AR for use with suppressor

[WobblyPossum]

@WobblyPossum

I wouldn’t hold my breath. Kevin also shared the following when I asked.

During our development of the Turbo line we found that using the full size Phantom adapter that ships with the Turbo provided roughly 3-4 dB's of reduction over the Kurz adapter when compared side to side due to the increase in blast chamber volume. This is the reason we chose to ship all of our Q.D. suppressors with the full size Phantom adapter and allow the consumer to decide if they'd rather have the length/weight savings the Kurz adapter provides. The same applies with our SRX system.

Interesting. I might reach out for some clarification. Does this mean the sRx gets you 3-4 fewer dBs of reduction than the Phantom or does this mean the short sRx muzzle device gets you 3-4 fewer dBs of reduction than the full size sRx?

[EJO]

Interesting. I might reach out for some clarification. Does this mean the sRx gets you 3-4 fewer dBs of reduction than the Phantom or does this mean the short sRx muzzle device gets you 3-4 fewer dBs of reduction than the full size sRx?

I took it to mean 3-4 fewer dBs when using anything other than the Phantom. I was told to expect 3-4 fewer dBs when using the YHM direct thread mount as well, which I’m fine with the trade off.

I think the Phantom is increasing the volume of the suppressor and giving better numbers due to the larger volume. Purely a guess on my part though.

[Wake27]

Great stuff, thanks for sharing all this.

That's interesting on the T3/RB not being a true flow through design, and one of the reasons I'd really like to see a comparison video (or metrics of some type) on the back-pressure and gas to face to the T2. For instance, with the video that TFBTV did comparing the Surefire RC2 and RC3 back to back, there's no doubt it's a significant difference....it's very dramatic. If I'm going to spend the money on another suppressor, I might as well go for an actual flow through instead of an incremental improvement.



Similarly, I've wanted a 12.5" or 13.7" gun with a lightweight barrel and DD RIS III. If the Turbo K can't be upgraded to a RB, I might do something along the lines of an extreme reduced gas port from Sionics and dedicate my current Turbo K to direct thread on the gun, and then get flow throughs for my other 3 Mk18s and Filippino MSSR.

Do you have experience with/knowledge of the RIS III? The 203 hangars really pissed me off. There's a thread on ARFCOM about it but basically they block a number of forward MLOK slots. I thought about pairing mine with a 13.9 barrel but couldn't find all of the specs I wanted so mine is on a DD SOCOM 14.5 with FSB.

[TGS]

Do you have experience with/knowledge of the RIS III? The 203 hangars really pissed me off. There's a thread on ARFCOM about it but basically they block a number of forward MLOK slots. I thought about pairing mine with a 13.9 barrel but couldn't find all of the specs I wanted so mine is on a DD SOCOM 14.5 with FSB.

Nope, I'll have to look into that. Thanks for mentioning. Just seems like a natural progression since I already have a few RIS IIs. Come to think of it, I still have a 9" DDM4 rail lying around, too....seems like a perfect excuse to build a gun on it

TBH, Sionics already has a turn-key solution for what I want, and I'll probably just do that and sRx all the things instead of direct threading it just for the sake of compatibility and swapping suppressors if one platform goes down, etc.

[Wake27]

Nope, I'll have to look into that. Thanks for mentioning. Just seems like a natural progression since I already have a few RIS IIs. Come to think of it, I still have a 9" DDM4 rail lying around, too....seems like a perfect excuse to build a gun on it

TBH, Sionics already has a turn-key solution for what I want, and I'll probably just do that and sRx all the things instead of direct threading it just for the sake of compatibility and swapping suppressors if one platform goes down, etc.

RIS III. The swinging arms for the 203 can be removed by a screw IIRC, but the shroud that holds the arms is riveted in so if it blocks an MLOK slot you want to use (it blocked a few for me), your only option is to drill them out. Not impossible but pretty frustrating for a rail that costs so much and has to have a tiny percent of the population with that requirement. You could also file down the MLOK screws but that seemed more tedious to me.

[WobblyPossum]

RIS III. The swinging arms for the 203 can be removed by a screw IIRC, but the shroud that holds the arms is riveted in so if it blocks an MLOK slot you want to use (it blocked a few for me), your only option is to drill them out. Not impossible but pretty frustrating for a rail that costs so much and has to have a tiny percent of the population with that requirement. You could also file down the MLOK screws but that seemed more tedious to me.

I’ve cut down a couple screws that are too long recently. I used a dremel cutting wheel and it only took a minute. Mark where you want to cut with a sharpie and thread the screw into the nut. Use a set of pliers to hold the nut, and thus the screw, in place while you cut. If I make modifications to things, I try to modify the cheapest part I can. With the cost of the RISIII rail, I’d rather cut the screws down.

