Well then what fun would that be carrying a pistol around all day.Originally Posted by Bucky
TXPO
Well then what fun would that be carrying a pistol around all day.
TXPO
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I have to disagree with this somewhat. Mainly with the P320. The distance required for the trigger shoe to travel and fire on the P320 is very short and made shorter with some aftermarket triggers. Plus there is no trigger shoe saftey. i think there is a much higher risk of foreign object setting off a P320 trigger than a Glock, M&P, CZ P10, Walther and so on. I think a manual safety is a very good idea on the P320 due to this.
Post June 2019 manufacture - yes.You are someone whose opinion I highly respect. Would you feel comfortable carrying/competing with a (commercial) M18, for example? Just looking for re-assurance here I think. My main concern is the “I didn’t touch the gun” or the “I lightly tapped the rear of the slide” type AD as discussed ITT.
I currently have several commercial 320s the one remaining pre 2019 gun is essentially a dedicated dry fire gun.
if doing high volume dryfire include those reps in your spring replacement schedule.
Part Replacement Schedule, Operator Performed:
Recoil Spring:
(a) Full Size: 10,000 rounds fired.
(b) Compact: 5,000 rounds fired.
(c) Sub-Compact: 5,000 rounds fired.
Magazine Spring: When the magazine fails to lock the slide open.
Barrel: If the pistol exhibits key-holing or unacceptable accuracy.
Parts Replacement Schedule, Armorer Performed:
Extractor Spring: 20,000 rounds fired.
Extractor: 20,000 rounds fired.
Striker Assembly: 20,000 rounds fired.
Takedown lever: 20,000 rounds fired.
Slide Catch Lever: 10,000 rounds fired.
Slide Catch Lever Spring: 10,000 rounds fired.
Slide Catch Lever Post: 10,000 rounds fired.
Trigger Bar Spring: 10,000 rounds fired.
Here is an article that I found interesting.
https://www.wisn.com/article/mpd-gun...onths/38097781
The tab safety on the trigger you reference is an inertia drop safety. It is not there for foreign objects. Whether on pistols or newer hunting rifles, the tab safety is to physically block the trigger from moving via inertia if the gun is dropped or otherwise impacted. The 320 doesn’t have one because the trigger bar of the 320 moves in the opposite direction of most striker guns so a tab safety on the trigger would not actually do anything on a 320.
A manual safety would be the answer to foreign object concerns on the 320.
There have been multiple examples of Glocks being fired in the holster due to foreign objects getting into the trigger guard, particularly with wide mouth duty holsters made to accommodate weapons mounted lights.
In particular one Glock in holster shot involved an elementary school student sticking their finger into the trigger guard of a holstered WML equipped Glock while the officer was reading to the kids via a DARE type program.
If you look in the LE UOF thread here there is a video of a disorderly suspect being restrained at a stadium who gets his finger into the holster of an officers holstered WML equipment Glock.
The Streamlight TLR 9 which uses inline batteries to allow smaller holster mouths rather than the side by side batteries which necessitate wide holster mouths was a direct response to these issues.
Of course.
But multiple fully tensioned striker guns (early P320, VP9, PPQ, FN FMS) have had potential impact issues and those issues can be replicated.
The “virgin” ADs where holstered guns allegedly spontaneously discharge in the holster without any stimuli cannot be replicated.
320 is as flawed design. There have been multiple unintended, accidental (ie. not negligent) discharges of these pistols without manipulation of the trigger, including post 2019 variants--primarily with impacts of the holster against a hard objects (ex. vehicles, building structure, furniture, ground, etc...). There are better service weapon choices available.
Facts matter...Feelings Can Lie
I’d like to see documented examples of post 2019 320 no manipulation discharges. The Canadian SOF one was ultimately disproven.
While there are real issues with pre 2019 guns, including those which went thorough SIG’s “upgrade.” There is a lot of apocryphal BS and false claims around the 320. For example - there are numerous lawsuits which are simply “copy and paste” of the July 2020 NH lawsuit. In addition to the July 2020, New Hampshire lawsuit being dismissed, the filing listed multiple instances of 320s going off, some of which were actual uncommanded discharges but most of which were operator error negligent discharges in which the trigger was pulled.
Every no manipulation on commanded discharge which I have been able to validate has involved a pre-2019 gun wether in original form or upgraded form.
Going back to the frequently, copied 2020, New Hampshire lawsuit list, two of the examples in that list, which the plaintiff alleged were uncommanded, no manipulation discharges involved members of my agency. Both of those instances were operator, induced negligent, discharges, where the trigger was pulled. In one instance, the operator acknowledged pulling the trigger in the other. The operator filed his own walk again today, despite the fact that he was witnessed pulling the trigger and examination of the gun, both by SIG and our agency revealed zero defects with the gun.
If I were king for a day, I would issue generation five Glocks with striker control devices, direct miles for Aimpoint P-2 ACROs. But that doesn’t mean there is not a tremendous amount of false information surrounding the current, post June 2019 iteration of P320.
Agreed, lots of folks are saying the design is flawed, yet no one can present any definitive proof of said flaws. As you stated it is typically regurgitated from some other posting or article, again where no definitive proof is provided. The drop fire issue was real and was able to be replicated and proven without a doubt.
TXPO
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