Icy roads - steep hills - tire solutions?

[0ddl0t]

What are studs like on dry pavement?

They're okay, but not great. If you never make your tires squeal or howl when cornering you'd probably never notice the difference (aside from the noise).

From what your saying I assuming with studs unlike chains its safe to drive highway speeds?

Yep, no issue doing 80mph on dry interstate as long as the temperature is below ~50°F or so (tire wear will be a bit accelerated driving interstate speeds in 50-65° weather and you're more likely to lose a stud or two).

I Goggled studded tires and where they are permitted. Bizarre. Most states they are allowed through the winter months, but the states where they are banned might be a list of liberal run states.

Michigan, Minnesota, and Illinois are the main winter states that ban them, but they're also pretty flat and don't spend as much time bouncing above & below freezing (whn it gets really cold, studless tires work as well or better).

But I'd expect to see more state ban studs in the future, especially since car tires are now the largest source of automotive particulate pollution and studded tires add asphalt dust to the mix...

[RevolverRob]

"It is not Flip the script" see post 42 where I ask YVK if he is comfortable talking with FD/ Public Works and # 46 where I suggest leveraging the existing first responder relationship to get what he needs. I can only speak to my state with absolute certainty but the public works agency has a legal obligation to address known hazards across all of the public right of way. As long as they are adhering to policy in regards to how they address winter weather they would not have negligence in regards to the "dangerous condition" at this specific location, unfortunately for him the existing policy is not working, which is why if he cant get what he needs with the original engagement, I also suggested in #42 that engagement with elected officials and other "influential stakeholders" ( read whoever has the big stick politically- Representative, business owner, the hospital itself if it is an important enough employer in the area etc) could result in a policy change to get what he needs if the initial talk doesn't work...

Public Works agencies are often run by risk adverse engineers who respond well to situations where you can bring facts, point out potential negative outcomes (press, potential lawsuits etc), or involve political sway. Telling the poor schmuck who answers the phone to fuck off after getting frustrated that you can't convince them to do their do their damn job won't get you want you want. I know you (@RevolverRob) are politically savvy in an academic environment from previous posts, it is no different here -but it is a different set of rules and for 10 years you haven't been applying them to get what you want....

No, it's not really a different set of political rules. You are providing sound, reasoned, and rational advice.

Advice, however, that should not be necessary. That might be where we are in disagreement (although I actually kind of doubt we are in disagreement). If the taxes are paid and complaints have been made and solutions are not being generated - then there is a problem with the system - not the politics. I get where you are coming from - that a kind, but squeaky, wheel can get more grease than a guy with a snow plow and a middle finger can.

However, both can be viable solutions to the same problem. I have been successful in applying both, actually. If you do it yourself and the folks who are supposed to be doing it get wind of it - they'll show up to "correct you" or "do it right" more often than not. You might get someone that shows up to read you the riot act about "not doing it yourself". To which the response, "I wouldn't have to do it, if you did your fucking job." - both typically silences them and ensures prompt future service.

I'll admit that I have simply lost my tolerance in the last few years for the type of politicking you describe. Though I acknowledge it is generally a more reasonable way to accomplish the goal.

[Cookie Monster]

Then we can flip the script. If YVK is unable to attend to a patient due to an inability to get to the hospital and that patient subsequently dies - then it would be DOT/City/County Public Works who should have to face the family's lawsuit.

Admittedly, I could go on a long tirade about this and similar issues. ~10 years of living in Chicago, Seattle, and now New York has taught me a few important lessons about relying on City/County/State Public Works and especially unionized ones. The long and short is don't, because you'll be disappointed every single time. The other thing I have learned is - it's easier to tell someone to fuck off than it is to get them to do their job(s).

(I admittedly have not won a lot of pro-union friends during my time)

On the rural county road I used to live on. If a tree dropped, you cleared it or you didn’t get out. You checked the culverts to make sure they didn’t blow out and you could get to town.

You gotta take care of things.

[SJC3081]

I used it in my wife’s Subaru to go up and down snowy roads my lifted KO2 equipped Tundra couldn’t do in 4 low.

That is because KO2 are a horrible snow ice tire. They are useless on ice.

[BN]

Does anyone have experience with e.g. Subaru's 'Hill Descent Mode'? It's one of the whizbang electronic things where you set a speed of 5 MPH or whatever, then leave the brakes and throttle alone, and the car modulates the brakes/throttle/vehicle stability system/yadda so you just creep down the hill.

I have experience now.

Thanks to this thread, I looked this morning and discovered that my Outback has X-Mode.

