Glock 47 MOS

[JCN]

ETA: found this. https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....with-a-red-dot

That supports what I was saying.

GJM objectively shot better with a G34 than a G45.

The guys talking about “see sawing” aren’t talking about a dot specific phenomenon.

And it’s absolutely a recoil spring to ammo mismatch where the nose dives past zero and you get that oscillation.

Here is my wife shooting a gun that’s oversprung for ammo / compensator.

Note the see saw of the muzzle.



I noticed that on slow motion so I reduced the recoil spring weight and this is what it looked like after.

No more see saw.



Put it back in her hands and 98 points on The Test.



Look at the muzzle in slow motion.

No see saw.

A long slide when oversprung has mass that snaps shut and can throw the nose under zero point. But with proper tuning, it dwells softly at zero making it very much easier to track and time the trigger.

[Kyle Reese]

Been shooting mine since January 2021. Took it to Rogers Shooting School and scored an Advanced rating with it. Nice enough pistol and I am glad that it’s going to be commercially available.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[TheNewbie]

If I live to be 120, Glock will finally release pistols with the best manual safety yet devised. Wish they would put out something more interesting.



For those who want this, I am glad it is being released. It was not made for someone like me, but there are lots of people who will buy this. Look forward to the range reports.

[HCM]

That supports what I was saying.

GJM objectively shot better with a G34 than a G45.

The guys talking about “see sawing” aren’t talking about a dot specific phenomenon.

And it’s absolutely a recoil spring to ammo mismatch where the nose dives past zero and you get that oscillation.

Here is my wife shooting a gun that’s oversprung for ammo / compensator.

Note the see saw of the muzzle.



I noticed that on slow motion so I reduced the recoil spring weight and this is what it looked like after.

No more see saw.



Put it back in her hands and 98 points on The Test.



Look at the muzzle in slow motion.

No see saw.

A long slide when oversprung has mass that snaps shut and can throw the nose under zero point. But with proper tuning, it dwells softly at zero making it very much easier to track and time the trigger.

That’s great if you can tune the gun.

Institutional users normally can’t do so.

Hence things like the G45 and G47, SIG Carry models etc.

[JCN]

That’s great if you can tune the gun.

Institutional users normally can’t do so.

Hence things like the G45 and G47, SIG Carry models etc.

Oh I agree with you.

I was just explaining that it was more a mismatch issue than a slide weight issue.

I find that stock Glock recoil springs work very well with duty and +P ammo so at least that part jives.

A lot of “common Joes” buy guns meant for full power ammo and then shoot wimpy ass target ammo out of it and wonder why it’s mismatched.

[El Cid]

That supports what I was saying.

GJM objectively shot better with a G34 than a G45.

//SNIP//

A long slide when oversprung has mass that snaps shut and can throw the nose under zero point. But with proper tuning, it dwells softly at zero making it very much easier to track and time the trigger.

I was starting to think I was fucked up like a football bat. Lol! Found the thread. And I freely admit it may be more of a user preference thing.

Original comment from Doc
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....KM-compensator

Comment from JSOC member.
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post319411

[JCN]

Original comment from Doc
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....KM-compensator

Comment from JSOC member.
https://pistol-forum.com/showthread....l=1#post319411

I think it’s interesting that the JSOC member brought up the triple nickel as a test.

When you add draws and reloads, those gun handling non-shooting parts are absolutely in favor of shorter slides.

So maybe that’s part of the mixed message? People talking about how a gun shoots better but they’re talking about gun handling parts?

Triple nickel is pretty straightforward with even a short gun like a P365.



But absolutely it’s easier for me with something G19 size than a P365.

I’d pick a G19 over a G34 for a drill like that… because you live and die on the draw and reload on that drill.

Like when I went for the Vice Card Challenge (<1.38s Mozambique from surrender concealment) I picked a G19 instead of a G34 because of the ease of draw dwarfed the shooting benefit from the longer slide.

If that makes sense.

Single shots without recoil control requirements: slide length doesn’t matter.
Doubles: slide speed matters for recoil dot tracking
Draws and reloads: shorter slide clears kydex faster and easier to flip gun in hand with less muzzle weight.

