What’s the Carbine “Easy Button?”

[Wake27]

Just curious about this. What makes a pinned 14.5" better than a 16"? I'm assuming the 16" is ~1.5" longer...?

Maybe the most heavily debated topics in the AR world. Pure weight and handling for me. I swap stuff around like crazy and still prefer having the shorter setup despite the more permanent muzzle. There used to be a prevalent argument that because the 14.5 pinned is 16.1 overall length, it’s barely noticeable when it comes to weight and length difference. I’ve seen lots of measurements thrown around, I never took the time to measure myself but the fact that you could put a whole extra 2” of handguard on a 16 barrel told me that it was a noticeable length. We debate 10.3/5 vs 11.5 and 11.5 vs 12.5 often but somehow, many people equate 14.5 and 16 as the same length and weight. After years of having many different 14.5s, I finally got a 16” and sold it in literal days I think.

I’ve been toying with another 16” in my head for a while, but that’d be a modern MK12ModH take with a 3-15 scope for all the DMRing.

The pinned muzzle device on a 14.5 does suck if you want to do anything, but I’m not much of a DIYer and rocksett on a muzzle plus red loctite on a gas block all make me want to just send the upper off anyways if it really needs that much work.


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[Darth_Uno]

Just curious about this. What makes a pinned 14.5" better than a 16"? I'm assuming the 16" is ~1.5" longer...?

Honestly, not much. Saves a little bit of weight and is slightly more handy. But then you're stuck with that muzzle device. 16" avoids any and all NFA/SBR regs.

The easy button is get any DD or BCM and shoot the heck out of it. I'd put Geissele in there but they cost a little more. You can get good deals on uppers (all three of them) if you want to wait for Black Friday.

All that said, having several factory and home builds, my favorite is still a basic BCM 14.5 ELW with a pinned A2X FH.

[dogcaller]

Maybe the most heavily debated topics in the AR world. Pure weight and handling for me. I swap stuff around like crazy and still prefer having the shorter setup despite the more permanent muzzle. There used to be a prevalent argument that because the 14.5 pinned is 16.1 overall length, it’s barely noticeable when it comes to weight and length difference. I’ve seen lots of measurements thrown around, I never took the time to measure myself but the fact that you could put a whole extra 2” of handguard on a 16 barrel told me that it was a noticeable length. We debate 10.3/5 vs 11.5 and 11.5 vs 12.5 often but somehow, many people equate 14.5 and 16 as the same length and weight. After years of having many different 14.5s, I finally got a 16” and sold it in literal days I think.

I’ve been toying with another 16” in my head for a while, but that’d be a modern MK12ModH take with a 3-15 scope for all the DMRing.

The pinned muzzle device on a 14.5 does suck if you want to do anything, but I’m not much of a DIYer and rocksett on a muzzle plus red loctite on a gas block all make me want to just send the upper off anyways if it really needs that much work.


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I didn't realize that. I believe you, but somehow missed the debate. I don't have an SBR and going shorter than 14" seems like diminishing returns to me, but that's just me thinking out loud--no experience with it. Thanks for the info, gents!

[Wake27]

I didn't realize that. I believe you, but somehow missed the debate. I don't have an SBR and going shorter than 14" seems like diminishing returns to me, but that's just me thinking out loud--no experience with it. Thanks for the info, gents!

I’ve drastically slowed down on shooting as range availability has dropped for me over the years, meaning that I’ve gone more into collecting. I have or have recently had 10.3, 10.5, 11.5, 12.5, 13.9, 14.5, and 16. More than one for some of those. If I can only have one, it’s going to be a 14.5. That’s mostly because of the laws but it’s also just a very good all around length for the system and even if NFA wasn’t a thing, I’d be torn between 12.5 and 13.9, with the latter obviously being very close to a 14.5.


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[pangloss]

I'd vote for BCM or Colt with a mid-length gas system, but honestly I don't shoot enough for my opinion to be worth much. The 14.5" guns feel a lot handier to me than the 16" guns.

[HCM]

I’m reasonably proficient with handguns, but have never gotten into long guns. Now that I own a home, I’m thinking it’s time I have something. I’m buying with general self/home defense in mind.

What’s the go-to setup for carbines? Not the cheapest, not the best. Just where I should start. The “Glock 19” of carbines. Hoping to understand specifics… Make, model? Barrel length? Optic?

Presumably it’ll be something AR-pattern. Maybe BCM? S&W? Colt?

The Glock 19 of rifles is some variant of the Colt 6920. The Trooper, the OEM etc are all good to go.

16” barrel because both NFA and pin/weld guns are outside the scope of “Glock 19 of rifles”

2 point quick adjust sling (magpul, blue force gear, Viking tactics, etc)

A white light from Surefire or stream light.

