The Patterned Compliance Pistol

[SouthNarc]

Super interesting that the impetus for the designer/owner of this holster/company was go figure.....robbery.

[octagon]

I can see the value of the concept but I don't see a real value or benefit of the Kel Tec P32 over a Ruger LCP. I have had 3 LCPs and currently a LCP Max and none have been painful or problematic to shoot especially for shorter session. All have been dead reliable. Same basic size https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/...2-vs-ruger-lcp and Ruger quality is noticeably better and more consistent. Eliminating any rim lock issue and more common, available and powerful ammo adds another plus for 380. The amount of aftermarket support and holsters for the Ruger also adds to its value over the Kel Tec.

[MGW]

So…more progress.

The main part of what makes a PCP work is the skill itself. The only way to develop the skill is interactively.

So that means with someone and for that we need a training analog.

Not the little KelTec but Tokyo Marui makes a non blowback green gas Ruger LCP airsoft pistol.

https://www.wgcshop.com/products/tok...ide-gas-pistol

It’s close enough to the Kel Tec for drilling purposes and if someone was running an LCP as a PCP then this is a 1:1 for them.

I think using an airsoft analog has ALOT of advantages.

The main one being is that one can train without facial protection if they just use the poof of gas to denote and maybe even “feel” the shot in lieu of a projectile. Maybe some eye pro.

Being able to do effective non-projectile opposed drilling without face protection allows one to really dial in the eye movement and facial expressions of their partner so they can develop proper timing and pace.

I already have a drill progression that I’m gonna hold back for right now for some beta testing.

I found one of the little LCP airsoft pistols on eBay brand new and bought it so I should have it in hand in a couple of weeks since it’s coming from Japan.

The tidbits you’ve posted on IG are really good and thought provoking. My first thought was “it looks like he’s deploying a lethal version of pepper spray”. Cecil’s class completely changed my approach to self-defense. I was spending too much time doing BJJ just to do BJJ with out thinking about real world applications. I’ve been battling injuries for the last two years. I have no illusion of dominating a FUT physically. My best COA is avoiding it in the first place, if possible. I’m really looking forward to seeing where you go with this. I haven’t trained with you but I have still learned a lot from you.

Are you incorporating the PCP concept into one of your current live classes? Or will it be a stand alone course like EWO? I’m really intrigued by the counter robbery class concept that Cecil et al taught. I’m wondering if PCP will end up being a similar course of study. As I get older, I appreciate the thinking mans approach to self defense more and more.

[SouthNarc]

I can see the value of the concept but I don't see a real value or benefit of the Kel Tec P32 over a Ruger LCP. I have had 3 LCPs and currently a LCP Max and none have been painful or problematic to shoot especially for shorter session. All have been dead reliable. Same basic size https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/...2-vs-ruger-lcp and Ruger quality is noticeably better and more consistent. Eliminating any rim lock issue and more common, available and powerful ammo adds another plus for 380. The amount of aftermarket support and holsters for the Ruger also adds to its value over the Kel Tec.

I think the LCP is quite viable and your point about the rimrock issues disappearing with .380 is well made.

[SouthNarc]

Are you incorporating the PCP concept into one of your current live classes? Or will it be a stand alone course like EWO? I’m really intrigued by the counter robbery class concept that Cecil et al taught. I’m wondering if PCP will end up being a similar course of study. As I get older, I appreciate the thinking mans approach to self defense more and more.

So currently I am not incorporating the PCP concept into any classes. There are cross-over elements that make PCP work that goes into gun disarms. But putting everything together into a road class is not a current offering.

What I think I can do with PCP is make this an actual, viable, on-line class. I have some pretty specific thoughts on what I need to capture on video and I have a conference call with the guy we have retained to do all of our video production on the best way to do this stuff.

An interesting option for feedback back from me is student shot video where I review what you're doing this and give you critique.

I think this actually might work and have.......75%?......of the value of an in-person class?

Don't know. This is new territory for ShivWorks.

