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Thread: 507K ACSS

  1. #21
    Member Wake27's Avatar
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    507K ACSS

    Quote Originally Posted by G19Fan View Post
    It is so interesting to me how eyes work. This was shot using a 2 moa (my preferred) @ 25 untimed offhand

    https://imgur.io/a/s8kqvbv

    I am way worse with the chevron despite in theory the tip should be more precise vs a 2 moa dot. A lot of my friends love the chevron

    Gun is zeroed with 124 hst shot using 115 tula steel
    Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
    The nice thing about the chevron at distance is when it’s a small target, you don’t blot out the target with the reticle. That’s less likely to happen with a small MOA dot but then you lose the benefits of a larger reticle up close.
    For me, even at close distances, I tend to hit low on SAF because I put the dot under my desired POA so I can see what I actually want to aim at. Its not a noticeable problem for me when shooting faster tempo but if I’m really trying to be deliberate and precise, I hold low. I’ve realized it for a while and when I force myself to, I train to raise the gun up and then pull the trigger. This works but it’s basically correcting a bad habit so it takes a lot of repeated effort and my gun time has been lacking for years now so I’m definitely not there yet.

    I don’t have this issue with the chevron, I put the tip where I want the round to go whether it’s SAF or a mag dump and it just works for me. Training scar, bad habit, subconscious aiming fault, whatever we want to call it - the chevron is legitimately hardware fixing my software and while I may not be addressing the underlying problem, it seems to work pretty well for me.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

  2. #22
    Quote Originally Posted by Wake27 View Post
    For me, even at close distances, I tend to hit low on SAF because I put the dot under my desired POA so I can see what I actually want to aim at. Its not a noticeable problem for me when shooting faster tempo but if I’m really trying to be deliberate and precise, I hold low. I’ve realized it for a while and when I force myself to, I train to raise the gun up and then pull the trigger. This works but it’s basically correcting a bad habit so it takes a lot of repeated effort and my gun time has been lacking for years now so I’m definitely not there yet.

    I don’t have this issue with the chevron, I put the tip where I want the round to go whether it’s SAF or a mag dump and it just works for me. Training scar, bad habit, subconscious aiming fault, whatever we want to call it - the chevron is legitimately hardware fixing my software and while I may not be addressing the underlying problem, it seems to work pretty well for me.


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
    This explanation makes a lot of sense. I am almost the opposite I feel. I try to make the chevron too precise and end up overhanging it (def also a software issue)

    With a 2 moa or 3 moa dot I know my wobble zone

  3. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by G19Fan View Post
    This explanation makes a lot of sense. I am almost the opposite I feel. I try to make the chevron too precise and end up overhanging it (def also a software issue)

    With a 2 moa or 3 moa dot I know my wobble zone
    With round targets a circle dot also has an auto ranging wobble function too.

    With a 6MOA dot it fills USPSA and steel challenge steel and round targets well with 4 MOA of extra safety in calling the shots.

    With a 2 MOA dot, it’s easier to call a bad shot good at speed if that makes sense.

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
    With round targets a circle dot also has an auto ranging wobble function too.

    With a 6MOA dot it fills USPSA and steel challenge steel and round targets well with 4 MOA of extra safety in calling the shots.

    With a 2 MOA dot, it’s easier to call a bad shot good at speed if that makes sense.
    Yes this make sense on bad shot good at speed

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by G19Fan View Post
    Yes this make sense on bad shot good at speed
    Here’s a graphic I made with my daughter’s colored pencils haha

    Name:  0C415E80-E356-416A-857A-775EFB4FE141.jpg
Views: 206
Size:  25.3 KB

    I can run the edge of a 6MOA dot to a target edge and still have 4 MOA margin of safety.

    But if run the edge of a 2MOA dot to a target edge the margin gets pretty small and at speed that can lead to optimistic over calls.

  6. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
    Here’s a graphic I made with my daughter’s colored pencils haha

    Name:  0C415E80-E356-416A-857A-775EFB4FE141.jpg
Views: 206
Size:  25.3 KB

    I can run the edge of a 6MOA dot to a target edge and still have 4 MOA margin of safety.

