General (and some specific) Defensive Shotgun Questions

[SwampDweller]

I've been into black polymer semi auto pistols (HK, Glock, etc), AKs, and ARs, but recently I've begun rethinking my defensive and overall firearms needs. Something about revolvers and pump action shotguns has always appealed to me, and I am exploring the viability/practicality of them as primary defensive tools. I've been out of the shotgun game for a while, and when I was in it, it was primarily for duck/dove hunting as well as skeet shooting. In trying to dip my toes back in the water on this subject, I had the following questions regarding selecting a home defense shotgun:

-With pistols, the general rule of thumb (according to Todd, DocGKR, and others) seems to be 1k rounds of stoppage-free shots before trusting to carry/use for defense. What number is this for shotguns? Specifically pumps like the Mossberg 590A1, but also for the Benelli M4.

-How do modern Mossberg 590A1s hold up to hard use? I experienced quite a bit of grief years ago from Remington after their QC took a nosedive following the buyout, and it seems like many manufacturers since 2020 have experienced a decline in that way. For that matter, what qualifies as "hard use" with a pump shotgun? How many rounds do shotgun classes usually go through per student?

-I grew up using shotguns (mostly 870s) hunting, but I do remember experiencing short stroking a few times during high-speed events like doves flashing by. It's often made me avoid thinking of pump shotguns in a defensive role. After all, if I mess up pumping it when I'm hunting and having fun, who's to say I wouldn't during a life or death situation? Is this something that should rule out the shotgun for me?

-I'm leaning towards a pump, but the Benelli M4 is the only semi auto on my radar. While there are many singing its praises for reliability on the internet, I have seen the opposite reported, here among other places. Spending $2k on a shotgun only to be finicky would probably make my head explode, so I'd rather make a pump work if I'm overblowing the short stroking concern. Maybe training could get me past it.

Thank you, I'm basically at newbie status in the subject matter of shotguns for serious use.

[03RN]

If you locktight the ejector of the Mossberg and it goes 100rounda without an issue than I'd trust it as much as any other gun out there. Same with any gun honestly. Give me a glock19 or a Springfield milspec and I'd figure it will go and go and go.

Mossbergs are about as rugged as you'll find. I taught shotguns to some Philippinos that has 20 year old m500s that were held together with bailing wire(the wood at least). I lock tighted all the ejectors the night before and there were only a few guns that died due to springs in the trigger group rusting through.

Short stroking is a thing. Train more and it's less of a thing but still possible.

While I prefer the Benelli it's more due to nostalgia over the Beretta. If you're not hung up on the Benelli then get the 1301.

[Lon]

There’s a 600+ page thread on the Beretta 1301 you should read before spending $$ on an M4. Lots of good info in that thread.

[SwampDweller]

If you locktight the ejector of the Mossberg and it goes 100rounda without an issue than I'd trust it as much as any other gun out there. Same with any gun honestly. Give me a glock19 or a Springfield milspec and I'd figure it will go and go and go.

Mossbergs are about as rugged as you'll find. I taught shotguns to some Philippinos that has 20 year old m500s that were held together with bailing wire(the wood at least). I lock tighted all the ejectors the night before and there were only a few guns that died due to springs in the trigger group rusting through.

Short stroking is a thing. Train more and it's less of a thing but still possible.

While I prefer the Benelli it's more due to nostalgia over the Beretta. If you're not hung up on the Benelli then get the 1301.

Yeah, I imagine short stroking is always a potential thing no matter how well trained one is. But how big of a deal is it, is it a "you'll get killt in the streetz" thing to where it would be better to go with a semi auto?

I've wanted a Benelli M4 since I was a kid, but my brain also tells me that would be the most fool-proof option since it went through insanely rigorous testing, had a very high Mean Rounds Between Stoppages, and perhaps most impressively, seems to be able to live through Marine Corps service! I'm not aware of rigorous government testing on the 1301, but I am open to the idea of one.

[SwampDweller]

There’s a 600+ page thread on the Beretta 1301 you should read before spending $$ on an M4. Lots of good info in that thread.

I'll track it down, thanks. Like I said, I'm open to the 1301, but the track record of the M4 is rather impressive, including serving very reliably at the Battlefield Vegas indoor machinegun rental range. I liked that I could track down MRBS figures and gov't testing data for the M4, I haven't been able to find anything on the 1301. I do have my dad's Beretta Silver Mallard that has served well, but I don't know how much that has in common mechanically with the 1301. I have noticed that the 1301 seems to be the majority favorite here, which speaks well for it.

[Default.mp3]

Why would you go for a shotgun over a rifle for defensive purposes?

[SwampDweller]

Why would you go for a shotgun over a rifle for defensive purposes?

I just kinda like em and like having more than one tool in the toolbox. No doubt it's an effective means for home defense. Can be loaded up with buckshot for close encounters, and if needed could stretch out to a hundred yards or so with a good slug, which is farther than line of sight around here. Could also be useful for hunting, especially if I can swap barrels as is possible in most of the pumps I'm looking at.

I also feel like they-- particularly pump actions but also some semi autos-- are less susceptible to political shenanigans as the future of our 2A rights becomes bleaker and bleaker.

In any case, at the moment I do have a 5.56 carbine set up as a home defense long gun loaded with good expanding ammunition.

[medmo]

Why would you go for a shotgun over a rifle for defensive purposes?

You actually went there? Going to get comfy, change into sweat pants, and get the popcorn ready.....

[Default.mp3]

You actually went there? Going to get comfy, change into sweat pants, and get the popcorn ready.....

Get comfy for what? The reasons aren't that complicated, AFAIK. I was simply curious as to why someone would want to put extra effort into learning the shotgun when they already have rifles, particularly something that takes as much effort to master as the pump shotgun, or to spend a bunch of money on a semi-auto shotgun (and still have a decent learning curve). For me, I would never swap out the rifle for a shotgun with my current lifestyle, but I certainly do want to learn to master the pump shotgun, similarly for political reasons.

[03RN]

Get comfy for what? The reasons aren't that complicated, AFAIK. I was simply curious as to why someone would want to put extra effort into learning the shotgun when they already have rifles, particularly something that takes as much effort to master as the pump shotgun, or to spend a bunch of money on a semi-auto shotgun (and still have a decent learning curve). For me, I would never swap out the rifle for a shotgun with my current lifestyle, but I certainly do want to learn to master the pump shotgun, similarly for political reasons.

Shotguns aren't that difficult to master and the capacity of rifles is kinda not that important in CONUS. So why not use the more effective tool?