saw a photo of Kyle Defoor demonstrating, so as not to bump slide stop levers inadvertently. Using the thumb safety requires me to change my drawstroke, slowing me down considerably, and is the reason I prefer DA hammer down to SA cocked and locked on the P30.

[A-Train]

Depends which model. For the ones that have a rear decocker.....super rare. I have a P30LS. One of 500 brought in the US (500 in 9mm 500 in .40).

To do the HK45 series guns is easy. My HK45 full size guns are set up as V1's with safety's and serve in the bedside/home defense role with an X300U. Because it is stored off body and will be likely grabbed in an emergency in the dead of night, it is stored safety on. I look at as a bit of an extra measure for unauthorized access. If I went back to uniformed cop work, this would likely be my duty gun as well. I started using safety's for off body stuff when working a protection detail with VIP kids at a school. Water that extra layer of security for my secondary bag gun or my primary if I got hurt or separated from a pistol. The DA/SA with a safety activated on the bag gun on the pair of HK45C's I was using along with the P7 I had in my chore coat pocket gave me a better feeling if a kid for some reason got access to the gun. I was unique in that approach as most of my co-workers carried Glocks and didn't give a crap. Simply different mindset and outlook's on trying to mitigate bad outcomes.

For most normal use, I do not use a mechanical safety while carrying the gun except with 1911 or BHP. One thing I really like about the HK safety is I can safe the gun during administrative handling. I consider that a solid positive.

This is a great post and I agree 100%. I wish I had picked up one of those P30LS with the LEM during the very few times I’ve seen them available on the HKPro Forum.

Unfortunately I had to settle for having my HK competent gunsmith buddy converting my three P30S DA/SA pistols to the LEM trigger, retaining the safety, and removing the thumb decocker. The bad news is that wasn’t cheap after buying the parts (if you can find them in stock anywhere) and paying even my buddy to do the work. Add to that fact, that as someone mentioned, HK doesn’t sanction or recognize this particular modification and it probably voids my warranty, I’m not sure the conversion is for everyone.

That being said I love, love, love the P30 in this configuration. The LEM trigger gives a striker-esque consistent trigger pull every time, with a more forgiving action for most real world high stress situations and the added peace of mind of a manual safety for all that administrative handling that occupies about 95% of most people gun touching time. It also makes me feel better with my three kids, or anyone one else around, if One of my guns is off-body (although my kids they have all been shooting and know better). It’s my perfect handgun.

After serving in the Army for 12 years I’ve seen enough AD’s due to stuff getting caught in the trigger guard during holstering, forgetting to decock, sloppy or exhausted administrative gun handling, etc... to know that properly used safeties can and will prevent accidents if used properly.

I also feel they don’t dramatically slow down most well trained and practiced shooters enough to make a significant difference in time on target. Everyone thinks they are going to be in some kind of quick draw situation where they need to engage multiple bad guys in some movie-like shootout. I think most police statistics don’t bear that out. Situational awareness will keep you out of 99.9% of those type of rare situations. If a couple fractional seconds is going to be the difference between life and death I’ve probably placed myself in a really bad situation I shouldn’t be in anyway.

I, for one, am someone that is a big fan of manual safeties and to couple that with the LEM trigger is about as close to a perfect combination as I could hope for. I just wish HK would make the regular P30S in that option from the factory, or at least support the conversion for those that choose to make it.

[Ichiban]

Don't know if this is allowed (I assume it will be deleted and I will be chastised if that's the case) and I have no affiliation with the seller, but this popped up on the local ArmsList listings today.

http://www.armslist.com/posts/700744...-and-extra-mag