Georgia Arms .38 spl Snub Nose wadcutter ammo and "Safestop" ammo

[Jamie]

I have been following the P-F thread Precision Delta .38 spl wadcutters.

And since I know P-F abhors a thread drift, , I thought I'd start one here.

I listened to the Off Duty/On Duty podcast #96 referenced Very informative podcast with some solid info. I'll try to link but be warmed I'm a technotard.

The Georgia Arms .38 spl snub load is also mentioned, iirc on DB's Facebook page. As well as The Revlover Guy blog site where I am a Pateron supporter.

I ordered a couple of boxes of it to try out in my frequently shot and almost always carried LCR.

I'll list some chrono data and observations below.

The Ga Arms lists it's Zero bullet 148 gr lead wadcutter at 750 fps from a 1 7/8" barrel, 825 fps from a 4" barrel.

This certainly rung a bell in my old brain and I looked back in my reloading and ammo notes and found an entry for 2005. I found some info regarding a box of .38 spl Safe Stop ammo made by Fuzzy Fletcher of Village Metalworks in collaboration with Jim Cirillo. Mr. Cirillo mentions this concept of this round in his book "Gun, Bullets, and Gunfighters". RIP Sir.
I was hanging with the old Baton Rouge training group and active on TPI at the time. I was given the ammo by one of the members to chrono and give my observations. I did correspond (traded emails) with Fuzzy back then. Great guy!

The Safestop 148 gr plated .38 spl ammo chronoed at 719 fps from my 1992 S&W 640 ,38 spl in August 2005. My notes say the recoil was subjectively brisk it was, and again subjectively much less so than the Winchester 159 gr LSWC HP I carried at the time.

To the best of my knowledge Village Metalworks went out of business some years ago..decade + like?

I still had a box of the Safestop rounds so I ordered some of the newly minted 148 gr Snubby Rounds mentioned from Georgia Arms.

I have been carrying Federal Gold Medal Match wadcutters in my .38's until now.


Chrono data from 21 March 2023, Monday.

I assume the BC gap in my LCR attributed to the increased velocity compared with my old 640...but that's a WAG due to my ignorance hence my constant reading here on P-F!

.38 spl Safestop Fuzzy Fletcher/Jim Cirillo
148 gr Rainer plated wadcutter
Ruger LCR ORSA Oak Ridge, TN
Avg FPS = 811

Georgia Arms Snubby Self Defense .38 spl ammo
148 gr Lead Wadcutter (? Zero bullet)
ORSA Oak Ridge, TN
Ruger LCR 754 fps
S&W (1992 Model 640) 735 fps
S&W Model 10 791 fps


2005 Safestop mentioned above:
McNeill Range Mississippi 23 Aug. 2005
S&W Mod. 640 J-Frame 1 7/8" barrel
719.3 fps

I didn't do any shooting for accuracy that day as I was shooting with friends and we spent the rest of the afternoon steel. I was running my RDS G19 and Model 10 using my handloads with SA primers.
I'll get to the indoor range in the next couple of days and see how, with my limited skills, accuracy runs.

I am personally very pleased to have an accurate and AVAILABLE .38 wadcutter Factory round being produced, even moreso that trusted members and SME's from our community had input into it's development.

I hope, plead, that a .32 S&W long and or .32 H&R mag version will follow. Hint Hint anyone with any input...

Trying some links...

https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....dcutters/page2

https://www.georgia-arms.com/38-spec...adcutter-20pk/


https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcas...=1000598534194


Mods please feel free to delete, modify, or correct any transgressions here. Again, I am admitted technotard...


ETA pic purchased in 1992, carried a lot and shot a lot!

[feudist]

IIRC Cirillo's idea for the Safestop was a jacketed wadcutter that had the jacket slightly proud of the nose, facilitating it cutting into bone at oblique angles, a deficiency he noted in his first gunfight.
The flat of the nose was given a single groove across the diameter to a certain depth that allowed the bullet to fracture and spread widely. This spread was to be limited by the thickness/hardness of the jacket.
He wrote an article in 91/92 where he demonstrated it in a "collagen" block covered with a couple of tube socks for Ayoob and reported getting satisfactory penetration and impressive expansion.
I think he designed an autoloading version that had a round nosed cap that allowed feeding but flew off after firing(?)

He also made "Pin Grabbers", saw-toothed JHPs for big bore pin shooting. He called them "Felon Grabbers"...

BTW, my picture is in the book. I'm the guy with the shit eating grin in the Springfield Armory hat and Shoot-Me-First vest.

So...I'm kind of a big deal...

[Jamie]

@feudist Page 89! I'd be grinning too! Good shooting! And that is a "big deal"!

Now I have to reread Cirillo's book again for the umpteenth time LOL

Those rounds with my 640 pictured above are some of the slightly proud Rainier bullets Fuzzy loaded, but no scoring.

I wish I had stocked up on those Rainier WC's before they went out of business.

[Jamie]

I mentioned to @Wayne Dobbs on another thread that I would chrono a few more rounds on the Georgia Arms on my next outdoor range trip.

I really like this ammo!

I chronoed 6 rounds out of my Model 66 4 inch this morning.

796-797-797-796-816-811 avg 802 fps

I only wish I could load that consistently!


The lack of accuracy is totally on me. This is quality ammo imho.
My LCR and 640 are loaded with this ammo.

My appreciation to Wayne and group for bringing this ammo into fruition.

Waiting for the .32 S&W version... hopefully


Outdoor range 4-25-23




Indoor range 4-24-23

[Shawn Dodson]

Yes, a .32 version would be awesome!

[Up1911Fan]

I emailed them interest in a 32 version, hopefully everyone else does as well.

[Jamie]

I emailed them interest in a 32 version, hopefully everyone else does as well.

2nd email sent

Thanks

[Up1911Fan]

I heard from GA and they said a 32 Wadcuttter was in the long term plans.

[Jamie]

Anyone have any new info on the status of Georgia Arms.

I tried bookface and Instagram but my cyberskills are admittedly very weak... P-F is my Social Media

It looks like they are working area gunshows fwiw

[RJ]

Georgia Arms Snubby Self Defense .38 spl ammo
148 gr Lead Wadcutter (? Zero bullet)
ORSA Oak Ridge, TN
Ruger LCR 754 fps
S&W (1992 Model 640) 735 fps
S&W Model 10 791 fps

Thanks Jamie, this is a useful post.

By chance did you compare the speeds of the GA Arms Wadcutters to Federal GMM? I carry that in my .38 LCR also. Federal lists it as 690 out of a 4" barrel (barrel length is listed as "4-V"), but I'm assuming it would be a bit less out of a snubby...