LAPD TAKES DOWN THIN BLUE LINE FLAG

[AMC]

These type of 'Themed' American Flags have proliferated in my opinion because our society has lost a common sense of the 'sacred', which the flag used to be for most Americans. Now it's just another 'tribal' symbol. These modified American Flags just contribute to that. As a symbol I'd rather have the plain Thin Blue Line flag.....though again I don't believe those have a place in government buildings or on vehicles. They are a (valid) representation of a sense of 'separation' in a way....which though true in a sense, should not be displayed in stations, vehicles or uniforms. The American flag, state and city or county Flags are what should be there, because those symbolize what you swore to protect. My 2 cents.

ETA: I felt this way about memorial or commemorative pins, hats and patches as well. If it was a fundraiser for something I supported, I'd purchase it as a keepsake. That stuff just has no place on a duty uniform though. The uniform is not the place to display your uniqueness as an individual who is discovering their 'truth'. Some guys started to look like Russell from 'Up' with all their merit badges and hats. I realize my opinion was unpopular in some circles.....but the opinions of adults are often unpopular with the children in their charge.

[eric0311]

These type of 'Themed' American Flags have proliferated in my opinion because our society has lost a common sense of the 'sacred', which the flag used to be for most Americans. Now it's just another 'tribal' symbol. These modified American Flags just contribute to that. As a symbol I'd rather have the plain Thin Blue Line flag.....though again I don't believe those have a place in government buildings or on vehicles. They are a (valid) representation of a sense of 'separation' in a way....which though true in a sense, should not be displayed in stations, vehicles or uniforms. The American flag, state and city or county Flags are what should be there, because those symbolize what you swore to protect. My 2 cents.

ETA: I felt this way about memorial or commemorative pins, hats and patches as well. If it was a fundraiser for something I supported, I'd purchase it as a keepsake. That stuff just has no place on a duty uniform though. The uniform is not the place to display your uniqueness as an individual who is discovering their 'truth'. Some guys started to look like Russell from 'Up' with all their merit badges and hats. I realize my opinion was unpopular in some circles.....but the opinions of adults are often unpopular with the children in their charge.

Couldn’t agree more.

[BehindBlueI's]

My paternal grandfather was my hero when I was young. Or, honestly, to this day. You know the Randy Travis song "He walked on water"? That's me and him, except he died younger. I can't exaggerate how much I loved him, wanted to be him, respected him, and how devastated I was when he died. I've lost a lot of friends and family since, but his is still the hardest. He was a WWII and Korean War vet and got the full veteran send off. After his funeral I made a little shrine to him in my room with an American flag, some shell casings from his final salute, and a cut out of his obituary put into a baseball card protective sleeve. I taped the obituary to the flag. My grandmother found it shortly after and gently, but firmly, explained we didn't attach *anything* to the flag, not even for Pap. It's over 30 years later but that message resonates across the years. If it wasn't right to do it for Pap it's not right to do it for anyone or anything, and I don't.

[RevolverJIM]

Agreed. Nothing touching the flag, nothing laying on top of the Bible.

[jd950]

I had never thought about the TBL flag as a desecration, but the comments here have me thinking about this.

On the one hand, i do have a revrance for our flag and do not like to see it disrespected or abused.

On the other hand, since the 1800's, there has been a history in this country of presidential candidates using the U.S. flag emblazoned with their image and/or slogans as campaign items. Various states put some stylized version on their license plates, or have in the past. Sometimes sold at extra cost as vanity plates. I constantly see U.S. flags with words or symbols of the U.S. Army, Marines, Navy, etc., added.

There is no enforceable law on the topic and so no court has defined desecration. Generally to desecrate something is to to treat it with disrespect, or irreverence or in a profane manner. Regarding some thing like a TBL flag or flag with the marine Corps emblem on it, is that really disrectful? Such concepts are really subjective, as opposed to burning the flag publicly, scrawling graffiti on it, walking on it, etc.

