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Thread: Any time, any place

  1. #1
    Site Supporter MDS's Avatar
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    Any time, any place

    I was checking into the range a couple of days ago, when a woman shot herself. Some dudes came out into the store area yelling about a gsw. Several folks started dialing 911. I unzipped my BOK compartment and took the contents into the range area. I'll skip the detailed visuals, but it did not look promising. There were two people kneeling with her, who seemed to know about as much as I did - i.e., not much. I had nothing additional to offer except the stuff from my BOK. One of the dudes kneeling had his hand on the chest wound, I gave him the Olaes bandage. A cop arrived, an off-duty paramedic started to help, too. I got out of the way, the bus showed up and took her away. The debriefing and paperwork ensued. The off-duty paramedic told me later that the bandage almost made the difference. I guess that's something.

    For a while, it looked like this might have been an accident - the gsw was in the chest, and there was some ill-advised malfunction clearance happening right before the gsw. The woman left a note for her family, though, so this is being ruled a suicide. That makes me feel a lot better, for some reason.

    I've signed up for the first BLS class I could attend in my area, and will sign my wife up for one soon after. I'll look for additional training after that - I'm especially interested in the WFR cert, it seems like a good combo of prevention, trauma from mild to serious, and outdoor-relevant skills, without a bunch of EMT stuff that I won't be able to use. I'll reconsider my BOK, maybe add some simple gauze as well as the Olaes.

    I've been getting sloppy with my range trips - heading out not quite early enough, so that the place isn't as empty as I like. I'm reasonably comfortable, for example, at the NRA range when it's full, because while the RSO's aren't perfect, they're at least somewhat vigilant. There's no public range I know of within an hour of me that allows holster and rapid fire, and is also RSO'd in any meaningful way. My AO has a, ah, "higher than average yahoo saturation level." I'll be more careful about the timing of my range trips in the future.

    ........

    Don't really know what I'm offering here with this post. Hey, guys, listen up: guns and gun ranges can be dangerous! I guess, if you guys can think of any other useful lessons from this, I'd love to hear them.
    The answer, it seems to me, is wrath. The mind cannot foresee its own advance. --FA Hayek Specialization is for insects.

  2. #2
    Site Supporter CCT125US's Avatar
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    I always request an end slot so that I only have one direction to watch. Does not always work out though. I also ask for the rifle range with the thought process being it takes more movement and therefore is more visible to manuever a rifle out of the shooters box.
    Taking a break from social media.

  3. #3
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    Rough day.

    Good work on going to the aid of others.

  4. #4
    Site Supporter SeriousStudent's Avatar
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    Many moons ago, I used to drive a big white bus, and then ride in a big orange choppa.

    Something along the lines of a military 9-line card would be a good idea, along with printed instructions on how to treat a gunshot wound. The reason I say this is, what happens when some booger-eater shoots you, the most skilled care provider? Want to stir angst and concern in the platoon? Shoot the medic first.

    Wilderness First Responder, after a simple first aid class, is a personal favorite of mine. My reasoning is that they are very good at teach improvisation. Knowledge trumps gear every time. People will flail about, looking for precisely the correct piece of gauze, when there is a perfectly good fresh kitchen towel within arm's reach. WFR and WEMT teaches you what to do with what you have.

    Good on you, having a kit and helping out. That's a great thing in today's society.

    I'm shooting at a new range now, which is out in the boonies. If someone occupies the same space-time coordinates as a bullet, it's going to be an hour helo ride to a Level 1 trauma center. My gear reflects this. If this fits you as well, don't forget signalling gear and GPS coordinates of the range. I want to be able to get the pilot's attention, as well as provide info on wires, wind speed and direction.

    You may want to look into local CERT training, or any volunteer or reserve EMS work. Those folks can be very helping in regards to training and potential gear choices.

    Again, thanks for stepping up.

