Pocket Handgun: Small 9mm Auto or 642 Airweight?

[Rex G]

The spurless and concealed-hammer snub-guns are not, as I see them, “back-up” guns, but, simply the best, in their own class of weapon. Really, any gun can, in the manner of its use, be a “back-up gun.” And, during that decisive moment, when the snag-free, slick snub-gun, is best-suited, it is very much the “primary” weapon.

[TheNewbie]

2 P3ATs and a P32 I forgot. The P-32 was a good deal better than the .380s, although it did actually break(used gun, unknown wear). I only fired ball and it was much easier on my hand.

The P32 I have is a used Gen 1. It actually shoots well for basically having no sights, and they seem to be reliable. I wouldn’t put a ton of faith in it to hold up to 2000 rounds, but for the purpose I use it for, it works.


My Gen 1 LCP was reliable for over a decade and a few hundred rounds, but eventually broke.


I really wish the P232 was reliable. My two examples were not.

[titsonritz]

Totally disagree because the context of many women's carry gun is to literally peel a cretin off of them and entangled fights are probably more common for them than for mano a mano. A 5, 7, or 8 shot snub is just too easy to always have, always employ cleanly and center hit a target out to 5 yards. I've yet to find the less than hobbiest enthusiast female who wanted to be armed that gave a single F'k about stopping a food court shooter at 25 plus yards.

re caliber Claude, DB, D-Con training have all made the case for sub caliber snubbies better than I can. Those are a way, not the only way.

Only 1 out of 5 non-hobbyist females I've seen couldn't work a J frame very well in that context. The one outlier went to somewhere else and chose a .32 Keltec that was sort of reliable most of the time. Great.

Thanks for the thoughtful rebuttal and it sounds great on paper but what I'm seeing is the majority of women that shoot snubbies hurt their hands and they end up hating them. Here are several link to articles written by women shooters/trainers and what they are seeing with the ladies, most do not even mention J-frames or any revolver and if the do they are way down on the list with caveats such as...

The Smith & Wesson 642 is one of those models that you either love or hate. Some people find it uncomfortable to shoot, while others, like me, think it fits the hand pretty darn well.

Carrie Lightfoot of The Well Armed Woman said this about revolvers...

Once again there were no revolvers in the top 10 guns for women and in fact, a revolver didn’t show up on the list until the #17 spot. This data truly dispels the myth that women “need” or “should” have a revolver. Of course, revolvers are an excellent choice for many women, so don’t misunderstand or misinterpret this data to believe revolvers are not valued or don’t have a place with the woman shooter. In fact, if I look at the total number of revolvers purchased (Not by brand) they would have been equivalent in number to the 5thplace spot on the list. Revolvers are best for use in a concealed carry purse and for many with weak hands unable to rack a slide on a semi-automatic pistol, they are a godsend.

The Top 10 Most Popular Guns For Women – 2018
Most Popular Guns For Women – 2019
The Well Armed Woman's Top 10 Guns of 2020
Most Popular Handguns and Gear for Women in 2021
10 Best Handguns for Women [All Sizes & Calibers]

Don't get me wrong, I agree with your premise and while certainly capable most women don't want to deal the pain in the their hand. Mostly when I see a gal go towards and end up liking a revolver it is a K or L frame sized gun.

[Detmongo]

I have 2 micro nines and one 642. The 642 is my drop in the pocket gun more often than not. The revolvers lend them selves to easier pocket draw than the micro nines. Mind you all of them if pocket carried are always in a pocket holster.

[Joe in PNG]

I'd like to go back to a J Frame S&W for the occasional pocket tote, but...
-I'd want something from back when S&W knew how to make revolvers
-And didn't have the Hillary Lock
-I would want something with better sights, especially now that my eyes aren't as good
-I would need a constant source of good wadcutters, for both carry and practice

The temptation is to find another old Model 36, bob the hammer, add some rubber boot grips, and one of those glue on XS front sight.