    But if run the edge of a 2MOA dot to a target edge the margin gets pretty small and at speed that can lead to optimistic over calls.
    This makes a surprising amount of sense

    Stuoid question. I zero offhand at 25. When you zero 6 moa do you use top of dot or center?

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by G19Fan View Post
    This makes a surprising amount of sense

    Stuoid question. I zero offhand at 25. When you zero 6 moa do you use top of dot or center?
    You know I try and put some practical thought into equipment and decisions. It mainly comes from trying a bunch of shit and noticing that some stuff doesn’t work as well for me and then figuring out why that was the case.

    This revelation came about with the huge DPP triangle that I was soooo slow with. Because I was trying to hold the whole fucking triangle inside small targets and it caused me to overconfirm. I don’t need that many MOA of margin hahaha. Then I tried the opposite with a tiny dot and was calling bad shots good.

    The ACSS chevron is better than the DPP triangle for me because I can see the target through the chevron and not so much through the DPP.

    For the zero, I think the official stance is that anything is fine. Lots of different acceptable ways to do it.

    For me, I get a little nerdy with it.

    My answer for myself is:
    Depends on what game.
    For black B8s at 25 yards, I zero for dead center of the red dot at 25 yards.

    For USPSA gaming, it’ll depend on my ammo. I want something fairly flat-ish out to 50 yards. With 150gr Syntech out of a 5” barrel at 850 fps or so, I’ll usually put POI just above the rim of a 6 MOA dot so I can see the target.

    That usually puts it dead on for what I need 10-15 yards where a lot of the partials live on course.

    7 yards and in it’ll be around bottom edge of dot or just under.




    So the long answer is that it doesn’t really matter, but it depends on what game I’m maximizing. That’s one of the reasons I think scoring on B8 is a little silly.

    I’d rather just judge group size rather than scoring. Because the scoring is dependent on things that are B8 specific like contrast of sights, ammo POI, red dot size, etc.

    But the game is the game.

  8. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
    You know I try and put some practical thought into equipment and decisions. It mainly comes from trying a bunch of shit and noticing that some stuff doesn’t work as well for me and then figuring out why that was the case.

    This revelation came about with the huge DPP triangle that I was soooo slow with. Because I was trying to hold the whole fucking triangle inside small targets and it caused me to overconfirm. I don’t need that many MOA of margin hahaha. Then I tried the opposite with a tiny dot and was calling bad shots good.

    The ACSS chevron is better than the DPP triangle for me because I can see the target through the chevron and not so much through the DPP.

    For the zero, I think the official stance is that anything is fine. Lots of different acceptable ways to do it.

    For me, I get a little nerdy with it.

    My answer for myself is:
    Depends on what game.
    For black B8s at 25 yards, I zero for dead center of the red dot at 25 yards.

    For USPSA gaming, it’ll depend on my ammo. I want something fairly flat-ish out to 50 yards. With 150gr Syntech out of a 5” barrel at 850 fps or so, I’ll usually put POI just above the rim of a 6 MOA dot so I can see the target.

    That usually puts it dead on for what I need 10-15 yards where a lot of the partials live on course.

    7 yards and in it’ll be around bottom edge of dot or just under.




    So the long answer is that it doesn’t really matter, but it depends on what game I’m maximizing. That’s one of the reasons I think scoring on B8 is a little silly.

    I’d rather just judge group size rather than scoring. Because the scoring is dependent on things that are B8 specific like contrast of sights, ammo POI, red dot size, etc.

    But the game is the game.
    I dig it.

    I should try the giant circle and dot vs 2 moa dot at speed

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by G19Fan View Post
    I dig it.

    I should try the giant circle and dot vs 2 moa dot at speed
    The 32 MOA 507c circle dot is awesome for super fast work close up.

    Just note when you try it, you have to play around with the target size and distance and the speed has to be super speed.

  10. #30
    Quote Originally Posted by JCN View Post
    The 32 MOA 507c circle dot is awesome for super fast work close up.

    Just note when you try it, you have to play around with the target size and distance and the speed has to be super speed.

    Makes sense and thanks!

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