M&P Competitor Accuracy and Expectation Management

[45dotACP]

Yah whoever said the 2.0 "fixed" the 1.0 accuracy issues is only telling half the truth.

The Apex was necessary for my pistol to do less than 4 inches at 20 yards.

But now it shoots like this at 20 yards with magtech and blazer brass.

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[Jim Watson]

A friend said his slide to (aluminum) receiver fit was sloppy, accuracy poor. After two go arounds with SW warranty clerk, he traded it for a Canik.

[G19Fan]

I recently got a new M&P 9 2.0 mid size. It’s one of the early curved trigger optics ready ones. After mounting a dot on it I took it to the range for some accuracy testing at 25y from a rest. These are the 5 shot groups I measured ( a few of them I didn’t even bother, they were that bad)

147g Speer GD - 4.1”
124g Speer GD - 3.2”, 3.65”
124g Norma FMJ - 3.95”
115g BH TAC - 2.43”

If I hadn’t got such a good deal on it, I would send it down the road. I like the ergos better than the Glock, even though it is a little wider, and the ability to add a safety. The stock trigger is also better.

Again, since I got it so cheap, I decided to try the apex barrel and see what that does.

The apex barrels are amazing

I wish apex made p365xl barrels

[60167]

I just ordered an Apex Barrel. The following statement is mostly copium:


At least these guns are inexpensive enough that it's not too much of a stretch to buy an aftermarket barrel to significantly improve accuracy. The total all-in cost is still less than a 2011 or a Shadow 2 or whatever.

[Up1911Fan]

I just ordered an Apex Barrel. The following statement is mostly copium:


At least these guns are inexpensive enough that it's not too much of a stretch to buy an aftermarket barrel to significantly improve accuracy. The total all-in cost is still less than a 2011 or a Shadow 2 or whatever.

I fit Apex barrels 3 and 4 today. I personally love the M&P platform with a few tweaks.

[NC_BRP]

I've found the accuracy of my 4" Apex'd M&P (semi-fit) to be on par with my G47.... Not better, not worse. In that respect, I regret putting the time/money into adding the flat trigger and Apex barrel because I shoot my GPT'd G47 just as well if not better at less overall cost. (Glock's factory Gen 5 barrels are fantastic.) And believe it or not, the Glock ergos actually work better for me than the M&P. YMMV. S&W's recent QC isn't inspiring and I don't think the move to TN helped. My M&P 2.0 OR pre-dates the move...

YMMV. Is it a good gun? Yea. Never had a single failure of any type and the same with my Shield 2.0. Every round ever time.

That said, my next gun is probably another G47 or a G26. The Glock works for me and that's not a bad place to stop.

[45dotACP]

I just ordered an Apex Barrel. The following statement is mostly copium:


At least these guns are inexpensive enough that it's not too much of a stretch to buy an aftermarket barrel to significantly improve accuracy. The total all-in cost is still less than a 2011 or a Shadow 2 or whatever.

I mean...yeah I do huff a little copium time to time....but you can find a 1.0 for less than 300 bucks pretty easily...I've seen them for less than 250 some places.

The M&P has been awesome for me.

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[mizer67]

For comparison, I have access to a double digit number of Gen 5 Glocks, all of which are equipped with optics and have been accuracy tested off a rest with numerous handloads using mostly HAP, XTP, and Gold Dot bullets as well as a mix of factory ammo. I have also tested the same set of Glocks using KKM barrels.

While there are some notable exceptions with particular pistols and loads, I would broadly classify the sample set of Gen 5 Glocks I have tested as grouping 4" at 25 yards with OEM barrels. Interestingly, accuracy with OEM barrels was inversely correlated with barrel length, with the G45 samples being the most accurate, the G47 samples being slightly less accurate, and the G34 samples being by far the worst across almost all loads tested.

I had 5 M&Ps at one point. They were all 1.0's though. I sold them because they were not accurate and while I'm tempted to dive back in because I like them, this thread reminds me why I sold them off.

I shoot Gen 5 Glocks quite a bit and shoot at 25 yards ever time I'm at the range. My experience has been the Gen 5's are all about 2" at 25yds. over 10 rounds, with my practice load of 124 gr PD JHPs. They're really impressive and significantly better than 4" guns.

I mainly shoot G34s and before that G17s. I've not shot my 47, 45 or 19s as extensively, but don't notice a significant accuracy difference at 25 yds. They take more concentration to shoot well than something heavier with a lighter trigger, but will keep up with much more expensive pistols in the accuracy dept.

[Doge]

I understand your sentiment about the Competition model using what appears to be the same barrel as the baseline M&P, but in my experience match barrels can cause reliability issues which the market is unforgiving of.

For comparison, I have access to a double digit number of Gen 5 Glocks, all of which are equipped with optics and have been accuracy tested off a rest with numerous handloads using mostly HAP, XTP, and Gold Dot bullets as well as a mix of factory ammo. I have also tested the same set of Glocks using KKM barrels.

While there are some notable exceptions with particular pistols and loads, I would broadly classify the sample set of Gen 5 Glocks I have tested as grouping 4" at 25 yards with OEM barrels. Interestingly, accuracy with OEM barrels was inversely correlated with barrel length, with the G45 samples being the most accurate, the G47 samples being slightly less accurate, and the G34 samples being by far the worst across almost all loads tested.

The KKM barrels provided a significant accuracy improvement on the G34s and a moderate improvement on the shorter barrel Glocks, with most of the pistols shooting around 2" to 2.5" at 25 yards with KKM barrels. However, nearly all the cycling failures I have encountered while running Glocks over the past five year have been with KKM barrels.

I have performed similar testing on a set of OZ9 Glock clones which ship from the factory with match barrels on par with KKM. The OZ9 has a reputation for being notably less reliable than Glock, and from my testing I believe much of that is due to their match barrels.

Ironically, I went with KKM because I had a gen4 Glock 34 a while back that wasn't grouping as tight as I wanted to, and the KKM fixed the issue. I didn't have any issues with reloads and factory ammo with that gun, and I also ran a reduced recoil spring weight. Maybe that might explain some of your cycling failures.

The OZ9 match barrels are sometimes cut weirdly, and the early ones were notorious for breaking. As for the Competitor and Match barrels, I did notice that the tolerances on my two competitor slides were pretty sloppy, and of course, the volume of parts made explains that so S&W can crank out reliable guns en masse. I do think that there is room on the table for a performance-branded gun to have better accuracy; a good example is the XDm 5.25 with very accurate match barrels, even to the point where people were earning EIC and Distinguished badges with them with just trigger job and front sight change.

[Doge]

I mean...yeah I do huff a little copium time to time....but you can find a 1.0 for less than 300 bucks pretty easily...I've seen them for less than 250 some places.

The M&P has been awesome for me.

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I was going bananas for a bit and annoyed at the copium, mainly because I already have many M&P mags and holsters for the two guns. I picked the M&P because of the ergos and deal I got them for. I didn't really care for the 320 (that is a whole can of worms I don't feel like opening) and noticed that with Glock, my index was different, going from Glocks to 2011/1911s and Berettas, which I already have. I did mull on the Canik and was recommended the PDP SF/Match, but I didn't care about the aesthetics of them.