Pistol Brace Amnesty

[WobblyPossum]

Just nullifying the approved amnesty Form 1s would also create a bunch of actual criminals. I’m betting the vast majority of people who get Form 1s approved quickly replace the brace with a real stock since the gun is now a registered SBR and braces suck for shooting. You nullify those Form 1s and now those people ACTUALLY have unregistered SBRs. They’d be creating the very problem they claimed the rule was meant to address.

[HCM]

It’s an approved NFA item… stamp or not, it’s on the registry as a SBR. For them to say, “hey, those braced SBRs are now pistols again,”would be making the entire mess even worse for them. Mainly, ATF stated that once approved… stocks can be installed. After the approvals, all of my braces were pulled and stocks were added. I doubt they are going to say, “all approvals are void.” Too much paper trail to go against that. I also can’t see them asking for people to pay $200/engrave after the fact, for the same reason… remember, other than the rule annotations, they also published the rule in the Federal Registry. Can’t really put that genie back in the bottle.

For the annotation being on the Form 1s, need to remember that $200 was not paid and the receiver did not need to be engraved. Citing the rule shows that firearm falls into that category.

The annotation says it was approved per the brace rule. If the Brace rule goes away…. The underlying authority goes away.

ATF doesn’t have the authority to waive a tax either. That didn’t stop them from using some dubious loophole to defer the tax.

The whole thing is a house of cards.

[Screwball]

The annotation says it was approved per the brace rule. If the Brace rule goes away…. The underlying authority goes away.

ATF doesn’t have the authority to waive a tax either. That didn’t stop them from using some dubious loophole to defer the tax.

The whole thing is a house of cards.

The rule isn’t what approves the braced pistols as SBRs… the NFA does that.

All the rule is saying is that brace equates to stock, that the tax is waived for the firearms in question and no need to engrave the receiver. Rule goes away, NFA is still there.

If you look on the Form 1, it lists 26 USC §7801 and §7805. §7801 gives ATF officers the same umbrella term of “internal revenue officer.” §7805 is a little more grey, but it seems to attempt to justify the rule, itself.

I’m in DHS, so I have zero knowledge on what Treasury can/can’t do under their duties. But as CBP officers, we do have a degree of discretion built into our jobs. I’m sure IRS, and per the cited law… ATF, has similar discretion in their jobs.

I agree on the house of cards, but unfortunately it is something that will take years for the courts to decide on. But considering all the NFA registration is done, I cannot see any body (courts or Treasury) deciding that a registered SBR will be taken off the registry… especially considering the felony charges that could be created in that event. You’d probably see SBRs removed from the NFA before that.

[HCM]

The rule isn’t what approves the braced pistols as SBRs… the NFA does that.

All the rule is saying is that brace equates to stock, that the tax is waived for the firearms in question and no need to engrave the receiver. Rule goes away, NFA is still there.

If you look on the Form 1, it lists 26 USC §7801 and §7805. §7801 gives ATF officers the same umbrella term of “internal revenue officer.” §7805 is a little more grey, but it seems to attempt to justify the rule, itself.

I’m in DHS, so I have zero knowledge on what Treasury can/can’t do under their duties. But as CBP officers, we do have a degree of discretion built into our jobs. I’m sure IRS, and per the cited law… ATF, has similar discretion in their jobs.

I agree on the house of cards, but unfortunately it is something that will take years for the courts to decide on. But considering all the NFA registration is done, I cannot see any body (courts or Treasury) deciding that a registered SBR will be taken off the registry… especially considering the felony charges that could be created in that event. You’d probably see SBRs removed from the NFA before that.

I’m DHS too but I can read statues. CFRs and case law. Legal reading can be its own rabbit hole but suffice to say it’s a mandatory skill if you don’t want case law named after you.

Re the Brace rule / NFA:

Yes but no.

