My mouse gun journey.

[fixer]

Don't have anything to offer for mouse gun suggestions, but my arthritis has been mitigated heavily by the following

Supplements: Osteobiflex with turmeric, glucosamine twice daily
PRP injections
Stretching, myofasical release, foam rolling
staying mobile and active
Collagen powder daily
When needed KT tape and bracing
Mattress topper, and detailed bed frame adjustments

[Trooper224]

I've often mentioned that I'm a big proponent of the shoulder holster, for certain situations.

For myself, I workout in the morning, in the courthouse gym before I go on duty. As such, I arrive in gym clothes, ie., no waistbelt. So, a shoulder holster is very handy in this context. These are the two I recently acquired.

On the left is an old Bianchi # 17, and on the right a horizontal holster I purchased off Amazon from an Eastern European company.



I've used the Galco Miami Classic for years as I find the four point harness to be ideal for larger, heavier handguns. However, the PP is niether large nor heavy. (If you consider this little pistol heavy, well, how much foam to you want on your latte Nancy?) Consequently, I was looking for a minimalist type of rig, rather than some kind of larger affair. I kept finding offerings in the $150-$200 range, but I just wasn't willing to live that high on the mountain with this one. I found both vintage and custom options. But, I wasn't going to pay that much for a little piece of vintage leather. I've also never gone custom on a shoulder rig. Most "custom" makers don't seem to really know what a shoulder rig is really for. They're typically far too thick and heavy, like a piece of horse tack, with lots of steel and brass hardware that will only rust and verdigris as it's perspired upon. These days they often seem to be made for strutting YouTubers rather than professional gun handlers.

I found the Bianchi on ebay and made a lowball bid of $30.00. I then forgot about it and found the horizontal rig for $65. A few days after I'd placed the order, I was notified that I'd won the Bianchi. Well okay, options are a good thing. The Bianchi arrived first, smelling like moldy Donkey ass, like these things always do. The Latvian special took its time on a slow gypsy wagon across Europe and arrived a couple of days ago.

The Bianchi holds the pistol in the holster by means on a spring clip sandwiched between two layers of leather. The upside is, it's very quick on the draw and the pistol is secure. The downside is, the gun rides high and forward. The butt jutts out a bit from my armpit, which causes a bit of printing. I don't know if the 17 was originally offered in several sizes, but the shoulder strap has minimal adjustment, so it is what it is. I'll hang onto it. Since it's a one size fits many job it may come in handy.

The Latvian Special doesn't have a downside and I'm actually a bit impressed with it. It's exactly what it needs to be and nothing more. It rides and conceals well, even under something like a sweater or pullover. Judging from the molding it appears to be made for a Sig 230, but the PP fits perfectly. This one will see most of the use. It also has a very Craig era Bond vibe, if that's your thing. In fact, it's advertised as the Spectre holster, if you cosplay bro.

I've also found that the PP isn't a gun you'll be able to fire hundreds of rounds through without cleaning. Two hundred at most and feeding becomes noticeably less smooth. It also shoots high and prints higher as the range increases. The hotter the ammo the lower it shoots. I'm sure this involves the mechanics of the blowback mechanism, recoil impulse, bullet weight, etc. I just don't have the desire to lay out the physics of it. It's not really an issue, just something to be aware of if you acquire one of these.

[Bruce Cartwright]

Thanks Bruce.

One of my .380s is a Beretta 70S. I bought it because I think it's one of the sexiest pistols ever made. It's a good shooter with a good trigger, and as a lifelong 1911 user I have no issue with it being single action. But, it does have two issues: the magazines are as rare as hens teeth and quite expensive when you can find them. Then there's the recoil.

The first time I shot it me youngest son was with me. He's a fine, strapping lad in his late twenties. He fired off a mag, turned to me and said, "Jesus Dad, that's a hand slapper." Sadly, it's off the list.

The second .380 is my Browning BDA. I hadn't shot it in several years and had no recollection as to recoil. I fired one mag of thirteen through it and it also went back in the safe.

I thinking what I really need may be a Beretta 81, in .32acp. It's extra capacity is a plus and it's a soft shooter. I'm kicking myself for not snagging one at a gunshow a couple of years ago. Beretta is making mags for them again, so a plus there.

