How Old and Slow is Too Old and Too Slow to Carry?

[Navin Johnson]

Has anyone taken any of Bill Wilson's training classes? I haven't heard much about them.

[revchuck38]

Does anyone know what magazine the original quote that is the topic of this thread appeared in?

Was it an actual quote? Or paraphrasing?

It came from here, which he probably got from Greg Ellifritz's Weekend Knowledge Dump.

[uechibear]

I'm a martial artist, and when I was younger, I didn't think I needed a gun for self-defense.

Now I carry a gun BECAUSE I'm a bit older and slower!

[Robert Mitchum]

Almost 71... lift 4 to 5 days a week not breaking any of my maxes, but I can deadlift and bench more than a lot of guys in there 40's and some even younger.
Dry fire Everday and 100 rounds a week at the range.

Try to once a Month do Force on Force with a Neighbor who is in his 40's and about my size.

It's all going to go to shit someday but I fight the good fight trying to outrun my age.

[JRB]

When I was a pre-teen and teenager, a family friend of ours was an 07/02 SOT FFL back when that was a pretty rare thing to have (1990's). He regularly did gun shows through this time -it was the 'good days' of gun shows with lots of wheeling and dealing and interesting tables full of milsurp and interesting guns, not a bunch of overpriced random new stuff, tazers, peanuts, and other crap.
But he'd buy batches of popular title 1 firearms from various distributors and throw a few interesting older guns he 'didn't love anymore' just to wheel & deal and find interesting trade deals on historic weapons or military surplus.

A frequent gunshow neighbor of his was a WWII, Korea, & Vietnam Marine Corp veteran, Ed. He retired as a 1stSgt. The dude was in his 80's but had a marathon runner's build, a handshake that'd break your fingers, and a fast easy smile that rarely reached his eyes. After my first enlistment Army I'd recognize that for what it was.
But the dude was a great neighbor to BS with at gun shows, and had all kinds of crazy stories, and he loved pulling my leg and teaching me interesting stuff about all the things he had on his table. He typically wheeled and dealed with interesting old milsurp and antiques, turquoise jewelry, and had a particular love for M1903s and M1911s.

Well he also was a regular vendor at a local flea market. He was at that flea market selling some jewelry and knickknacks one day when three vato-gangster wannabes approached his table. The biggest one and apparent leader reached out and picked up the most expensive piece of jewelry he had on the table, tag on it was $350 if memory serves.
Without skipping a beat, Ed smiled at them and said 'That'll be $350, Sir'.
The largest said 'How about zero dollars, old man?'
'No can do son, that's $350, cash only please'
'I'm gonna take this now. What are you gonna do about it, old man?'
Then as the two lesser vatos started flanking him, one pulled a switchblade out of his pocket, probably to do the whole menacing/intimidation thing, and according to everyone who saw it (and the police report we'd later read with smiles on our faces) Ed grabbed that vato by the wrist, rotated his arm outward to twist his wrist and shoulder until he dropped the knife, and with his right hand he had a 1911 out and pointed at the lead vato's head before the vatos could react.
Then Ed said something to the effect of:
"I'm gonna do this, I got eight rounds in here but I only need three... and that'll be $350 please or you can put it back on my table"

Vatos tucked tail and ran, leaving the switchblade which the APD later got good prints from and connected it to a frequent-flyer gangbanger type and all three eventually faced charges.

If I ever live to be an old man, I hope I'm like Ed.
Honestly, Clint Eastwood's character in Gran Torino was like Ed but with a bitter and shitty attitude about everything. Imagine the same guy only cheerful and happy to joke and smile and say hello to anyone, and that was Ed.

[Duces Tecum]

Try to once a Month do Force on Force with a Neighbor who is in his 40's and about my size.

Robet, you've piqued my curiosity. Why only monthly? Is it to give him time to heal?


Duces

[JTMcC]

I guess I was always neutral on Bill Wilson, I know his company makes some solid products but........
Bill can suck it now.
My Dad (10th SF) carried a gun far beyond "Bill's" arbitrary cutoff point but he knew when and where, and when and where not.
Bill's an idiot. An elderly (my Mom shot shotguns into her 80's) rural human with a solid mind can and will stop a lot of threats while well over "Bill's" time limits.
What an idiot.

[Rex G]

Before I have even started reading any of the reply posts, I will declare that I disagree with the concept that one must me able to shoot into an specific group size at ten yards in a given number of seconds. One simple reason is that most defensive shootings simply do not happen at ten yards and beyond. Of course, one must not endanger the innocent; the rules about safe muzzle direction, safe backstop, knowing what is between me and the target, and knowing what is beyond the target, and understanding one’s accuracy limitation, all still apply. It is a matter of judgement, and self-discipline.

When I carried a bead-sighted shotgun, with buckshot, on police patrol, I knew better than to think that I could safely engage a target, in a big-city environment, beyond 15 yards, especially if the ammo was not FFC, and that seven to ten yards would be better, to allow a margin of safety. (Human opponents tend to move about.) Judgment and discipline.

[Rex G]

It came from here, which he probably got from Greg Ellifritz's Weekend Knowledge Dump.

Yep, this is it. I remember reading this article, some time in the past.

Notably, Bill Wilson is NOT saying that this should be a standard for folks to keep, or lose, the right to keep and arm bears.

[Rex G]

I remember the time when we had to take my elderly father-in-law’s Ruger Speed Six from him. Later, when he actually lived with us, we had to keep all knives locked away. During WW II, he was a member of the AK, the Polish underground. After the war, he had to get out of communist Poland, because he was not a communist. The post-war communist establishment knew that he had resisted the Nazis, and that he might well resist them.

I will NEVER forget the day I had to silently stalk my father-in-law, then beat his reaction time, to take a knife away from him. (He did not recognize a younger family member. Dementia steals one’s most recent memories, first.) A HUGE thanks to Steve Tarani, Bram Frank, and @SouthNarc for having taught me things that I used, to accomplish that take-away. (I never attended Craig’s blade-specific training, but a pistol take-away uses the same concepts as a blade take-away.)