Read the relevant sections of Title 26 and the CFRs, and read them carefully. ATF is approving the “brace ban” form 1s per the NFA BUT without the required tax being paid. They are annotating the rule on these form 1s for a reason. I’m not 100% on their contingencies but it’s obvious the annotation is their back up plan in the (likely) event the brace rule is invalidated in the courts.

The rule contains the (questionable) authority to “forebear” the required tax, thus the approval is conditional on the rule as published in the federal register being in effect.

To be in full compliance with the NFA the tax would have to be paid or otherwise accounted for. In this case the forbearance provision of the rule is substituting for the tax. If the rule authorizing “forbearance” of the tax is invalidated then either the Form 1 would be invalidated because it was not approved in conformity to NFA requirements or the tax would need to be paid.

[StraitR]

It’s an approved NFA item… stamp or not, it’s on the registry as a SBR. For them to say, “hey, those braced SBRs are now pistols again,”would be making the entire mess even worse for them. Mainly, ATF stated that once approved… stocks can be installed. After the approvals, all of my braces were pulled and stocks were added. I doubt they are going to say, “all approvals are void.” Too much paper trail to go against that. I also can’t see them asking for people to pay $200/engrave after the fact, for the same reason… remember, other than the rule annotations, they also published the rule in the Federal Registry. Can’t really put that genie back in the bottle.

For the annotation being on the Form 1s, need to remember that $200 was not paid and the receiver did not need to be engraved. Citing the rule shows that firearm falls into that category.

Amnesty/forbearance Form 1’s are being “conditionally approved” with the condition listed as “Pursuant to ATF Final Rule 2021R-08F”. If the brace rule goes away, so to does the “condition” for approval. They’re not even putting stamps on the approved forms.

Also note, “Revoked” was added to the status categories in the same eForms website update used to open the brace amnesty/forbearance filing option. My guess on the timing of that is more than coincidence.

IMO, there is little doubt what will happen to these conditionally approved form 1’s should the brace rule be struck down.

[Hambo]

To be in full compliance with the NFA the tax would have to be paid or otherwise accounted for. In this case the forbearance provision of the rule is substituting for the tax. If the rule authorizing “forbearance” of the tax is invalidated then either the Form 1 would be invalidated because it was not approved in conformity to NFA requirements or the tax would need to be paid.

I have no dog in the fight or paperwork in process. I check this thread every now and then because I know people who do.

I looked up a previous amnesty to see how it was done, and it appears that it's the same as the brace amnesty, so their is historic precedent.

https://titleii.com/bardwell/atf_streetsweeper.html

[BillSWPA]

More injunction decisions are expected this week. We will not know until at least tomorrow how the injunctions are limited or the level of clarity of the limits.

[Suvorov]

Amnesty/forbearance Form 1’s are being “conditionally approved” with the condition listed as “Pursuant to ATF Final Rule 2021R-08F”. If the brace rule goes away, so to does the “condition” for approval. They’re not even putting stamps on the approved forms.

Also note, “Revoked” was added to the status categories in the same eForms website update used to open the brace amnesty/forbearance filing option. My guess on the timing of that is more than coincidence.

IMO, there is little doubt what will happen to these conditionally approved form 1’s should the brace rule be struck down.

So I’m wondering what the ATF will do with the serial numbers and owner data if the rule is stuck down and the Form 1 is revoked?

They aren’t supposed to make a registry right? 😂

[DIESEL]

I just got an email that my e form 1 is in draft status and needs to be submitted by tomorrow, I have an email from two months ago that my form was submitted and in process. Is this email a scam? I can’t find a draft anywhere on ATFs site

[flyrodr]

Got that same email. Trying to access ATF page and see if status has changed. Seemingly, site is bogged down.

[Edited to add]: Finally got ATF form to open. My outstanding application is still showing as "SUBMITTED/IN PROCESS". So no idea about email.

I just got an email that my e form 1 is in draft status and needs to be submitted by tomorrow, I have an email from two months ago that my form was submitted and in process. Is this email a scam? I can’t find a draft anywhere on ATFs site