  5. #5
    Very Pro Dentist Chuck Haggard's Avatar
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    I've never had to treat a GSW off duty, but I have had to treat people at the scene of several MVAs during the course of a road trip, including one that had a squirting artery involved.

  6. #6
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    For those in some smaller/more rural communiites the locals will provide free EMT training in exchange for a commitment to work the ambulance for s certain amount of time. A good chance to get some good training and experience at little cost and learn a trade while helping your community.
    "PLAN FOR YOUR TRAINING TO BE A REFLECTION OF REAL LIFE INSTEAD OF HOPING THAT REAL LIFE WILL BE A REFLECTION OF YOUR TRAINING!"

  7. #7
    Site Supporter MDS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SeriousStudent View Post
    Something along the lines of a military 9-line card would be a good idea, along with printed instructions on how to treat a gunshot wound.
    Good idea! I'll figure something out and post what I come up with here.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeriousStudent View Post
    Wilderness First Responder, after a simple first aid class, is a personal favorite of mine. My reasoning is that they are very good at teach improvisation. Knowledge trumps gear every time.
    Cool, that was my impression, I'm glad to have it verified, even if only on the Internet. The worst part of this was feeling like an ASS for not having gotten on at least my BLS this year - it's such an easy thing and if my most recent BLS wasn't 20 years ago I might have been able to help more. Totally in sync with the bolded above.

    Quote Originally Posted by SeriousStudent View Post
    You may want to look into local CERT training, or any volunteer or reserve EMS work. Those folks can be very helping in regards to training and potential gear choices.
    Quote Originally Posted by David Armstrong View Post
    For those in some smaller/more rural communiites the locals will provide free EMT training in exchange for a commitment to work the ambulance
    Absolutely. I'm planning on moving to CO this year, I'm hoping for some volunteer firefighting opportunities.

    Thanks for the ideas!

    ETA: FWIW, she was taken to a respected level 1 trauma center a mile away.
    Last edited by MDS; 12-29-2012 at 09:14 PM.
    The answer, it seems to me, is wrath. The mind cannot foresee its own advance. --FA Hayek Specialization is for insects.

  8. #8
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    Getting training is always a good thing.

    I've had my Wilderness EMT certification for going on a decade now and I've keep it current. I never understood gunshot/massive trauma and what to do and how to do it well until I took a dedicated two day class dealing with that stuff. The collective understanding of what to do has also advanced a lot in the last 10 years.

    Good job stepping up and helping and also not getting in the way.

    The thread is a good reminder to keep the skills and materials close at hand.

    Prayers and healing to the woman and her family, good reminder to be checking up with the people we love.

    Cookie Monster

  9. #9
    I spent roughly 7 years as a volunteer EMT, donating literally thousands of hours per year doing so. By far the most rewarding thing I've ever done. I wish I was still in an area that used volunteers, as I'd still be doing it.

    Edit: I should go on to say the catalyst for my starting was coming up to an auto accident and having zero clue what to do. I felt so ineffectual, and never wanted to be that way again.

  10. #10
    Site Supporter SeriousStudent's Avatar
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    The best way to learn to treat gunshot wounds is to treat lots of gunshot wounds. I was (fortunate enough to be?) assigned to a crew in an area that was rife with unlicensed pharmacists. That amount of cash attracts attention, and bullets, and knives.

    If you do get on with a volunteer crew, they may let you do observation in an ER, or do ride-alongs. Check with your local law enforcement agencies, they may also have a ride-along program.

    If you have an opportunity to chat with some of the Army medics or Navy corpsman that have experience in Iraq and/or Afghanistan, they may also help you. Or they may not, some people change paths, and leave things in the past. Tis' understandable when they do.

    Cookie Monster is absolutely correct about the major strides made in the last ten years. When I was a paramedic, they had just taken away our leeches, and started this new stuff called "gauze". Clotting agents and TQ's are two major changes, that you have likely seen in your BOK. Ten years ago? No way.

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