Shooting well vs being a good shooter

[JCN]

@GJM Would it be fair to say that "shooting well" is a judgement of results, but being a "good shooter" is a judgement of process? IE, someone might get good results with a 53oz minor gun, without actually employing a good process which would yield good results from a 24 oz stock Glock?

I just finished shooting a match with a mostly stock G45 in Limited Minor from appendix, because that is what I carry. Most other people are shooting steel frame guns OWB, sure. It would be fair to say my main goal is improving the process of being a good shooter with my defensive gun who can use my brain (stage plan, rules, etc) while shooting. If I was -only- chasing good results ("shooting well") I guess it would make more sense to game the equipment as much as possible.

Obviously, tons of people are "good shooters", who happen to shoot a heavy metal gun. This would be a mindset issue and a continuum vs binary issue. But those same people can also shoot a plastic gun (Stoeger with a Glock) or anything else ( @JCN with a 365 or Taurus view or whatever weird project) very well.

My take on it:

One of my initial goals was to be versatile in everything pistol. Which is why I normally train with a DASA pistol and revolvers. That trigger press and the grip needed to support the press works very well across platforms including Glock.

Whatever I’ve been doing seems to work on all calibers and types of guns.

But my initial goal was to be a good shooter. I added PCC in order to get long guns up to speed and feel good about that too.

I like to shoot well at matches, but that’s a secondary goal. If I thought that competing with a P365 would make me a better shooter I’d do that.

But I haven’t found that to be the case.

Shooting a heavy gun to a high level seems to have helped my shooting everything else. YMMV.

[GJM]

So there are several local guys who are pretty solid shooters, using A01LDs, MPA, Staccatos, etc. I am an unranked amateur, using a subcompact, DAO, iron sighted gun, who typically will place ahead of these guys about 50% of the time. The skill is shooting fast, nothing more. I have watched them use a stock Glock and completely smoke me on raw time, but you add up the penalties and it isn't even close. The old saying of more dollars than sense comes to mind. Basically buying points, instead of developing skill. At a certain point, equipment matters, but in my experience, too many shooters spend money on the hardware, and don't invest time in the software.

off to yell at clouds.

I think most shooters are wired to be either fast or accurate but not both. I am wired towards accuracy.

It is an interesting question as to whether it is easier to teach a fast shoot accuracy, than an accurate shooter speed. Accurate shooters often take more comfort in their accuracy than is ideal for their development as a shooter.

[MVS]

Meh to the paragraph. Guy seems like a get off my lawn whiner. I get what you are going for, I usually say it a different way. The right gun can make you shoot better, but it won't make you a better shooter. That is totally up to you.

[MVS]

I think most shooters are wired to be either fast or accurate but not both. I am wired towards accuracy.

It is an interesting question as to whether it is easier to teach a fast shoot accuracy, than an accurate shooter speed. Accurate shooters often take more comfort in their accuracy than is ideal for their development as a shooter.

Yes, I mostly hear it is harder to teach an accurate shooter to shoot fast, than it is a fast shooter to shoot accurately.

[Clusterfrack]

I’m happy with my Shadow2s as the primary tool I use to develop my shooting skills. I like shooting polymer guns or even a mousegun because they’re a good way to confirm how well I’m doing. More importantly, I carry a polymer gun and occasionally a mousegun.

I’ve tried Open and SS Major, and they didn’t suit me. I think each person has to find what works for them, and that can take time and money…

[JCN]

The right gun can make you shoot better, but it won't make you a better shooter. That is totally up to you.

I love that. We have that saying with race cars and drivers too!

I think each person has to find what works for them, and that can take time and money…

Shit, I've been spending time and money just to experience stuff... even if I knew it wasn't going to be great, just to learn why and how.

Or to celebrate how truly awful some guns are hahaha.

It's part of the reason I enjoy driving really shitty rental cars on trips. They're a hoot if you can embrace the flavor of suck!

I'm not a car or gun snob. I like and choose certain things, but all things can be fun and you can learn from all things if you put your mind to it!

[DDTSGM]

It is an interesting question as to whether it is easier to teach a fast shoot accuracy, than an accurate shooter speed. Accurate shooters often take more comfort in their accuracy than is ideal for their development as a shooter.

IIRC, at the Roger's School lecture, Bill Rogers said to teach speed first then precision, IIRC.

[YVK]

Heavy gun vs light gun, i.e. recoil control issues, is just a narrow part of how we choose to challenge ourselves. Stoeger, who was mentioned above, used to put heavy mainsprings in his Elites to challenge the trigger control. Someone I know put a small window optic on a dry fire gun to challenge the index. When you're shooting a polymer CZ or a Glock, are you stuffing it full of Cajun or Ghost parts or working through the crunch and heft of stock parts? Do you shoot your stuff with carry comps and do you look for practice ammo to have some zip? Etc, etc.
In my mind this all comes to two things: appropriate goal setting and no-bs reality checks.

[LukeNCMX]

I think the answer is both. I enjoy the skill journey with the Glocks and I enjoy the performance of the metal guns. Train frequently and learn to like the process over the outcome and both ways make sense.

[jellydonut]

People that are good shooters are good shooters, regardless of whether they use a Glock or a Shadow 2. It comes down to what you prefer - handicap yourself with a plastic service pistol, or game the game with a heavy steel pistol.

I am one of the people tilting at windmills shooting my factory Glock against Shadow 2 owners and gamers, so I feel I can say this;

To me this kind of post feels like cope. "Yeah you beat me but you were shooting on easy mode". Silly mindset.