As I left my driveway to go down the 1/2 mile gravel road, I pushed the button. It kept me at a steady 9 MPH going down the 4 & 5 percent grade. I could hear and feel it applying the brakes on icy sections.

I usually put the CVT in manual and put it in "1st gear".

I'm becoming a big Subaru fan.

[Tensaw]

I have experience now.

Thanks to this thread, I looked this morning and discovered that my Outback has X-Mode.

As I left my driveway to go down the 1/2 mile gravel road, I pushed the button. It kept me at a steady 9 MPH going down the 4 & 5 percent grade. I could hear and feel it applying the brakes on icy sections.

I usually put the CVT in manual and put it in "1st gear".

I'm becoming a big Subaru fan.

So, I've been doing Hondas for over three decades. My experience with them has been great. They have proven bombproof with very reasonable maintenance. In some light research on Subies, the interweb consensus seems to be they can be reliable, but with quite an enhanced maintenance schedule. I keep seeing people referencing 3,500 mile oil change intervals. Is this right?

The feature set of the Subies looks pretty good, but the maintenance requirements spook me a bit.

[BN]

So, I've been doing Hondas for over three decades. My experience with them has been great. They have proven bombproof with very reasonable maintenance. In some light research on Subies, the interweb consensus seems to be they can be reliable, but with quite an enhanced maintenance schedule. I keep seeing people referencing 3,500 mile oil change intervals. Is this right?

The feature set of the Subies looks pretty good, but the maintenance requirements spook me a bit.

We have a 2016 Legacy and a 2019 Outback and they are both 6000 miles between oil changes. The Outback has 50k miles on it with only oil changes. The Legacy has >100k and we just recently had a brake job done. We had a more major service with the Legacy at 60k or so. I don't remember what it was for sure. Maybe replace the transmission fluid or timing belts or something.

Our Toyotas are supposed to be "serviced" every 5000 miles but they only change the oil at 10,000 miles.

My sister had been driving Hondas about as long as you have.

[camel]

So, I've been doing Hondas for over three decades. My experience with them has been great. They have proven bombproof with very reasonable maintenance. In some light research on Subies, the interweb consensus seems to be they can be reliable, but with quite an enhanced maintenance schedule. I keep seeing people referencing 3,500 mile oil change intervals. Is this right?

The feature set of the Subies looks pretty good, but the maintenance requirements spook me a bit.

They are. And their dealer networks. Are better in my area with having shit on hand when it goes wrong or warranty.

[0ddl0t]

So, I've been doing Hondas for over three decades. My experience with them has been great. They have proven bombproof with very reasonable maintenance. In some light research on Subies, the interweb consensus seems to be they can be reliable, but with quite an enhanced maintenance schedule. I keep seeing people referencing 3,500 mile oil change intervals. Is this right?

We have a 2016 Legacy and a 2019 Outback and they are both 6000 miles between oil changes. The Outback has 50k miles on it with only oil changes. The Legacy has >100k and we just recently had a brake job done. We had a more major service with the Legacy at 60k or so. I don't remember what it was for sure. Maybe replace the transmission fluid or timing belts or something.

Our Toyotas are supposed to be "serviced" every 5000 miles but they only change the oil at 10,000 miles.

My sister had been driving Hondas about as long as you have.

Be careful with the 10,000 mile oil change intervals. That's what dealerships like (especially for cars sold with complementary maintenance), but if you read the owner's manual a majority of drivers are supposed to use the "severe" or "special operating conditions" maintenance schedule.

Common driving situations that often make you ineligible for 10,000 mile oil change intervals:

• high speed driving
• lots of low speed driving
• driving less than 5 miles
• towing
• driving with roof top box or bike rack
• driving "heavily loaded" (which includes driving with passengers)
• mountain driving
• driving in below freezing temperatures
• doing lots of idling
• driving on dirt or mud
• driving on roads treated for ice/snow

Example maintenance schedule from 2020 Toyota Camry (note the bolded "special operating conditions"):



(note the Camry has only 925 lb of payload so luggage & a couple passengers = heavily loaded)

Doing 10K oil changes when you really need 5K oil changes rarely causes problems the first 100,000 miles, but it tends to gradually clog piston drain-back holes and gum up modern low-tension oil control rings, leading to higher oil consumption (causing clogged cats, fouled plugs, and - if ignored for 10,000 mile oil change intervals - oil starvation). This clogging is especially common on hybrids and cars with start-stop technology which will turn off the engine as a car exits the freeway with hot oil and let the hot oil bake & varnish in place rather than circulate and cool...