As for the PP, parts are a blue million and new mags are easily available and reasonably priced. Holsters are also common. I ordered a few spare parts, some new grips and another shoulder holster. Everything is coming from Latvia, for some reason. Maybe the folks in that small country are big Bond fans.

Trooper 224:

Thats good information on all of those guns. Thanks for sharing those experiences. While I loved my Beretta Model 71 in 22 LR, I have never had the chance to fire one in either 32 ACP or 380 ACP and have never had a chance to assess their respective recoil levels. I also think the 32 ACP may be a sleeper in bigger guns in situations like yours. it is essentially a centerfire 22LR that suffers none of the issues with rimfire ammunition.

I've often mentioned that I'm a big proponent of the shoulder holster, for certain situations.

For myself, I workout in the morning, in the courthouse gym before I go on duty. As such, I arrive in gym clothes, ie., no waistbelt. So, a shoulder holster is very handy in this context. These are the two I recently acquired.

On the left is an old Bianchi # 17, and on the right a horizontal holster I purchased off Amazon from an Eastern European company.



I've used the Galco Miami Classic for years as I find the four point harness to be ideal for larger, heavier handguns. However, the PP is niether large nor heavy. (If you consider this little pistol heavy, well, how much foam to you want on your latte Nancy?) Consequently, I was looking for a minimalist type of rig, rather than some kind of larger affair. I kept finding offerings in the $150-$200 range, but I just wasn't willing to live that high on the mountain with this one. I found both vintage and custom options. But, I wasn't going to pay that much for a little piece of vintage leather. I've also never gone custom on a shoulder rig. Most "custom" makers don't seem to really know what a shoulder rig is really for. They're typically far too thick and heavy, like a piece of horse tack, with lots of steel and brass hardware that will only rust and verdigris as it's perspired upon. These days they often seem to be made for strutting YouTubers rather than professional gun handlers.

I found the Bianchi on ebay and made a lowball bid of $30.00. I then forgot about it and found the horizontal rig for $65. A few days after I'd placed the order, I was notified that I'd won the Bianchi. Well okay, options are a good thing. The Bianchi arrived first, smelling like moldy Donkey ass, like these things always do. The Latvian special took its time on a slow gypsy wagon across Europe and arrived a couple of days ago.

The Bianchi holds the pistol in the holster by means on a spring clip sandwiched between two layers of leather. The upside is, it's very quick on the draw and the pistol is secure. The downside is, the gun rides high and forward. The butt jutts out a bit from my armpit, which causes a bit of printing. I don't know if the 17 was originally offered in several sizes, but the shoulder strap has minimal adjustment, so it is what it is. I'll hang onto it. Since it's a one size fits many job it may come in handy.

The Latvian Special doesn't have a downside and I'm actually a bit impressed with it. It's exactly what it needs to be and nothing more. It rides and conceals well, even under something like a sweater or pullover. Judging from the molding it appears to be made for a Sig 230, but the PP fits perfectly. This one will see most of the use. It also has a very Craig era Bond vibe, if that's your thing. In fact, it's advertised as the Spectre holster, if you cosplay bro.

I've also found that the PP isn't a gun you'll be able to fire hundreds of rounds through without cleaning. Two hundred at most and feeding becomes noticeably less smooth. It also shoots high and prints higher as the range increases. The hotter the ammo the lower it shoots. I'm sure this involves the mechanics of the blowback mechanism, recoil impulse, bullet weight, etc. I just don't have the desire to lay out the physics of it. It's not really an issue, just something to be aware of if you acquire one of these.

.

I think Ken Null still makes a minimalist, lightweight upside down shoulder holster that was originally designed for folks to carry suppressed PPKs etc. It might be worth a look. I am partial to Milt Sparks leather, so if I were you, I'd give the Sparks folks a call and order up a 55 BN in horsehide with floral carving. Cmdr. Bond would be impressed...

Bruce

[Trooper224]

Trooper 224:

Thats good information on all of those guns. Thanks for sharing those experiences. While I loved my Beretta Model 71 in 22 LR, I have never had the chance to fire one in either 32 ACP or 380 ACP and have never had a chance to assess their respective recoil levels. I also think the 32 ACP may be a sleeper in bigger guns in situations like yours. it is essentially a centerfire 22LR that suffers none of the issues with rimfire ammunition.