If Lincoln could put his name on the flag while running for President and that is not desecration, maybe the TBL flag is not a desecration either, when flown to show support for our nation of laws and those who enforce those laws? The flag is defined in federal law as "any flag of the United States, or any part thereof, made of any substance, of any size, in a form commonly displayed." So the flag includes pins and buttons and whatever. Not sure about this. Maybe it all depends on the purpose or intent of the alteration? I need to think on it some more. Still the REASON that LAPD took down the flag is BS.

Is this American Legion pin a desecration?

[BehindBlueI's]

I had never thought about the TBL flag as a desecration, but the comments here have me thinking about this.

On the one hand, i do have a revrance for our flag and do not like to see it disrespected or abused.

On the other hand, since the 1800's, there has been a history in this country of presidential candidates using the U.S. flag emblazoned with their image and/or slogans as campaign items. Various states put some stylized version on their license plates, or have in the past. Sometimes sold at extra cost as vanity plates. I constantly see U.S. flags with words or symbols of the U.S. Army, Marines, Navy, etc., added.

There is no enforceable law on the topic and so no court has defined desecration. Generally to desecrate something is to to treat it with disrespect, or irreverence or in a profane manner. Regarding some thing like a TBL flag or flag with the marine Corps emblem on it, is that really disrectful? Such concepts are really subjective, as opposed to burning the flag publicly, scrawling graffiti on it, walking on it, etc.

If Lincoln could put his name on the flag while running for President and that is not desecration, maybe the TBL flag is not a desecration either, when flown to show support for our nation of laws and those who enforce those laws? The flag is defined in federal law as "any flag of the United States, or any part thereof, made of any substance, of any size, in a form commonly displayed." So the flag includes pins and buttons and whatever. Not sure about this. Maybe it all depends on the purpose or intent of the alteration? I need to think on it some more. Still the REASON that LAPD took down the flag is BS.

Is this American Legion pin a desecration?

Reasonable minds may differ, but to me the pin is not desecration because it's a pin first and a (partial) flag second.

I'm not terribly concerned with the state of the law. The 1st Amendment allows for disrespect, and should. I think the larger point to me is that the US Flag is for all of us, and while Lincoln's use may have been fine and acceptable in Lincoln's day would not sit right with me today either. The flag isn't just for him and his supporters.

I'm also not terribly concerned with symbols to begin with. The person's intent certainly matters more. I speak only for myself when I say I wouldn't do it and wouldn't feel right about it. Worrying about the symbols is worrying the edges of the issue at best.

[psalms144.1]

Thread drift - the concept of the US Flag as sacred is so dead, we ought to stop whipping it. On the drive back from VA on Friday, I passed an 18-wheeler with a US flag attached to the back of the trailer. Nice, patriotic display, right? EXCEPT, the white stripes were stained a gnarly, dingy gray, the stars were dirty, and the flag itself was a tattered mess - damned near just a bunch of red and gray streamers. An utter disgrace, but I'm sure the driver thought he was being uber 'Murhrican...

[jd950]

It may well be a dead issue, but the comments by others got me thinking about the TBL flag in a different way. It is probably something that simply will vary based on personal feelings, but I am still working on how I feel about it.

[AMC]

Thread drift - the concept of the US Flag as sacred is so dead, we ought to stop whipping it. On the drive back from VA on Friday, I passed an 18-wheeler with a US flag attached to the back of the trailer. Nice, patriotic display, right? EXCEPT, the white stripes were stained a gnarly, dingy gray, the stars were dirty, and the flag itself was a tattered mess - damned near just a bunch of red and gray streamers. An utter disgrace, but I'm sure the driver thought he was being uber 'Murhrican...

I refuse to adopt the attitudes of fools and malcontents. The fact that some yabbo driving a truck doesn't get that his use of the flag is disrespectful doesn't make it any less so. I"m not a fan of a flag flying on vehicles except military vehicles in a parade or the President/Vice Presidents limos. But I'm just a grumpy old retired dude, so everyone stay off my lawn.

[Trooper224]

The TBL flag is like every other bit of tribalist geedunk that's proliferated over the past decade. It's one more example of "look at me!" emotional masturbation that has no place in a professional setting such as a police station.

On the other hand, there are far more important things to be concerned over right now, I would think.