[JCN]

I’ve cut down a couple screws that are too long recently. I used a dremel cutting wheel and it only took a minute. Mark where you want to cut with a sharpie and thread the screw into the nut. Use a set of pliers to hold the nut, and thus the screw, in place while you cut. If I make modifications to things, I try to modify the cheapest part I can. With the cost of the RISIII rail, I’d rather cut the screws down.

You had me at Dremel…

[MistWolf]

Let's make your life simple-

-The easiest way to tune an AR to shoot reliably suppressed and unsuppressed is don't bother. The compromises are not worth it. When shooting suppressed, recoil will be sharper than normal and the pain accumulates as you shoot. Shooting unsuppressed, the AR will extract and eject, but not lock back on an empty mag. If it locks back, it's not tuned to shoot suppressed. If you need to be able to shoot suppressed and unsuppressed, get two ARs. Set one up to shoot with a suppressor and the other without.

-Instead of suppressing a 14.5 with a pinned adaptor, go direct thread on a 16. Adaptors add cost and weight and carbon will lock them up. Just screw the suppressor directly to the muzzle and leave it there until it has to be removed for maintenance. You won't be removing the suppressor at the range because the suppressor will be too hot.

-An 11.5 inch AR handles better than a 14.5 inch. The double stamp is worth every penny.

-Adjustable gas blocks are fine for experimenting but not so good for long term reliability.

-The difference between the carbine gas system and the middy doesn't matter. Gas port diameter does. Gas port diameter is critical.

NOTE: DO NOT buy into the idea the bullet is further down the barrel before the gas pressure opens the action with a middy gas system. That's pure bullshit. The action does not start opening until after the bullet has exited the muzzle.

-The best option for shooting suppressed is a barrel ported for a suppressor. Black River Tactical is very knowledgeable about porting barrels for shooting suppressed.

-The second best option is a BRT gas tube.

-Use no buffer lighter than an H2 and none heavier than a rifle buffer. No tungsten powder. Do not use cheap action springs. Do not use an extractor spring not made by Colt or Sprinco.

-If you get a stovepipe or a spent case and a live round stuck in the action, replace the extractor spring with a spring made by Colt or Sprinco before doing anything else.

-Suppressors are not hearing safe. However, shooting suppressed does less damage to your hearing than shooting unsuppressed.

-Don't try to tune any AR to shoot all types of 5.56/223 ammo. Therein lays madness. Pick a power level and stick to it.

[Robinson]

Let's make your life simple-

Yeah. This thread has been a blessing because of so many contributions from people that know way more than I do about the subject. On the other hand, I do see different approaches being discussed and there isn't really a consensus on what to focus on. What that tells me is that everything is a compromise of some kind, and it's up to me to come up with something I can live with.

Direct attach or flash hider? Or maybe a brake is better. But it depends on barrel length.

Adjustable gas block? Some say yes others say no.

Should probably go with a K or Mini can. But the YHM Turbo T3 isn't that much longer and heavier than the K-RB. Crap.

Putting any suppressor on a 14.5" or 16" gun will suck. Or maybe it won't.

Going with a BRT gas tube means I should probably decide on a bullet weight ahead of time and stick with it. Not sure what I should do there, could go 55gr could go 70+ grain, could go in the middle.

Literal analysis paralysis is setting in. I have a feeling I just need to start somewhere. That's why I was thinking the CR6960 with a YHM suppressor would be a reasonable starting point. I can always make some adjustments.

But I am intrigued by the BRT gas tube option. Just need to think about what ammo I am most likely to stick with, right? How hard are the things to install?

And the H2 buffer seems like a good idea that will be pretty easy to implement.

[WobblyPossum]

I contacted YHM last night to ask if there were plans to sell the Turbo and Turbo K with sRx mounts and muzzle devices.

Here’s what I got back this morning:

Thank you for your email.



The SRX System can be added to your TK but not the Gen 1 Turbo, unfortunately.



This would require the purchase of the muzzle device and the adaptor.



At this time only the Fat Cat comes with the SRX system with the suppressor.



However, we will review your suggestion.

ETA: @Robinson the CR6960 with YHM suppressor would be a fine starting point. According to that spreadsheet of gas port sizes floating around online, the CR6960 also has a gas port smaller than average for a 16” mid-length, 0.071” compared to 0.076” IIRC. That should also help mitigate the additional gas going into the action with the suppressor. Give it a try in its OEM configuration and compare how the gun runs with and without the suppressor. If you decide you’d still like to slow things down a little more, buy an H2 buffer and Sprinco Blue spring. Then you can mix and match the buffers and springs to see which combination gets the gun running how you want it to feel. The Turbo and Turbo K are fairly close in size but I’d go with the K if I knew it was going to permanently reside on a 16” rifle.

ETA2: I think the YHM site might have the wrong weights for the Turbo K RB. Check the original Turbo K and you’ll see the weight is several ounces off what is listed for the K RB. If the only difference between the previous generation and this generation of Turbos is the drilling of a few additional holes in the baffles, that shouldn’t result in an increase in weight. Might be worth contacting YHM for clarification.