ARMY RIFLE QUALS IMPROVE SCORE

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They qualed with irons in boot camp but re qual is usually with the cco a red dot with no magnification. Interesting.

Another interesting note I talked to another person in the same unit their section quals with both irons and cco. As he told me “because we are not pussies”, gotta love these young bucks.

[JSGlock34]

While I think a carbine class will increase overall skill and confidence with the carbine, I’m not sure it will translate directly to better performance on the qual course. Most carbine classes emphasize manipulations and closer distances - and often that’s a limitation of a commercial range.

In my (admittedly dated) opinion, much of the problem with the qual course is tied to the 25M zero, which is suboptimal and contributes to shooting over mid range targets. Take a course with any notable instructor who covers zero and I suspect you’ll leave with a 50 or 100 zero. Understanding how the zero affects the mid range targets can help - I doubt the Army is covering this in Basic.

You can also learn the qual course sequence- it doesn’t change (at least it hadn’t - again it’s been a while) - it’s in the manual. So you’ll spend less time scanning for targets if you know what’s next. We used to set up a dry fire course with canteens to simulate the pop up target placement and call out the sequence.

I do understand that a new qual is rolling out but I’m not sure how quickly.

I still think a class is a smart investment but I’d look at the curriculum and venue.

[Yute]

The new Qual (-40) has been in use for 2 years and has been the standard at BCT and unit qualifications.
Paper qual (Alt-C) is no longer used except for validation when a qual range is not possible.

I have found that this is image is helpful for Soldiers to visualize their POA for hold unders with a 300m zero:


Ideally we should all qual with optics and irons but given the limitations of ammunition, the reality is, at least non combat arms folks, you will only qualify on one of them.


This video is one we put up on a big projector for Soldiers to run through the sequence of fire:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_GrVjnrkOM

[JSGlock34]

The new Qual (-40) has been in use for 2 years and has been the standard at BCT and unit qualifications.
Paper qual (Alt-C) is no longer used except for validation when a qual range is not possible.

I have found that this is image is helpful for Soldiers to visualize their POA for hold unders with a 300m zero:


Ideally we should all qual with optics and irons but given the limitations of ammunition, the reality is, at least non combat arms folks, you will only qualify on one of them.


This video is one we put up on a big projector for Soldiers to run through the sequence of fire:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q_GrVjnrkOM

Thanks - great pic and illustrates exactly what I’m getting at. With the 25/300M zero you can have a POA/POI deviation of nearly a foot on some of the mid range targets, which means if you are aiming upper center mass, you are actually landing shots on the head or shooting over. Knowing your hold unders can make a real difference since so many of the targets are in that 150-200M range.

I took a carbine class with Vickers - geez over a decade ago - and he had us zero at 100. His view was he wanted to eliminate hold unders completely. I probably shot the furthest with Ernest Langdon; he had us zero at 50. Unfortunately, you don’t get to pick your zero in the conventional force.

[JHC]

I teach preliminary marksmanship instruction for my unit.

Aside from shooting fundamentals, the new Army qual forces the Soldier to be more familiar in both how their weapon works, and how their gear is set up. You have to know how to clear malfunction/prevent malfunctions from occurring as there are no alibis. You have to have your mags staged on your body in a way you can easily access them, and in different positions (prone, kneeling, standing). Invest in good pouches.

Dry fire is essential, particularly with all your gear.

People throw shade a the EST (electronic simulator) all the time, but I've always found it a good predictor of performance. Try to go through the EST as many times as your unit allows you. Also has aircon so why wouldn't you want to be in there.

You have to establish a good zero. If you can't group to the 6 MOA standard, work on your fundamentals. Consistency is key. Ideally it should be to group within 4 MOA. Don't let someone clear you off the Zero range without a good zero otherwise you will not qual.

Be familiar with hold unders. Because we use a 25/300m zero, holding under is helpful for the 150-250m targets.

USE THE BARRICADE FOR SUPPORT. When shooting kneeling and standing supported, I am leaning my entire weight onto my rifle, anchoring my magazine against the barricade. The barricade will not tip over. It makes a huge difference for the 200-300m shots when my heart is pumping.

Because of the dynamic nature of the qual, wearing armor, etc, I find the use of iron sights is a significant penalty. Using the CCO (Aimpoint) is significantly easier, using the RCO (ACOG) is basically cheating. Unfortunately it will be up to your units on what you get.

Sometimes the lanes don't record hits. Some of the ranges have very difficult targets to see and have foliage that obscure more than what is specified on the TC. Some ranges have green targets than blend into the background, others have orange ones that can be seen 500m out. While we all want to get expert, sometimes there are factors beyond our control that only the big green weenie has a say in.

Very important feedback in this re the new qual.

No alibis and no stops once the qual starts. The Soldier has to be more fluid with gunhandling skills and moving through the positions. Quite different than the old qual. No alibis. Once the time starts the Soldier has to move through the positions and execute unprompted reloads etc.

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So just a question how reasonable would it be to practice with scaled targets and a S&W 15-22?

[JSGlock34]

You could buy Alt-C targets and practice those…but I think that’ll just get you better at…Alt-C. But I do exactly this with my son from time to time (shoot Alt-C with a 15-22). It’s fun - he likes shooting for score.

Given Yute’s point about being able to shoot a good zero, I’d start there with the military zero target at 25. Make sure the fundamentals are sound.

[Yute]

So just a question how reasonable would it be to practice with scaled targets and a S&W 15-22?

I actually do this - helpful this particularly if you can work your speed reloads and your transitions on the range. I use the Alt-c target (https://shop.actiontarget.com/conten...ion-target.asp) with a Tippmann Arms M4-22 (I have a M&P 15-22 but vastly prefer the Tippmann Arms rifle).

I run the target at 25 yards.

Only thing the target doesn’t do is show hold unders well.

The sequence of fire is in the TC manual so it helps to have a buddy shout out the target to hit, e.g. right 300m.

[Caballoflaco]

I actually do this - helpful this particularly if you can work your speed reloads and your transitions on the range. I use the Alt-c target (https://shop.actiontarget.com/conten...ion-target.asp) with a Tippmann Arms M4-22 (I have a M&P 15-22 but vastly prefer the Tippmann Arms rifle).

I run the target at 25 yards.

Only thing the target doesn’t do is show hold unders well.

The sequence of fire is in the TC manual so it helps to have a buddy shout out the target to hit, e.g. right 300m.

I think one could add some orange stickers or something to the hold points for the midrange targets to help train that.

[Yute]

What’s interesting is that the old M16a1 alt-c target seems to have hold unders built in, but I’ve never found the source to support that or history of the target.
https://www.grainger.com/product/ACT...ed-Fire-48FT25