I just had a ludicris idea

[BBMW]

I know about Metal Storm, this is the same basic concept. My big difference is that I'm trying to implement is in a way that could work with existing revolvers, and not require a new gun built around the concept.

So a Metal Storm .357 revolver?

(poor quality video)

[willie]

The balls would leave the cartridge at the same time with both hitting the target together. Of course, there's dispersion.
They spread out with distance. The two together would have lower velocity and much less kinetic energy than a regular factory load. Also they take up much space in the case. With these there is no hot load because pressure increases rapidly with increases in charge. There's no room in the case to use slow powders. Fast powders have rapid pressure increase as charge increases.

The 444 rifle cartridge has a "long" oal. Some guys did make sensible multi ball defense loads with this round in Marlin lever gun. I thought they were sensible, but not all would agree it's me. You see, whatever is gained might be negated by the fact you now have a very short range rifle. A 12 ga pump shotgun beats any such gimmick.

Live and learn and blow up a gun or two. I destroyed only one gun in my career if you don't count bubba gunsmithing with a power tool.

[Jim Watson]

Take a .357 magnum case and set it up so that it can fire two bullets, not simultaneously, but one with each strike of the primer.

John Walch did it in 1859. Louis l’Amour used it in a story.

There was a .357 Quad load at one time, 4 wadcutters stacked, all fired at the same time. They would take the rifling.

I believe it used a .357 maximum case , cut to the length of bored out cylinder chambers .

I think Evan Marshal wrote about it.

Yup, the Quadramaximum, devised by some gunzine writers. Reamed out a SAA cylinder and used a 3” Storekeeper’s barrel. Put it in a coffin shaped case.

[Joe in PNG]

The problem is that you need to use the existing hammer & firing pin to make a primer pocket go bang twice. I suspect that there's plenty of potential for the wrong part of the cartridge to go bang when it's not supposed to.

[BBMW]

I have an idea how that will work. The big trick will be to get the primer behind the first projectile to go off when the piezo thingy in the primer pocket gets hit by the firing pin without setting off the primer behind the second projectile.

The problem is that you need to use the existing hammer & firing pin to make a primer pocket go bang twice. I suspect that there's plenty of potential for the wrong part of the cartridge to go bang when it's not supposed to.

[BBMW]

That explicitly what I DON'T want. This is NOT a shot shell. It should only fire one projectile per trigger pull. But it can be fired twice.

The balls would leave the cartridge at the same time with both hitting the target together. Of course, there's dispersion.
They spread out with distance. The two together would have lower velocity and much less kinetic energy than a regular factory load. Also they take up much space in the case. With these there is no hot load because pressure increases rapidly with increases in charge. There's no room in the case to use slow powders. Fast powders have rapid pressure increase as charge increases.

The 444 rifle cartridge has a "long" oal. Some guys did make sensible multi ball defense loads with this round in Marlin lever gun. I thought they were sensible, but not all would agree it's me. You see, whatever is gained might be negated by the fact you now have a very short range rifle. A 12 ga pump shotgun beats any such gimmick.

Live and learn and blow up a gun or two. I destroyed only one gun in my career if you don't count bubba gunsmithing with a power tool.

[CleverNickname]

How the hell would this work? the cartridge would be loaded in layers, from front to back, there would be the first bullet, propellant, an electric primer, then another bullet, another layer of propellant, and in the primer pocket a two stage device. The side of the device facing the propellant would be another electric primer, on the back of the device would be a piezoelectric generator. Somehow an electric circuit would have to be run from the generator to the front primer. And the generator would have a switch in it that would send the current from the first strike to the front primer, and the second strike tothe back primer. The current output from striking the piezo generator would have to be sufficient to ignite the electric primers.

What holds the primer for the first bullet, and where does the primer go after the first bullet is fired? Does it just travel down the barrel ahead of the second bullet when the second bullet is fired?

[Joe in PNG]

I have an idea how that will work. The big trick will be to get the primer behind the first projectile to go off when the piezo thingy in the primer pocket gets hit by the firing pin without setting off the primer behind the second projectile.

The trick when designing things is understanding that things will inevitably fail, how they will inevitably fail, and what's the consequences should it do so?

Then one must consider if it does the thing better than the existing thing in aspects like cost, complexity, ease of use, maintenance, and so on.

So, there's a couple of failure modes for the charges not going off properly- the possibility of OOB detonation, hangfires, premature ignition from radio signals, ect. What happens if the ignition system is damaged on the first half, but not the second?

Then you have to consider the fact that for the thing to actually be useful, you have to cram in some pretty high-pressure powder to get enough 'oomph' to push two different useful sized bullet to a useful velocity. Because with the two bullets and the ignition mechinism, there's not a lot of space left in a .357 cartridge. And that may just kaboom the gun even without an OOB event.

[Joe in PNG]

For instance, Tam noted the following about the Boberg/ Bond Arms Bullpup pistol:

Great Moments in Bad Gun Ideas

I mean, the trigger was nice, and it shot okay, but the more and more I thought about it, the lessless I dug the whole basic concept behind it...

"Hey, guys, let's make a pistol that adds a bunch of extra mechanical complexity while negating one of the principle advantages of 9x19mm, namely dirt cheap training ammo, all for the dubious benefit of adding a possible 25-to-50 feet per second of muzzle velocity!"

I mean, if you want one as a range toy-slash-safe queen simply for the mechanical curiosity because you're an absolute gun nerd, that's understandable, but I'm pretty much of the opinion that it's a fundamentally unserious choice as an actual life-saving tool.

So, you get a pistol that is famous for acting as a 'ballistic bullet puller', is far more complicated than a standard sub-compact, and doesn't really do anything all that much better.
It's a neat idea, but it's more Rube Goldberg machine than useful firearm.

[BBMW]

You do realize, that if it is viable, and someone would consider developing it as a product, it would go through a full R&D, testing and productionization process, correct? If it didn't work reliably it would never get released.

The trick when designing things is understanding that things will inevitably fail, how they will inevitably fail, and what's the consequences should it do so?

Then one must consider if it does the thing better than the existing thing in aspects like cost, complexity, ease of use, maintenance, and so on.

So, there's a couple of failure modes for the charges not going off properly- the possibility of OOB detonation, hangfires, premature ignition from radio signals, ect. What happens if the ignition system is damaged on the first half, but not the second?

Then you have to consider the fact that for the thing to actually be useful, you have to cram in some pretty high-pressure powder to get enough 'oomph' to push two different useful sized bullet to a useful velocity. Because with the two bullets and the ignition mechinism, there's not a lot of space left in a .357 cartridge. And that may just kaboom the gun even without an OOB event.