308 vs. 30-06 Cage Match Thread

[okie john]

Curious to see the age distribution of those who chose 30-06 vs 308. Many of the 06’ers mention it’s what they grew up with, Grandad shot with, etc, and there’s absolutely nothing wrong with that.



My father was not into guns at all. Both my Grandads were, but they only shot birds with shotguns so no rifles. Both my uncles did have deer guns, one in NC, one in TX, but they both were big 270 fans.



I like both. Here in Eastern NC, either are more than enough. For our whitetail, 150 lbs is big. I’ve seen a 185lb. I’ve heard several stories of 200lbs, but that’s always someone’s cousin’s, uncle’s, brother’s, former gym partner’s, pool boy’s, gardener’s, ex-wife’s canasta partner. Even our bears are small. Typical hunting for them is treeing them with a dog and then killing it with a handgun (so I’m told, never been on a bear hunt). Most shots are short of 100 yards.



I recently did some factory load testing with my 308 and 30-06. I couldn’t get anything better than a 1.5-2 MOA group with the 308 shooting any of the factory available all-copper bullets. I do get a sub-moa with Federal Berger Hybrid Hunters. On the other hand, the 30-06 loves Lapua all-copper Naturalis load-sub moa. Thus-if I want to shoot a copper bullet, most likely with shoot the 06. If I’m ok with lead, then the 308.



But of course I also love 257 Roberts, 7mm-08, 6.5CM, and…, and…, and……



cc

I'm at six decades and I'm squarely on the fence because I grew up with both in the house. Also, sometimes you have to clean a bore down to bare metal for the all-copper bullets to shoot well.


Okie John

[ccmdfd]

Also, sometimes you have to clean a bore down to bare metal for the all-copper bullets to shoot well.


Okie John

Thanks! Have to give that a try.

[okie john]

For hand loading I prefer the .308 simply because it is a short action. However, every rural gas station I have ever been to in Idaho over the past 17 years has .30-06 factory ammo for sale. I have never not seen it on a shelf in places like Lowell, Stites, Weiser and Blackfoot to name a few. There is a Tikka in .30-06 in the safe for this very reason.

For decades I would have written this same post but listed towns in other states. Then about five years ago I ran into a situation that made me doubt that. I was on the way to a pig hunt when I stopped at the In-and-Out Market in Palo Cedro, CA, to buy a license. I always check ammo in little roadside stores, and this place had easily the weirdest inventory I’ve ever seen in one place, to wit:

1 box of 225 Winchester (never seen this in the wild)
1 box of S&B 5.6x52R (Euro name for the 22 Savage Hi-Power, had to Google it)
6 boxes of fresh Federal 25-06
6-8 boxes of Federal 7x57 Mauser 175 RN
10 boxes of fresh Federal 7mm Winchester Short Magnum
6-8 boxes of fresh Federal 7mm Remington Magnum
6-8 boxes of fresh Federal & Fiocchi 308 Winchester
3 boxes of fresh PPU 303 British
1 box of Hornady 32 Special
2 boxes of Federal 338 Winchester Magnum 250-grain Woodleigh
1 box of 358 Winchester 200-grain PPT
2 boxes of 375 RUM
3 boxes of Hornady 450 Marlin

Here's what that looks like:



They had plenty of service pistol ammo, rimfire, 7.62x39, 5.56 NATO, and assorted 12-gauge but only ONE, count ‘em ONE box of 30-06. To add insult to injury, this box was American Eagle 147-grain FMJ. There was not one softpoint 30-06 cartridge in the place.

My guide later told me that this place used to have an FFL but gave it up after state laws became too onerous, which explains a lot. As noted, some of the ammo was probably NOS, but the rest was fresh so that's probably what the locals use since they're probably either shooting pigs inside of 150 yards or blacktail-mule-deer hybrids at fairly long range, but it was still jarring to see the 30-06 so under-represented.

I'd bet that nearly all of the rural 30-06 ammo supply got scooped up over the last two years. I'm also hearing from friends in the industry that the ammo makers overdid it on 5.56 and 7.62 while leaving 30-06, 7 RM, 300 WM, and several other classics in short supply. That certainly matches up to what I'm seeing locally.