I prefer a shorter gun. But a longer gun shoots better and tracks softer when shooting.

[spyderco monkey]

The benefits of a longer or shorter slide for recoil control and sight tracking are subjective and vary from person to person.

It is objectively the case that a longer barrel gives more velocity which means a greater likelihood of the ammunition expanding as its designed, especially at extended distances, as well as decreased muzzle blast.
.

When it comes to effective range (ie distance to minimum expansion velocity) its surprising how much even a small increase in velocity will have with effective range.

124gr XTP 0.165 G1 BC; minimum reliable expansion velocity 1050fps, 1100fps desirable, 1150fps optimal

G19 Velocity = 1175fps
G17 Velocity = 1200fps (+25fps)

https://bergerbullets.com/ballistics-calculator/

-->

G19 @ 1175fps = 1150fps @ 10yd; 1100fps @ 34yd; 1050fps @ 63yd
G17 @ 1200fps = 1150fps @ 20yd; 1100fps @ 44yd; 1050fps @ 73yd

So +25fps is actually a +10yd effective range advantage. And it ensures hitting at a solid 1150fps out to 20yd instead of 10yd.

This isn't a game changing advantage, but it's also not one I'd willingly trade away if I could avoid it.

Thats why seeing dudes with G45's with X300's makes me go Hmmmm - they've got a G19 slide / ballistics with a gun thats now G34 length due to the WML...

[hiro]

Do you have the numbers with a round on Doc's list?

While I understand your point, XTP is an older design.

When it comes to effective range (ie distance to minimum expansion velocity) its surprising how much even a small increase in velocity will have with effective range.

124gr XTP 0.165 G1 BC; minimum reliable expansion velocity 1050fps, 1100fps desirable, 1150fps optimal

G19 Velocity = 1175fps
G17 Velocity = 1200fps (+25fps)

https://bergerbullets.com/ballistics-calculator/

-->

G19 @ 1175fps = 1150fps @ 10yd; 1100fps @ 34yd; 1050fps @ 63yd
G17 @ 1200fps = 1150fps @ 20yd; 1100fps @ 44yd; 1050fps @ 73yd

So +25fps is actually a +10yd effective range advantage. And it ensures hitting at a solid 1150fps out to 20yd instead of 10yd.

This isn't a game changing advantage, but it's also not one I'd willingly trade away if I could avoid it.

Thats why seeing dudes with G45's with X300's makes me go Hmmmm - they've got a G19 slide / ballistics with a gun thats now G34 length due to the WML...

[spyderco monkey]

Do you have the numbers with a round on Doc's list?

While I understand your point, XTP is an older design.

I used the XTP because Hornady lists the G1 BC for that projectile, and through combing the internet for gel tests I've been able to find low velocity gel tests (at 1050fps we see threshold expansion/failure occur) for the XTP.

The minimum velocity looks pretty close to 1050fps for the Gold Dot; out of the 3" we're seeing some failures to expand at 1038fps, while some expand at same velocity. I'd say none of us would really want to count on this at under 1050fps based on this test. At the 3" velocity zone 2/5 of the tested rounds failed to expand and exited the double block of gel. I just dont have the G1 BC for the Gold Dot; its probably pretty close to the XTP.



What would be ideal would be to have someone establish minimum expansion velocities for various SD loads using reduced power handloads, then with a Lab Radar actually long range chrono various defense factory loads to see how they match up to projected BC's.

For on paper internet foruming, the XTP data is the best I can do.


....

edit found 124gr Gold Dot listed @ 0.134 G1 BC, a lower BC then the XTP.

G19 @ 1175fps = 1150fps @ 8yd; 1100fps @ 28yd; 1050fps @ 51yd
G17 @ 1200fps = 1150fps @ 16yd; 1100fps @ 36yd; 1050fps @ 59yd

Less of a difference then the XTP as the G1 is lower for the Gold Dot, but once again we see +25fps doubling the optimal 1150fps impact velocity range.

Not a huge difference, but also not something I'd give away without a good reason.