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  1. #31
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    Apr 2011
    Back in northern Virginia
    Quote Originally Posted by konkapot View Post
    The guy who didn't bring a gun or a holster ...

    Tell me this was a contract instructor who doesn't have carry authority and had made a mistake on reserving a gun for use...and not an active LEO who was expected to bring his piece.

    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  2. #32
    He was a fully sworn 1811 from the OIG community.

    Then, at about day 2, he "found" the holster he brought. It was an odd kydex drop/offset holster.

  3. #33
    Quote Originally Posted by konkapot View Post
    I've heard that claim before and it is indeed nonsense.

    Most of what FLETC does comes from....................the partner organizations.
    As a retired fed told me, "FLETC has a lot of daddies.".
    I had an ER nurse in a class. I noticed she kept taking all head shots. Her response when asked why, "'I've seen too many people who have been shot in the chest putting up a fight in the ER." Point taken.

  4. #34
    FLETC has a lot of problems. An amazing amount, actually.

    But it absolutely takes two to tango.

    Extraordinarily frustrating sometimes.

  5. #35
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    Join Date
    Aug 2011
    TEXAS !
    Quote Originally Posted by konkapot View Post
    I've heard that claim before and it is indeed nonsense.

    My concern is that a lot of things get said that are factually incorrect, then they get repeated, and then become "facts."

    Most of what FLETC does comes from....................the partner organizations. The very agencies that simp and whine about "the FLETC way" are the ones that complain the most.

    Re: adding FoF training on day 4. We don't just add things. The HOTPs in Charleston were technically pilot programs. Much of the complaints from the agencies was that the CoF was too hard. So, Charleston did two pilots, we did two "real" classes. Sample size of 4 is too small to revise curiculum.

    Re: Shooting and moving. We did a lot of it, but as usual the limiting factor is the skillset of the students. The few solid shooters performed well during our various drills, of course. The guys that showed up for the gentlemans course....not so much. The guy who didn't bring a gun or a holster really struggled.
    Consider FOF when it’s time to revise. During our red dot instructor classes, many of the FIs who had never used red dots before cited the FOF as when the red dot “clicked” for them and they bought into the concept.

    Regarding an active LEO showing up for the class without a gun or a holster, this is my complete lack of surprise…..

  6. #36
    The instructors don't have as much input in revisions as you'd think. It's largely partner organization/student driven.

    The guy who showed up with no gun has more input than I do into what the future holds.

    The fact that there's been almost no interest in the class means that there might not be many more.

  7. #37
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    Join Date
    Feb 2011
    Quote Originally Posted by jlw View Post
    I've had no luck with NLEFIA. I tried to host a course and couldn't get enough for it to make, and I signed up for course elsewhere that didn't make. These may be oddball instances as it seems most of their classes fill, but they don't get a lot of mention in my web travels.

    I've done one class with Team One, but it wasn't a dot class, and it was a long time ago.
    Thanks. jlw. I have trained with Team One instructors in the past and know they are pretty solid, but hoped someone had attended their red dot training. NLEFIA does host a decent number of courses, but I agree one doesn't read much on the web about them.

  8. #38
    Join Date
    Feb 2016
    SF Bay Ahea
    Quote Originally Posted by DMF13 View Post
    Not all the feds, just FLETC. My agency has had a 50 round course since long before I got hired.

    Our lead FITP FLETC Cheltenham claimed the 60 rounds was based off the original revolver centric courses designed in the 1970s, and FLETC will always keep the round counts, and distances the same because they "have four decades of data to bring to court" if.someone is being prosecuted or sued regarding an office involved shooting.

    That seems a bit ridiculous as I am unaware of any case where that kind of data was relevant in either a civil or criminal trial. I know quality and frequency of training might be a factor, but needing the round count and distances to stay constant does not seem relevant. However that instructor was adamant that data was very important, for that reason.
    People who are instructors, or even attorneys like DAs and City Attorneys, who do not defend cops in shootings in Fed court usually have no fricking clue what they are talking about when it comes to liability of police use of force. Like Kardashian taking OJ down to the station to get interviewed and clear up Nicole's murder clueless.

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