Beretta 92 vs HK P30

[TheNewbie]

Let me start by saying, I may never end up purchasing either one of these guns. This is in part, an exercise in fun and interesting discussion. My hope is not to waste anyone’s time. That said.


I’ve come to the conclusion that I prefer a manual safety on a gun. There are a number of reasons for this, but ultimately, I just feel more comfortable with one. I also like DA/SA guns.


Therefore I’m looking at both the Beretta 92 (especially the compact version) and the P30s. I’ve considered the PX4, but I find their decocker/safety lever even harder to reach/activate.


Beretta:

Nice trigger and it can easily be improved by the end user
Plenty of support
Lots of copies around


Heavy
Not as easy to conceal
I’m not sure I can consistently take the safety off. Maybe a vertec grip would make me more consistent in doing so?



HK P30:

Light weight
Durable and reliable
Easy to use safety
Enough support


Trigger felt bad in dry fire
Worried I’ll accidentally activate the magazine release when shooting




The gun would be carried in an exposed holster and also AIWB.



What are the thoughts of the collective ?

[Joe in PNG]

As much as I love the 92 platform, I'd probably take a good look at the P30, even going as far as renting one if possible.
It seems to have the advantage if one wants to carry with a safety on. The 92 is better as a G decock only in my opinion, or as a D DAO.

[TheNewbie]

As much as I love the 92 platform, I'd probably take a good look at the P30, even going as far as renting one if possible.
It seems to have the advantage if one wants to carry with a safety on. The 92 is better as a G decock only in my opinion, or as a D DAO.

I’m thinking your right. The store has a rental P30, but I have not had time to try it. Work, mowing, school, IMVs (identified Mexican visitors) have all interrupted my pursuit of safety equipped DA/SA gun.

[Gadfly]

It seems to have the advantage if one wants to carry with a safety on. The 92 is better as a G decock only in my opinion, or as a D DAO.

^^ THIS^^

Not really a practical reason to carry a 92 with the safety on. The gun is perfectly safe Hammer down on a loaded chamber. I get wanting a safety on a fully tensioned striker type gun, like an M&P or a P320. But on a hammer fired DA gun, its just extra steps.

As far as our question goes, I find frame mounted safeties far easier to use than slide mounted ones (from growing up on a 1911 I assume). If you have to go with a slide mounted safety, Berretta is the probably the best of the bunch for easy of operation. Beretta will have a FAR better trigger than the HK, especially the DA pull.

But hammer down carry, on a DA gun, in a holster that covers the trigger guard... that's pretty damn safe without manual safety.

[TheNewbie]

^^ THIS^^

Not really a practical reason to carry a 92 with the safety on. The gun is perfectly safe Hammer down on a loaded chamber. I get wanting a safety on a fully tensioned striker type gun, like an M&P or a P320. But on a hammer fired DA gun, its just extra steps.

As far as our question goes, I find frame mounted safeties far easier to use than slide mounted ones (from growing up on a 1911 I assume). If you have to go with a slide mounted safety, Berretta is the probably the best of the bunch for easy of operation. Beretta will have a FAR better trigger than the HK, especially the DA pull.

But hammer down carry, on a DA gun, in a holster that covers the trigger guard... that's pretty damn safe without manual safety.

I agree, and early in my shooting life it probably would have been too much to try to learn. Now I feel more comfortable with my abilities.


The safety offers an extra margin of....well...safety, in a wide variety of circumstances. If they made an LEM version with one, I would get that (there was a limited run of long slide P30 Lem guns with safeties). It’s perfectly reasonable to not want a safety, especially on a TDA gun, so your point makes sense.


Maybe if Smith did a full size M&P with a grip safety, as a really poor man’s poly 2011 knock off, I would consider it.

[OfficeCat]

No experience with the Beretta but a big fan of the P30. Mine's LEM so I can't comment on the safety or DA trigger. I find the paddle mag release to be perferct for me. I have relatively short thumbs and have always had to shift my grip to activate a traditional thumb button mag release. With the HK paddle I use my trigger finger, sweeping down and back as my finger comes off the trigger. It's perfectly placed for that. I can't imagine how I could accidentally activate it.

It carries and conceals very well for me in a JMCK AIWB 2.0. Grip is long but it tucks in well enough that I don't really notice much difference between it and my P30SK, which I had purchased first. Backstrap options are nice.

[JonInWA]

I like both platforms, but prefer both as a DAO with the Beretta (92D) or LEM with the HK (P30L V1.5 LEM).

Good as the Beretta is (and it's quite good-accuracy-wise, reliability-wise, durability-wise, etc.) the ergos are absolutely superb on the P30-especially given the ergonomic tailor-ability due to the 3 backstraps and 6 side panels of varying thicknesses and girth.

Beyond field stripping, the Beretta is easier to perform a detailed disassembly on, and with no real specialty tools required. The HK has longer intervals on forecasted component replacements.

While significant aftermarket cottage industry and components are available for both, out of the box the Beretta likely will have a nicer triggerpull, but LTT's Trigger Job In A Bag (TGIB) is highly recommended, both for an improved trigger, increased triggerbar durability, and the revised triggerbar geometry allowing for decreased strength mainsprings, making for a lighter triggerpull effort.

Even though my 92D has had the Wilson extended magazine release added, I prefer the OEM HK magazine paddle releases on the P30 (and the VPs) for accessibility and ease of use-they're significantly larger than the paddles on the earlier HK USPs and P2000s. I've never had either magazine release inadvertently actuate, but on the 92, might want to make sure that your holster(s) have a release clearance cut or are splayed out enough in the release area.

It's p-f; just get both....

Best, Jon

[Noah]

I agree, and early in my shooting life it probably would have been too much to try to learn. Now I feel more comfortable with my abilities.


The safety offers an extra margin of....well...safety, in a wide variety of circumstances. If they made an LEM version with one, I would get that (there was a limited run of long slide P30 Lem guns with safeties). It’s perfectly reasonable to not want a safety, especially on a TDA gun, so your point makes sense.


Maybe if Smith did a full size M&P with a grip safety, as a really poor man’s poly 2011 knock off, I would consider it.

You can convert a P30S to a LEM and keep the safety!

As far as the 92 safety, don't "flip" it up, but actually press forward and down on it as if sweeping a 1911 safety. Makes it much more ergonomic and how it was designed.

You can also get a 92 style lever for a PX4.

[P30]

HK P30:
[...]
Trigger felt bad in dry fire
Worried I’ll accidentally activate the magazine release when shooting

Do you mean the trigger felt bad in DA or SA? Did you try a V3? What do you mean by "bad"? Heavy, mushy or scratchy?
You can reduce the trigger pull weight by replacing the firing pin safety spring by a lighter one from HK (reduces SA weight from 2.4 kg = 5.3 lb to 2.0 kg = 4.4 lb and also reduces DA weight, I did).
And you can replace the hammer spring by the match hammer spring from HK, this also reduces the trigger pull weight (I did not yet).

Concerning the paddle mag release: I prefer it over a button, can change the mag quickly with it. Only a matter of training.

But my favorite P30 trigger variant is not V3 (DA/SA), it's V4 CH (medium-weight LEM with shortened pre-travel).

[Gadfly]

You can also get a 92 style lever for a PX4.

What sorcery is this?

interesting
Link? Pic?