The Patterned Compliance Pistol

[Hambo]

@Mas

Check out the comparison between this C&S 637 and the KelTec.

Right now I think you could PCP a J frame. But I think the small flat guns are just easier to live with especially if this is a secondary weapon set up for this specific purpose.

Most people have a hard enough time carrying one pistol much less two.

The j-frame in the strong side front pocket is still the fastest draw if you start with your hand on the gun, but what you're doing is sleight of hand while under a gun. I think it's revolutionary in the sense that it's not 1) "carry a fighting handgun IWB/AIWB" or 2) "I'll just throw something in my pocket and hope it all works out." It's looking at the reality of street robbery first, then planning what/how to carry. With an AIWB pistol, a strong side rear pocket pistol, and a CP left of center, you have a lot of options for a variety of problems.

[SouthNarc]

The j-frame in the strong side front pocket is still the fastest draw if you start with your hand on the gun, but what you're doing is sleight of hand while under a gun.

That's pretty much what I'm doing. The impetus for this was the plethora of videos around the internet of guys standing in front of a cardboard target with their hand in their pocket, drawing the J frame on the beep, shooting a USPSA cardboard in the face, looking at their sub-second draw and then patting themselves on the back at how prepared they are for a robbery. It's insidious too because of the reward effect.


This is not a speed problem and I find that drill doesn't comport with this:

It's looking at the reality of street robbery first, then planning what/how to carry.

My experience with robbery isn't absolute but I most assuredly have experience. 9 points of reference specifically.

Now to actually qualify that experience these were drug buys and I would have never been robbed had I not been trolling around housing projects in shitty cars buying crack. My job was to look for trouble like a good crack-head/addict.

Most of these guys just poked me with a gun and then snatched the buy money out of my hand. Fairly quick. To minimize time on a vehicle buy you typically ran cash in hand, far-side hand from the bad guy. So it's right there and there's no digging for it.

I was once robbed by two guys on a nice set-up where one got in the car with me and while I was talking to him another snuck up and stuck a gun to my head from the driver's side window. Pincer hit. The guy in the car took the buy money and actually started running my pockets. I had a Glock 26 in Thunderwear and a J frame buried under my thigh that I was sitting on. I was more worried about him feeling the 1 watt brick body wire I was taped into or the mic and external antenna. I kept his hands away by turning my pockets inside out and moving my hands around my body patting myself down and saying "LOOK dude I got NOTHING else SEE". My tone was whiny and exasperated.

Giving him a visual pattern of compliance along with the spoken statement emphasizing the words LOOK, NOTHING, and SEE was enough to make him stop touching me and let ME do the touching. These are not the droids you're looking for.

I had one guy stick a gun under my chin, take my money and then crack me in the side of the head hard enough to require a couple of stitches. He said if he caught me on his block again I'd be one dead white boy. So...I got stitched up after work and then went back the next day and found him and bought crack from him.

Any rational person reading that is asking "Why in the FUCK would you do that?" Simple. That's what crack-heads and addicts DO and there was an expectation in the 80s and 90s that street level U/C work was just...rough trade. Fortunately I am extremely risk tolerant for better or worse.

My point in telling a couple of war stories (which I really hate to do unless they support a learning point) is that the PROBLEM informs strategies, tactics, techniques and equipment. So you have to have SOME idea of what the PROBLEM looks like. Otherwise to quote Grosman you're just another virgin discussing sex.

I think it's revolutionary in the sense that it's not 1) "carry a fighting handgun IWB/AIWB" or 2) "I'll just throw something in my pocket and hope it all works out."

Don't know if it's revolutionary but I haven't seen this being discussed or trained the way I'm discussing it as it relates to how to use these tiny little pistols.

With an AIWB pistol, a strong side rear pocket pistol, and a CP left of center, you have a lot of options for a variety of problems.

Yeah man I think so. Still a lot of shit to carry.

[octagon]

I switched from the LCP to Kahr P380 because it had better sights and last round hold open while also being shorter (front to rear) and stainless. I have carried it on the beach in light swim trunks and it just disappears. It can be carried in the mesh change pocket with drawstring but my swim trunks had regular pockets so that was how I carried most times. It could also be a choice for this carry mode and use but it does have larger slide lock and mag button and is more expensive than the LCP.

[Up1911Fan]

@Mas

Check out the comparison between this C&S 637 and the KelTec.

Right now I think you could PCP a J frame. But I think the small flat guns are just easier to live with especially if this is a secondary weapon set up for this specific purpose.

Most people have a hard enough time carrying one pistol much less two.

I have no problem with two, this thread has me considering a P32 as a third.

[Doc_Glock]

A couple equipment thoughts.

the LCP Max is in my experience more reliable and durable than the LCP. it has great sights, draws beautifully from
the pocket, but it is marginally larger and heavier. 11 rounds though. It is my primary pocket carry any more.

The SW BG 380, at least the older one, has a true and quite good double action only trigger and I think is an under rated small, flat pistol.

[SouthNarc]

I have no problem with two, this thread has me considering a P32 as a third.

My carry as a uniformed patrol officer was a Sig 226 service pistol, a 442 on my ankle, and a Seecamp in my back pocket. The Seecamp was "Onion Field Insurance".

[SouthNarc]

I switched from the LCP to Kahr P380 because it had better sights and last round hold open while also being shorter (front to rear) and stainless. I have carried it on the beach in light swim trunks and it just disappears. It can be carried in the mesh change pocket with drawstring but my swim trunks had regular pockets so that was how I carried most times. It could also be a choice for this carry mode and use but it does have larger slide lock and mag button and is more expensive than the LCP.

Yeah the slide lock feature is extraneous for me for what I'm doing. I'm not gonna be reloading this pistol.

I think the P32 personally would be even better if it had a butt-heel mag release versus a button. The Seecamp has all the desired features but it's heavier and thicker than the P32.

[JCN]

Yeah the slide lock feature is extraneous for me for what I'm doing. I'm not gonna be reloading this pistol.

I think the P32 personally would be even better if it had a butt-heel mag release versus a button. The Seecamp has all the desired features but it's heavier and thicker than the P32.

Could even consider grinding down the mag release button.

Aftermarket replacement mag releases at mcarbo.

https://www.mcarbo.com/Printable%20I...-Printable.pdf

[WDR]

Could even consider grinding down the mag release button.

Aftermarket replacement mag releases at mcarbo.

https://www.mcarbo.com/Printable%20I...-Printable.pdf

I ground the stock plastic release down a fair amount on one of my P-32's after finding the magazine loose a couple of times when I first pocket carried mine. Much better after. The stock release bump is bigger than it needs to be, IMHO, especially for a pocket gun that is unlikely to be reloaded.

[SouthNarc]

I ground the stock plastic release down a fair amount on one of my P-32's after finding the magazine loose a couple of times when I first pocket carried mine. Much better after. The stock release bump is bigger than it needs to be, IMHO, especially for a pocket gun that is unlikely to be reloaded.

Any photos of that mod?