Who to Train With...?

[The Dreaming Tree]

So, I've been shooting regularly for about a year now, and believe I've come as far as possible without training (nowhere near perfect, just hit a plateau of "What am I doing wrong, now?!?"). I've decided to take a handgun class and have found three in my "area" this spring. My biggest issue is: which one do I take? My options are:

Larry Vickers Level-1 Handgun
Pat McNamara TAPS Pistol
Magpul Dynamics Dynamic Handgun I (I don't know who's teaching now).

I've been a member on here for a little bit, mostly lurking in the shadows, and am now looking for advice. All three are two day classes, fairly close in price, and equidistant from home. I've read multiple AARs from each of them, and have no idea what's best for me, though.

Thoughts?

[Default.mp3]

IMHO, just pick which is the most convenient/cheapest for you and go with it. Or, the one that's least likely for you to see again. If you had consistently been taking classes with, say, Mr. Vickers, then yeah, it would make a lot of sense to branch out to other trainers just to see what else is out there, but since you've never had any real formal training, I don't think it really matters who you're choosing, since all three, as far as I know, are solid, reputable courses that have had positive feedback consistently. To me, this sounds something like trying to pick between a Colt, BCM, and a Daniel Defense for a first AR: yeah, there are differences, but for your first time, you won't really notice anything different, and all three would be solid picks regardless. It's not like you're trying to choose between TAPS, Combat Focus Shooting, and American Defense Enterprises' Combat Handgun I here.

[DocGKR]

Pat McNamara is hard to beat--he will make you think and definitely challenge you. However, if you have never had any training, all will be a good addition to your knowledge base.

[Mitchell, Esq.]

Southnarc.

Get a realistic idea of what a bad situation is, and then you can base your training on that premise.

[Shellback]

Since you're in Las Vegas I would recommend Progressive FORCE Concepts for a local training outfit. I've taken a half dozen classes from them and will continue to do so. On March 23rd they have a Handgun 1 class that I've attended and would recommend.

In fact I just attended Practical Knife Skills with Chris Fry at PFC this past weekend.

If you're interested I'll be hosting Southnarc here in Vegas in April. ECQC Vegas thread.

[jlw]

Establish a relationship with someone locally that you can trust and who can worth you to bring you forward from your current skill level.

[cclaxton]

So, I've been shooting regularly for about a year now, and believe I've come as far as possible without training (nowhere near perfect, just hit a plateau of "What am I doing wrong, now?!?"). I've decided to take a handgun class and have found three in my "area" this spring. My biggest issue is: which one do I take? My options are:

Larry Vickers Level-1 Handgun
Pat McNamara TAPS Pistol
Magpul Dynamics Dynamic Handgun I (I don't know who's teaching now).

I've been a member on here for a little bit, mostly lurking in the shadows, and am now looking for advice. All three are two day classes, fairly close in price, and equidistant from home. I've read multiple AARs from each of them, and have no idea what's best for me, though.

Thoughts?

Your choice should also reflect the goal of your training. I think of them in three categories:
1) Concealed Carry;
2) Competition;
3) Fighting Tactics;

Since you are in Vegas, consider Frontsight for the Concealed Carry...their 4-day Handgun is excellent. They also provide really great lectures on legal and liability, etc.
For Competition you probably want to choose someone like Vogel or Anderson or Todd Green or a course designed to teach competition, such as USSA in Tulsa.
I don't know many of the fighting tactics trainers, but there are a lot of very good individual trainers and good businesses that do that kind of training.

I recommend starting with Concealed Carry training unless you know you want Competition or Fighting Tactics.

CC

[Kevin B.]

Pat McNamara is hard to beat--he will make you think and definitely challenge you. However, if you have never had any training, all will be a good addition to your knowledge base.

Pat would be my first choice as well. LAV would be a close second. Either will provide you with a solid, practical skill set.

[YVK]

If you're going to do this regularly, you'll be better of figuring your own system of class selection, rather than asking for recs on case by case basis.
Here is what I look at

- The instructor has to be or have been a student of a pistol himself. This means spending a lot of time of his own behind the gun. Coming from military or LE by itself doesn't cut it as it doesn't mean that he received a lot of training and needed to pass stringent competency standards. Using your examples, LAV and Mac are from a unit that probably spends more time with pistol than any mil unit, while not knowing who is teaching for MD makes it a nonstarter for me until I know.

- The instructor has to have a reputation of being able to teach.

- The last part is what CC alluded to - you need to know what is the curriculum and intended goals. I don't think Southnarc is going to make you shoot from 40 yards, and I don't think LAV has Craig's experience of real life concealed carry application.

Specific bullet point in regards to what's been mentioned above
- most former Delta guys will have you spend a lot (in relative sense) of time shooting slow at long distance, working out fundamentals. LAV spends more time than Mac on basic manipulations, Mac has some interesting drills. Both have a ton of knowledge. For a true starters class I'd take LAV, but Mac's class to me had a wider breadth of discussion and tasks. Both are money well spent.
- Todd's class has nothing to do with competition. In fact, I read a report of competitive shooter complaining that he didn't get much out of it for competition's sake. if you can meet the skill pre-reqs, I highly recommend it.
- If Ernest Langdon restarted teaching, I would recommend it without reservation.
The above recs are made on a basis of personal experiences, there are a couple of names that I am confident will be great too, but I've not trained with them myself. If you're interested in my personal non-recommendations, you can pm me.

[GJM]

Lots of good choices mentioned previously, and I would add Manny Bragg and Robert Vogel to the list.

A one on one tutorial with Manny Bragg at Universal Shooting Academy in FL is the shooting equivalent of getting an all day head to toe physical.