Okie John

[awp_101]

For decades I would have written this same post but listed towns in other states. Then about five years ago I ran into a situation that made me doubt that. I was on the way to a pig hunt when I stopped at the In-and-Out Market in Palo Cedro, CA, to buy a license. I always check ammo in little roadside stores, and this place had easily the weirdest inventory I’ve ever seen in one place, to wit:

1 box of 225 Winchester (never seen this in the wild)
1 box of S&B 5.6x52R (Euro name for the 22 Savage Hi-Power, had to Google it)
6 boxes of fresh Federal 25-06
6-8 boxes of Federal 7x57 Mauser 175 RN
10 boxes of fresh Federal 7mm Winchester Short Magnum
6-8 boxes of fresh Federal 7mm Remington Magnum
6-8 boxes of fresh Federal & Fiocchi 308 Winchester
3 boxes of fresh PPU 303 British
1 box of Hornady 32 Special
2 boxes of Federal 338 Winchester Magnum 250-grain Woodleigh
1 box of 358 Winchester 200-grain PPT
2 boxes of 375 RUM
3 boxes of Hornady 450 Marlin

My guide later told me that this place used to have an FFL but gave it up after state laws became too onerous, which explains a lot.

I would have guessed those were all the calibers people had asked for over the years when they stopped in so someone started ordering a few boxes in with every ammo order.

[rcbusmc24]

I'm buying all the random stuff into the shop as it shows up on our distributors allocation lists, but many of the hunting calibers are still hard to get in. We are also dealing with the fact that many hunters around us here never seem to learn and will always try to come in the week before hunting season to get their box of bullets and they still only want to pay what that caliber cost back in 1985 so they want to wait "until the price goes back to normal..." This shit ain't going back to those prices, sorry....inflation is a cast iron bitch.

I've got cases of stuff waiting in the back overstock section, along with a bunch of new old stock stuff from a old gun shop mid state. It's interesting to see what used to be popular and still is around here....

[pointfiveoh]

Not sure about factory, but I'd bet that something like Bergara or Tikka barreled action + better stock/bedding + Nightforce + solid handloading technique + ability to read wind = formidable choice.


Okie John

What stock (s) would you recommend for that project? I've got a Tikka T3 Hunter in 06 that I've been considering modifying.

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[Skinner Precision, LLC]

What stock (s) would you recommend for that project? I've got a Tikka T3 Hunter in 06 that I've been considering modifying.

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Krg (bravo is the one I would recommend for this application) and Grayboe both off nice intersections of price /quality /performance /lack of gunsmithing needed. Not sure if Grayboe is offering their excellently shaped Terrain for a Tikka but they do for their A5 renegade and their lighter weight adjustable vertical grip stock (Phoenix).

If light weight is a more important than budget , carbon fiber stock from OMR or Manners and bed it.

[okie john]

What stock (s) would you recommend for that project? I've got a Tikka T3 Hunter in 06 that I've been considering modifying.

I have one of the super-light Grayboe Outlanders for a short-action Remington 700 and I like it a lot. I've also had good luck with Bansner on a Model 70 Winchester and Bell & Carlsons on 700 Remingtons in 308 and 35 Whelen. McMillan also inlets stocks for the Tikka action, and I understand that you don't need to bed them.

No idea about which chassis to use but plenty of other folks here could steer you in the right direction.


Okie John

[Thy.Will.Be.Done]

My whole childhood, dad kept meat in the freezer with an old battered Rem 700 .30-06. So that's got to be it for me. I saw that round do good, reliable work my entire life on antelope, deer, and elk. Nothing fancy, I just remember a lot of yellow/green Remington boxes, I think Core-Lokt.

We were not blessed in the money department and we never would have had access to as much high quality meat without those successful hunts. I spent my childhood eating wild game meat or 50/50 game/beef mixes and consequently grew up on some of the nicest, cleanest, freest meat you can eat.

Hate to break it to you but the jury is in on how clean your meat likely was, lead snowstorm is a serious problem with taking wild game. Lead is incredibly toxic and I'd almost guarantee there was quite a bit of it that blew far and wide into the muscle tissue you were eating. Perhaps this is worthy of it's own thread but I will only hunt with solid copper bullets from now on personally.

[LockedBreech]

Hate to break it to you but the jury is in on how clean your meat likely was, lead snowstorm is a serious problem with taking wild game. Lead is incredibly toxic and I'd almost guarantee there was quite a bit of it that blew far and wide into the muscle tissue you were eating. Perhaps this is worthy of it's own thread but I will only hunt with solid copper bullets from now on personally.

We all hunt with copper now (I got everybody onto Barnes and we've had a lot of luck with them). A lot of kids grew up with lead paint and turned out alright. All we can do is the best we can and that's what my folks did.