P380HST1(s) question

[No.6]

Please note: this thread is not about whether 380 has or has not any particular value or application, but just a specs question, and I can't think of anywhere else that might know and not get bogged down in the usual discussion about 9x17.

Federal .380 auto HST comes in two part numbers:
- P380HST1S is the 20 round 'Personal Defense HST Micro 380 Auto' box (https://www.federalpremium.com/handg...P380HST1S.html)
- P380HST1 is the 50 round 'Tactical HST' box (https://le.vistaoutdoor.com/download...LE_Catalog.pdf, p.3)

Both state 99 grain projectile. Per the links above, the 1S states velocity of 935 fps at the muzzle; the 1 states 1030.

Is it known whether this is an actually different loading and product; reporting of the same actual round from different test barrel lengths; a typographical error; a change made over time to the product and not reflected in one site; or something else?

A quick blitz through a couple of youtuber tests and gunmag sites seems like the earlier tests from when the round was introduced are slower than those vids and pages done more recently. Some even report the velocity being greater than manufacturer spec (and those being the written ones, I have no idea if they opened a box of 50 or 20, or if it mattered). Thus, I'm curious.

Again, not implying that either of these products would or would not meet any particular standard out of any barrel, dropped from orbit, or thrown briskly at someone; but the discrepancy is interesting.

[Velo Dog]

I am also curious exactly when and why the listed velocity was changed.

In 2020 the Personal Defense HST Micro 380 Auto 99 Grain was listed on www.federalpremium.com as having a muzzle velocity of 1030 fps from a 3.75 inch test barrel for 233 ft-lb of energy.

The Personal Defense Hydra-Shok Deep 380 Auto 99 Grain was advertised at 1000 fps. It is now shown as only 975 fps.

Both loads would have been very powerful for a SAAMI spec 380 Auto cartridge, but perhaps that level of power was needed in order to achieve a certain measure of performance. Or perhaps Federal thought customers would buy into the "more is better" marketing.

"More Changes Everything" as the company that introduced the 30 Super Carry - "the most revolutionary self-defense advancement in nearly 100 years" - would say.

Maybe honest mistakes were made. Like how the Federal 38G offering -which is a 38 Special +P Lead Semi-Wadcutter Hollow Point - is described as a Jacketed Hollow Point in that same law enforcement catalog.

[Joe Mac]

The Personal Defense Hydra-Shok Deep 380 Auto 99 Grain was advertised at 1000 fps. It is now shown as only 975 fps.

FWIW, I got an average of 926 from a G42 and 903 from an LCP with the Hydra-Shok Deep .380.

Unlike, say, 9mm – for which advertised velocities are generally from 4" barrels, and reasonably accurate – I think they're still listing .380 velocities as if we're launching it from an 80-series Beretta or Walther PP... In any event, the 'Deep' load has tested well from more common .380 barrel lengths.

Edit: yeah, just looked at their site and the .380 spec is from a 3.75" barrel.

[Velo Dog]

"More Changes Everything" as the company that introduced the 30 Super Carry - "the most revolutionary self-defense advancement in nearly 100 years" - would say.

I have no inside information, but here is my cynical suspicion.

Federal invested a lot of resources and prestige into 30 Super Carry and presently stands to benefit from a larger perceived gap between 380 Auto and 9mm Luger.

This might explain why both the Hydra-Shok Deep 380 Auto 99 Grain and the Hydra-Shok Low Recoil 9mm Luger 135 Grain are currently unavailable at www.federalpremium.com

https://www.ssusa.org/content/380-au...0-super-carry/

"My results show that .380 Auto +P ammo gets reasonably close to .30 Super Carry ballistics when they are fired through barrels of the same length."

"Comparing the same weight 100-grain Underwood .380 Auto +P load to the average of the three 100-grain .30 Super Carry loads, the .380 Auto +P is short of the .30 Super Carry by 67 f.p.s. and 33 foot-pounds. That’s not much difference."