[BillSWPA]

Totally disagree because the context of many women's carry gun is to literally peel a cretin off of them and entangled fights are probably more common for them than for mano a mano. A 5, 7, or 8 shot snub is just too easy to always have, always employ cleanly and center hit a target out to 5 yards. I've yet to find the less than hobbiest enthusiast female who wanted to be armed that gave a single F'k about stopping a food court shooter at 25 plus yards.

re caliber Claude, DB, D-Con training have all made the case for sub caliber snubbies better than I can. Those are a way, not the only way.

Only 1 out of 5 non-hobbyist females I've seen couldn't work a J frame very well in that context. The one outlier went to somewhere else and chose a .32 Keltec that was sort of reliable most of the time. Great.

The biggest mistake by far that I made when teaching my wife to shoot was letting her try a lightweight J frame. Even with only standard pressure practice ammo, it took me years to correct her resulting flinch.


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[Thy.Will.Be.Done]

Short answer to be followed up on;

Nothing has drawn as clean from a pocket for me as a internal hammer snub such as the 642 or LCR.

Most of the small semi autos I've tried were nowhere near as reliable as my snubs. I am not the only person to observe this.

One reason many people don't is that they do not commonly draw their carry gun and shoot it in the manner that they were carrying it, ie without unloading the carry ammo and reloading the gun with ball ammo. Fired as they have been carried I note many semi autos have a "one round and a stovepipe" habit.

That's an interesting note on the stovepipe, what do you feel may cause this? I'd wager that cotton lint mixed with petroluem lube would do well to slow things down just enough to stop it once before it gets forced out of the way.

[SwampDweller]

Short answer to be followed up on;

Nothing has drawn as clean from a pocket for me as a internal hammer snub such as the 642 or LCR.

Most of the small semi autos I've tried were nowhere near as reliable as my snubs. I am not the only person to observe this.

One reason many people don't is that they do not commonly draw their carry gun and shoot it in the manner that they were carrying it, ie without unloading the carry ammo and reloading the gun with ball ammo. Fired as they have been carried I note many semi autos have a "one round and a stovepipe" habit.

It is Mr. Haggard's insight as well as many others that I'm convinced that a snub like a 642 no-lock or LCR is the way to go, for all the reasons listed. I suppose that defeats the purpose of this being in the semi auto forum, but that seems to be the conclusion I'm arriving to. I too have seen more than a few malfunctions on the range of people drawing their pocket micro pistol and subsequently having a stoppage of some kind, many times due to compromised grip. Not really a worry with a grip the size of a G19 and up, but just trying a few pocket autos at work today, I can tell it would be extremely easy to either get a compromised grip resulting in a stoppage, or the back of the auto getting caught in the pocket (which, if a finger slipped into the pocket holster and started yanking, bad things could happen), or dropping the magazine.

I've been listening to the P&S "Snubbies" podcast today, and it is a goldmine of information.

[Trstn]

The biggest mistake by far that I made when teaching my wife to shoot was letting her try a lightweight J frame. Even with only standard pressure practice ammo, it took me years to correct her resulting flinch.


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22lr revolver is the correct answer. 8 rounds of federal punch 22lr all day over any 38 or larger round in a snub.

[Screwball]

Best of both worlds…



I converted my 642-1 to 9mm. Also had it redone in NP3+. Still my off duty everything gun. Actually had it in my cargo pocket today, as I cut the grass.

J-frames take dedication. I’ve said it elsewhere, but unless you are willing to put in the time to practice, just go with a pocket 9mm. Easier to shoot.

When I converted mine, I was at the range practicing from not shooting it for three months (work being done). Had a RSO come by and tell me he will show me how to shoot. I had plenty of trigger time on the revolver prior to converting it, so I let him talk. He shot a group at 15 yards that three shots hit the paper… making like a 7” group. I put all 5 in a little over 2” group. Maybe had 25 rounds thru it after getting it back.