The Case Against Shotguns

[Lon]

California POST complicated this for us here by staying with the shotgun training requirement for Basic Academies. Since we HAD to train our folks with Shotguns, and the Patrol Rifle course was an additional 30 hrs, that made the decision easy for our command.

Our state curriculum also requires the shotgun be taught. I wish they’d change that. Make the shotgun an option and replace it with the AR. Put that on the hiring agency if they desire.

[PNWTO]

Our state curriculum also requires the shotgun be taught. I wish they’d change that. Make the shotgun an option and replace it with the AR. Put that on the hiring agency if they desire.

A major agency here that runs its own academy has simply turned the final shotgun day of the syllabus into a recreational "let's chill for a bit and hammer clay pigeons and end with a class barbecue and potluck."

They shoot some Qs with slugs and buck for the first day, but they no longer issue shotguns so they have just embraced it as a morale and bragging rights piece.

[Coyotesfan97]

The agency I breifly worked for issued an AR and a shotgun with 8 pellet FFC to every car. During FTO I told several of the trainers I was comfortable with the 12 and would take it if needed. All of them were surprised because they hated it. I grew up shooting clays, turkey hunting, and deer hunting. Even with the difference between that world of shotguns and social use there is a lot of carry over. I'm comfortable with the basic manipulations and bead sights. That alone put most of the guys out of the shotgun camp. Add in the recoil and relatively low capacity and most don't see the benefit. Just as much they aren't "tacticool" in media. Young cops tend to idolize elite military guys. So they see the drawbacks, recoil, and no cool dudes using it. Then they don't grasp that it can often be the best tool for their job.

As far as longevity... I know I left the job because of the hours. It's a blast to arrest bad guys, the fun is worth the paperwork, and I genuinely enjoyed it. Some of the coworkers are bitter and burned out, but the young kids are hard chargers. Some of the supervisors are assholes and some are good. Basically they're people. But 12 hour shifts turning into 16 isn't sustainable for a family man. Add in days off with court, getting your car to the shop, and a 45 minute commute so you don't shit where you eat... The job has to be your entire life if you want to do it right and give a damn. And that doesn't stack up favorably against my wife and 8 year old. When I knew it wasn't going to last I pulled the plug pretty quick.

When I started no one seemed to like shotguns. I did a lot of quail and dove hunting. On FTO I put five slugs into the center ring at fifty yards and it impressed the guys on the squad, probably the only time. LOL

They were only in supervisor’s cars. We had 870s with rifle sights. I love shotguns. Somehow I was able to convince my Sergeant to let me carry one. I was the only Officer I knew who was taking one. I loved slugs so I loaded the tube with slugs and carried buck on the sidesaddle.

When I got on SWAT the new guys carried 870s which didn’t bother me. I had one until I was senior enough to rate an MP5. I saw one suspect get destroyed with a 12 gauge on a callout.

Then 870s got switched to LL and I still carried one.

Cop work is a job that suits single people better. I was lucky that my wife wanted to quit and be a stay at home mom. That let me do a lot of cool SWAT and K9 stuff.

[xtrtsqrt11]

Been with my Department since '98. We still currently have quals with the issue 870 and it is a major issue for a significant percentage of our officers. It is involved in initial training and only annually requalified being in Corrections. When I was younger and until I got injured, I spent 8.5 years on the tactical team, now called SWAT. We had two MP5s on my team, so the vast majority of training was with 870s as the entry weapon. So, spending a lot of that tactical training with 870s, along with going through a Rob Haught two-day course, makes me very comfortable with the shotgun. I am in a severe minority though.

Within it's envelope, it is my preferred choice over any 5.56 rifle. It is a rather narrow envelope though, we only issue 9 pellet FFC for duty, no slugs though. Transport doesn't have slugs either last time I checked. If I was on Transport, I would make a headache of myself with management since IMO, having to engage someone in a car is a significant threat in the area where shot guns are used.

We have been saddled with Mini 14s, while a decent rifle, I am glad that we are transitioning FINALLY to ARs. SWAT only uses shotguns for LL, their use has been underwhelming. I would much rather have a 40mm direct impact instead, at least that has been more effective.

With staff of various sizes, the shotgun loading and unloading, manipulation, reloads, training in general is just not practiced enough to be anywhere close to muscle memory much less familiarity. We still have them for the time being, but I wouldn't be surprised if someday in the next decade they were discontinued.