[JCN]

I think the LCP is quite viable and your point about the rimrock issues disappearing with .380 is well made.

I’m glad Jenny was able to get you in for the Innovate P32 sights!

I think P32 and LCP are both viable.

I tend to do pocket Taurus View.



People have recommended not carrying the Walther chambered but form factor wise it’s on a different scale.

[GearFondler]

I can see the value of the concept but I don't see a real value or benefit of the Kel Tec P32 over a Ruger LCP. I have had 3 LCPs and currently a LCP Max and none have been painful or problematic to shoot especially for shorter session. All have been dead reliable. Same basic size https://www.handgunhero.com/compare/...2-vs-ruger-lcp and Ruger quality is noticeably better and more consistent. Eliminating any rim lock issue and more common, available and powerful ammo adds another plus for 380. The amount of aftermarket support and holsters for the Ruger also adds to its value over the Kel Tec.

A few counterpoints, at the risk of speaking for Craig...
Handgun Hero is an amazing site but you have to avoid only comparing the side silhouette's as this provides only part of the story... Width and weight are just as important to get the full picture.
For instance, people like to look at the G42 vs G43 and claim that based on the HH site the two guns are basically the same size. Wrong!
The G43 is substantially thicker and heavier which makes a big difference in a pocket for those of us who aren't especially large folk. It's literally the difference between "Apparently there's a brick in my pocket that I can hardly even draw" and "Somethings there but it might be a phone and I can actually draw it". Specs that don't matter in a belt holster matter immensely in a pocket.
The LCP might look on paper to be barely larger than the P32 but it is thicker and heavier. That won't matter if you're pocket carrying in your Duluth/Carhartt/Dickies pants or probably even jeans, but it does matter when the clothes become much less forgiving. In a thin pair of dress slacks or perhaps some shorts made with seersucker for a casual day along the beach the size and weight difference will matter... Like the difference between causing an attention grabbing sag or even being visible or not at the pocket's mouth. The P32 is so damn small it will even ride in the shirt pocket of most uniforms. I'm pretty sure Craig is envisioning this PCP concept as potentially a piece of gear you wear all the time, regardless of your size or dress code, and as such going the smallest, lightest route possible makes the most sense. If one has to start dressing around the PCP the concept looses some of it's utility.

[SouthNarc]

I'm pretty sure Craig is envisioning this PCP concept as potentially a piece of gear you wear all the time, regardless of your size or dress code, and as such going the smallest, lightest route possible makes the most sense. If one has to start dressing around the PCP the concept looses some of it's utility.

That is exactly how I am envisioning it. Specifically replacing a back pocket wallet.

[SouthNarc]

I’m glad Jenny was able to get you in for the Innovate P32 sights!

I think P32 and LCP are both viable.

I tend to do pocket Taurus View.



People have recommended not carrying the Walther chambered but form factor wise it’s on a different scale.

Man thanks for facilitating that I really appreciate the intro to her, and the IW sights really add an entirely higher level of capability to the P32.

Which LCP is that in the photo?

[SouthNarc]

Width and weight are just as important to get the full picture.

For instance, people like to look at the G42 vs G43 and claim that based on the HH site the two guns are basically the same size.

The G43 is substantially thicker and heavier which makes a big difference in a pocket for those of us who aren't especially large folk. It's literally the difference between "Apparently there's a brick in my pocket that I can hardly even draw" and "Somethings there but it might be a phone and I can actually draw it". Specs that don't matter in a belt holster matter immensely in a pocket.

The LCP might look on paper to be barely larger than the P32 but it is thicker and heavier. That won't matter if you're pocket carrying in your Duluth/Carhartt/Dickies pants or probably even jeans, but it does matter when the clothes become much less forgiving. In a thin pair of dress slacks or perhaps some shorts made with seersucker for a casual day along the beach the size and weight difference will matter... Like the difference between causing an attention grabbing sag or even being visible or not at the pocket's mouth.

By the HH site the LCP is 30% heavier than the Keltec at 9.6 ounces vs. 6.6 ounces for the P32.