I have a buddy that lives in AZ that wants to go to the GunSite 260 Shotgun course, and knowing I’m into training, he asked my opinion of the class. The problem is I’ve never been to GunSite.
Given GunSite’s pedigree and reputation I’m surmising that it’d be money well spent.. but I don’t know what I don’t know.
Any thoughts and opinions on that particular course?
Thanks!
I have taken it, and it is a good course.Originally Posted by DacoRoman
One complaint I have about shotgun classes, is often they cram two days of material into 3 or 5 days.
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
Sounds like classes at our state criminal justice training commission. Every 20 minutes you're divided into small groups to discuss a very simple problem for 10 minutes, when they could've called upon any random student to answer it in 30 seconds, and you end up contemplating suicide in the bathroom on breaks.
The curriculum is built around using a shotgun as your general purpose long-arm and is heavy on using slugs to push the distance. This is where your sighting system will have an impact on things. If you have a big front sight to maximize speed with buckshot at closer distances, you may struggle with some of the slug shots. I found that my front sight was wider than the steel on many of the shots.
Personally, I think FliteControl has vastly reduced the need for slugs except for those living in hungry bear country or those that may have to take down a vehicle.
The class does give one lots of practice in manipulations, but some of that time is spent on select-slug/ammo-exchanges, which are great in theory but don't happen during a fight.
If one just wants to learn how to run the gun, there are more cost effective options with more manipulations practice (and more current), but if you want to also get some time clearing a buildings, etc, you'll get that in the Gunsite class.
There's also no substitute for going to Gunsite to pay homage to the birthplace of modern firearms instruction.
I had an ER nurse in a class. I noticed she kept taking all head shots. Her response when asked why, "'I've seen too many people who have been shot in the chest putting up a fight in the ER." Point taken.
I completed the Gunsite 260 Tactical Shotgun course (5 1/2 days, IIRC) in April 1995. It was an excellent class, and the most enjoyable of several training courses I have taken at Gunsite and elsewhere. I would recommend it, (based on my experience from almost 28 years ago).
Depends on your personality, what your background is and what you want to get out of it.
If you have the financial flexibility for the tuition and travel, I'd recommend you go.
Before I retired from the military, we conducted a "Senior NCO Offsite" at Gunsite for the week attending 260 (3-Days) and Shotgun ATP (2-Days).
Attendees had various levels of shotgun experience, and all had a great time and valued the experience.
For context, I've also attended formal shotgun training with Louis Awerbuck, Scott Reitz, Randy Cain and Rob Haught.
It is very crawl, walk and run and starts with loading/unloading, lots of manipulation and culminated at the end of the week running the various indoor/outdoor simulators.
Instructors were all "seasoned" LEOs and came across as humble, credible and approachable.
You won't hear words like dynamic, in-extremis, exigent, proprioceptive or disruptive and find them doing flashy posts on Instagram.
Enjoy the Gunsite experience! It is truly Americana.
I hope this helps!
I was lucky enough to have as 260 instructors Louis Awerbuck, Randy Cain and Steve Slawson. Hans Vang, Irv Stone, Wayne Novak and Gary Paul Johnson were fellow students in the class.
As pointed out, Gunsite models the class in part on its rifle offerings, hence the slugs. However, I think the geography of the west, with its wide open spaces favors the reach out of a slug. For my use, outside defensive shotguns are loaded with all slugs, with the option of selecting a shot load, rather than vice versa. Louis Awerbuck, as an example, carried his personal 14 inch 1100 shotgun loaded with all slugs.
Taking that class today, I would want a red dot. When I took the class a decade ago, it was with a pair of 11-87 shotguns, one with iron sights and the other with an Aimpoint.
Likes pretty much everything in every caliber.
Many thanks for the great answers everyone!
On the topic of cost, I do see that the class is a 3 day class for $1250, so yeah it is not exactly economical. I think this would be my buddy's first shotgun class I believe. He does live in N. AZ like I do, so at least he wouldn't have to factor in flying costs to Gunsite.
He did mention that he wants to buy a Beretta 1301 mainly for home defense. I'll have to ask him if he realizes that there will be a good deal spent on out door/longer distance slug shooting, and if he's gtg with that.
For the sake of comparative shopping, are there any 2 day Shotgun courses, possibly more cost effective, that y'all can recommend, especially out on in the West, or from a traveling instructor?
I'm thinking were classmates.
There might be a bit of a bias, I'll be working a couple of those shotgun classes this coming year.
Rob Haught of Symtac is usually out in Arizona at least once a year. His class is solid. It doesn't involve anywhere near as much slug work as the Gunsite class, but spends more time on recoil mitigation (crucial with a shotgun) and the kind of close range work you are more likely to do with shotgun.
Training for slugs at distance is fine, but I consider that more where someone who is already pretty good with a gauge at more typical use invests some time and effort to truly master what the gun can do. And frankly, if you can make hits with a rifle offhand and in positions at 100-200 yards, there's extra math involved but the fundamentals of firing the shot are the same.
Of course the real answer is do both if you can. You'll get a ton out of 5 days total training on the gauge.
If you have to pick one, go with Symtac.
3/15/2016
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