A red dot optic from Aimpoint, EoTech, Holosun or SIG.

Magpul P mags or quality GI aluminum mags. 4-6 “working” mags and another 20 or 30 on hand because AR mags are cheap and they are a consumable. They work till they don’t then you throw them away and use a new one.

A small bottle of lube (doesn’t matter which) to keep with the rifle.

BCM, DD and LMT are also solid. The actual S&W M&P rifles (not the Sport) are good too IME but if I was only going to have one I’d want a 16” Colt or an LMT.

[Andy T]

Colt mid-length with Centurion rail

[HCM]

A S&W Sport II and a Magpul handguard is a good entry-level carbine. PSA had them on sale for $700 the other day.

The sport II is probably the best “budget” AR but it’s the AR equivalent of a S&W SD9VE rather than an “Glock 19.”

Colts are currently under $1k if you shop around.

[HCM]

Colt mid-length with Centurion rail

The 6960s would work too.

[DDTSGM]

I’m reasonably proficient with handguns, but have never gotten into long guns. Now that I own a home, I’m thinking it’s time I have something. I’m buying with general self/home defense in mind.

What’s the go-to setup for carbines? Not the cheapest, not the best. Just where I should start. The “Glock 19” of carbines. Hoping to understand specifics… Make, model? Barrel length? Optic?

Presumably it’ll be something AR-pattern. Maybe BCM? S&W? Colt?

Pretty sure this will be divided into two camps: 1) guys who will steer you towards a carbine length gas system and 2) guys that will steer you towards a mid-length gas system. If you aren't family with the two gas systems I'd do my due dilligence to help me decide:

https://partner-mco-archive.s3.amazo...1527866983.pdf

https://www.guntweaks.com/mid-length...s-systems.html

After that the groups will probably be divided into 1) those who suggest a conventional FSB (front sight base) rifle; and 2) those who suggest a free-float foreend. Generally speaking with a FSB rifle, the only sight you will have to buy is a rear sight; generally speaking with a free-float you will have to buy both front and rear sights. If you choose to use an optic (you should) you can skip the sights on the free-float, although many recommend you still install a set of BUIS (backup iron sights). You can put an optic on a FSB rifle, for me the only factor is making sure I get a mount that gives me a lower 1/3 co-witness. (co witness explained: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ogX-cIx9hpk ) I still put a rear sight on a FSB rifle.

A FSB rifle will generally come with mil-spec style handguards. These often provide problematic for attaching a weapon mounted light. Perhaps the easiest button to solve this problem is to purchase a set of Magpul SL Handguards: https://magpul.com/moeslhandguard-mi...obal_color=118

Advocates of the free-float will point out that there are many option for mounting extra equipment on the free-float. This is very true.

So, regardless of which type you choose you have additional expenses before you hit the range:

FSB: 1) Rear sight; 2) Optic; 3) probably new handguards - depending on rifle manufacturer
Free-Float: 1) Rear sight; 2) front sight; 3) optic (as mentioned you can decide to initially forego BUIS)

The next division of groups, and perhaps the most contentious one, will be over recommended manufacturers. There are numerous high-end manufacturers which, unless you are a multi-millionaire, are probably going to be too expense for a first AR. The next level I think of as boutique level manufacturers, they offer good quality, and are pretty much priced competitively with one another. In this group I would include BCM, Centurion Arms, Sionics, SOLGW as examples.

The 'middle' level is arguably occupied by one manufacturer - Colt. Generally Colt's prices are slightly lower than the boutique level. One point I should make here is that Colt is a mass producer of the M4/AR, the other makers we've talked about thus far do not truly produce in volume.

The next level are lower-priced manufacturers. Several of these, such as PSA and Anderson, I consider mass producers. This, to me, is wear the contention is greatest if you are making decisions on a 'what gives me the best bang for the buck.' For example if we want to consider FSB rifles here are some comparisons:

Colt M4 - $1099 https://www.colt.com/detail-page/col...-4-pos-stk-blk CARBINE LENGTH GAS

BCM MID 16 NOD 0 - $1354 https://www.brownells.com/guns/rifle...o-black-301rd/ MID-LENGTH GAS

SOLGW Patrol SL - $1235 https://xtremegunsandammo.com/shop/r...lgw-patrol-sl/ MID-LENGTH GAS

PSA PA-15 16" NITRIDE A2 MID-LENGTH - $650 - https://palmettostatearmory.com/psa-...165458949.html

In doing these comparisons, I'd have to say that the SOLGW is the most solid deal, but damn, looking at that PSA at half the price I'm thinking 'what could I spend the left over money on?' and 'Are those other rifles really half-again to twice as good?' This be why I build my own.

Good luck.