.

I think Ken Null still makes a minimalist, lightweight upside down shoulder holster that was originally designed for folks to carry suppressed PPKs etc. It might be worth a look. I am partial to Milt Sparks leather, so if I were you, I'd give the Sparks folks a call and order up a 55 BN in horsehide with floral carving. Cmdr. Bond would be impressed...

Bruce

I think the 70 would be dandy in .32. I think it's a shame the .32 has been largely replaced by the .380. It seems to offer a lot in "larger small guns" over the .380. Better accuracy, no recoil, etc.

If the PP becomes a permanent fixture a call to Sparks will be in the future. They're my go-to.

I stretched the range out to fifteen yards today with very pleasing results. My reloading dies arrived today, so it's onto phase two of this project.

[JCN]

I also think the 32 ACP may be a sleeper in bigger guns in situations like yours. it is essentially a centerfire 22LR that suffers none of the issues with rimfire ammunition.

I thought the 25 ACP was the equivalent of the centerfire 22LR?

[BillSWPA]

I thought the 25 ACP was the equivalent of the centerfire 22LR?

You are correct but I trust the penetration of .22 more than the penetration of .25.

.32 offers a significant step up in power from both while still being very manageable in a larger gun, or even a tiny gun if it is a tilt barrel design.

I hope that more gun manufacturers recognize the value of .32 for shooters who need a low recoil option.

[Malamute]

What are the feelings and experiences with the Colt 1903 32s? My thoughts turn to them whenever 32 autos come up.

I had a couple long ago but let them get away. Ive always liked them though.

Dad slew a lamp in his room once with one when semi-dry firing. His dog wasnt real happy about it.

[Trooper224]

What are the feelings and experiences with the Colt 1903 32s? My thoughts turn to them whenever 32 autos come up.

I had a couple long ago but let them get away. Ive always liked them though.

Dad slew a lamp in his room once with one when semi-dry firing. His dog wasnt real happy about it.

I'm a fan of the 1903. It's always been on my grail list. I'd be hesitant to carry one though. The safety is hard to manage expeditiously. I've also read of a particular condition that can lead to a spontaneous discharge. For the life of me I can't remember the exact details, but it was something dealing with fire control parts, spring tension etc. I do know it made me very leary of the gun for carry. They're good shooters though, and so widespread in the first half of the 20th century that they must have something going for them.

[Malamute]

I'm a fan of the 1903. It's always been on my grail list. I'd be hesitant to carry one though. The safety is hard to manage expeditiously. I've also read of a particular condition that can lead to a spontaneous discharge. For the life of me I can't remember the exact details, but it was something dealing with fire control parts, spring tension etc. I do know it made me very leary of the gun for carry. They're good shooters though, and so widespread in the first half of the 20th century that they must have something going for them.

I recall reading of an instance that one left cocked and locked for an extended time fired when the hammer sear notch or sear sheared when in a guys coat pocket overnight.

If a guy was going to carry one I wonder if getting the hammer MP tested or magnufluxed or whatever the current NDT testing method would be worthwhile? A spare safety could be had and modified to make it easier to use. I see parts for them now and then. If I had a spare slide Id probably get more usable sights put on it. They still interest me, but like you said, they have some questions.

[Trooper224]

I recall reading of an instance that one left cocked and locked for an extended time fired when the hammer sear notch or sear sheared when in a guys coat pocket overnight.

If a guy was going to carry one I wonder if getting the hammer MP tested or magnufluxed or whatever the current NDT testing method would be worthwhile? A spare safety could be had and modified to make it easier to use. I see parts for them now and then. If I had a spare slide Id probably get more usable sights put on it. They still interest me, but like you said, they have some questions.

I think the issue for me is the fact that none of them are anywhere close to new and even spare parts fall into the same category. There are just too many unknowns with the type.

My PP is over 60 years old. However, it's an entirely different mechanism and new production spare parts are availbe for many of the components. It's Swedish LE surplus and other than finish wear it hasn't had a hard life. It was likely carried by some Swede traffic cop on a Vespa.

I'm sure one could go to the trouble of working out the kinks with the 1903, but the juice doesn't seem worth the squeeze as a practical exercise, at least for me.

I do think it's the coolest of the big small guns though.