The “I need a .45 but do I need a 1911?” thread

[JDB]

Aw, hell. As long as we're talking government models and >$1000, ahmunna just leave this here.

Attachment 90696

That load of JHP 250gr @ 925 fps is totally doable with no changes.

Match trigger breaks in to 1911-ish in SA. Adjustable sights. Uber accurate.

I'm looking at trying the President's pistol match for the first time, and considering not using a 1911 (sacrilege!). So USPs expert/elite seems like a reasonable choice.

So I tried out my P30 LEM 9mm with a Wright Armory I-Dot system and holosun 407 for the first time, also the first time shooting bullseye 1 handed. Holy smokes that thing shoots! 4 shots into 1-1/8", 5th opened up to a little over 2" (with a called flyer). That's just with LC Nato ball (M882?). Shot another sub 3" group next (also 1 handed). Very encouraging. Probably not enough to really be competitive for the President's 100, but it got the juices flowing.

Guess I'll have to consider shooting it with irons. The Wright Armory I-dot rear sights are nice and clean.

[awp_101]

I've got a couple Kimber LW Government 45s and I have actually been a bit impressed with them. It seems Kimber decided to release a bunch of LW (lightweight) guns in both 45ACP and 9mm without firing pin safeties at really good prices recently so I picked up a pair of the 45s. My examples run just fine, no malfunctions, and are pretty nicely made. I actually have no complaints at this time.

I keep eyeballing those because I can handle one at a couple of LGS before buying. With pricing between Rock Island and SA, they’re pretty tempting.

[RJ]

Continuing the research with a live fire session at a local gun range here in Petoskey MI, where we are RVing.

The "range" is a converted Connex 53' trailer purchased used from a .mil organization, from what I understood. It is equipped with A/C, shot trapper, anechoic tiles and cameras. Distance is a max of 30'; you just walk back from the target wall to where you want to shoot.



I had stopped in previously and noticed they had a Rock Island Armory "Rock" model (retail, $579) 5" 1911 in .45 ACP in the rental case. So today I rented the range ($20) and gun ($10) to shoot for 30 minutes.

I wanted to see how this rental RIA fared when shot side by side with my game gun, a Glock 34 MOS Gen 5 with a Holosun 507c. I have around 1,900 rounds through it, so I am pretty familiar. I loaded two mags with 5 rounds ea of American Eagle 124 FMJ, my normal match/training ammo. For the .45, I brought a box of new PMC Bronze, 230 FMJ.

Since I was shooting iron sights, I wore my single-focus eyeglasses.

I don't know the round count of the Rock Island. Dry, it operated smoothly. It appeared clean and I did not feel any grit or creep. The trigger snapped crisply, there was not a lot of lost motion of the slide on the rail, nor did the barrel move much when I pressed down on it in battery. It was equipped with steel black sights, front and rear (if the front was originally painted, I could not tell. It looked black to me.)

I used the store's targets, which are simple 8 1/2x11 copy paper, with crossed lines and 1" hash marks. I shot everything at 21'. I shot both mags of the Glock, 5 each, on the two left targets, then the RIA, two mags of five, on the two right hand targets.

This is the first five rounds, slow fire, out of each gun": Rock Island at left, Glock at right. Group size for the RIA measured 2 1/8". The Glock's group measured 2 3/8", mainly due to a flyer, low right (lack of focus).


First five rounds out of each gun, cold.

For this test, my 507c reticle was set to manual, medium bright, and circle dot. I focused on firm support hand grip, acquire dot, press. For the RIA, I also focused on a strong support grip, placed the top edge of the front sight post on the bull and pressed.

The thumb safety (I am left handed) operated satisfactorily for me with my strong (left) hand. I clicked it on after loading a mag, then clicked it off just before lifting the gun on target. Then on when down. I would say I am "getting better" with the thumb safety, but it is not quite yet automatic.

The 8 round RIA magazine felt very rudimentary. The metal (I think) follower worked ok loading rounds, but it did not feel really smooth. (It felt not unlike the steel mag of the war time bringback Walther P38 I had the pleasure of cleaning and shooting for the owner last summer). The lack of a mag well was challenging, and mag insertion was only possible with fairly careful alignment.

I'll put my shooting impressions in the next post.

[RJ]

Shooting impressions.


My Glock 34 MOS bottom, RIA 1911 at top. They were very similar in size, albeit the .45 is much thinner.


The Glock shot, well, like my Glock. I didn't perceive any issues with my single focus glasses and the dot. As per usual, it was put dot on target, press trigger to rear. No malfunctions. Shooting the first group cold, I had one round go low right (my usual), but otherwise it was a typical group for me, slow fire. I can do better but this is what I did out of the box.

The RIA. Well, I had no malfunctions. 20 out of 20 rounds, no jams, stovepipes or misfires, which I was happy about. The sights bugged me a little, because I had to constantly go from sight, to target, back to sight, back to target (ok I am probably exaggerating but it's been a while since I shot irons -- I carry either a Glock 19+507c or a Sig P365X+407k).


I was a bit surprised at the small group size, cold, for not having shot this gun, or many 1911s, before. Cold, I did better with the RIA than with my Glock. Perhaps some of this was my eyeglasses (this pair was made specifically so I could shoot irons), some of it perhaps my absolute focus on making a clean shot, and perhaps some of it was this "1911 trigger" I hear so much about. Or maybe it was just luck.

After the initial mag, I then shot another mag of five. Group size was similar, but up and to the right. The next two mags were slightly larger, I was playing around a bit with dot hold, or top of sight hold, or low hold.

Numerically, the average of the four, 5-shot groups out of the RIA was 2.6", at 21'.

I perceived recoil as "slightly" more than the Glock, but not by a heck of a lot. The steel frame of the 1911 seems to be well matched to the .45. It was neither particularly snappy nor particularly light. I have a Tungsten guide rod and a 2 oz brass thug plug in the 34; it is otherwise stock / factory parts (ok, ok, I have a 5.0 lb Wolff trigger spring, but that's it.)

I was pretty happy with the RIA, actually. This being a Big Fat Case of I *Really* don't know what I don't know, if I bought one of these I would probably be ok with it. The rhetorical question is, do I shoot a $1,200 1911 better than a $579 1911.

I do know I did not like the RIA sights. I would vastly prefer even a big white dot, or a orange Ameriglo Agent, or a fat Dawson FO front. The rears I would sharpie out. As to an adjustable rear, I dunno. My G34 came with one of those. Seems to me like for what I want to use it for, at 7 yards the error I induce with poor trigger control will swamp the margin of adjustment for tweaking a rear sight U/D or L/R. So I think fixed sights for me, would be fine.

Subjectively, I also did not like the RIA grips. They are a plain wooden version, with some kind of slippery surface. But grips appear to be an easy change.

I liked this RIA gun a lot, actually. Just not the sights, and the grips would need to change. I also only shot ball ammo. I would be curious to know whether/if there were any issues in shooting JHP bullets (preferred for the Pin Shoot) out of this or any other 1911. Obviously that would be something I'd need to vet.

One last point. Every RIA model has an Ambi Safety. As a lefty, this is a huge plus for an out of the box gun for me. I don’t think I would buy a gun without one.

[OlongJohnson]

I'm looking at trying the President's pistol match for the first time, and considering not using a 1911 (sacrilege!). So USPs expert/elite seems like a reasonable choice.

This one looks fairly clean. Comes with the 20-round extended mag, which I remember was about $120 last time I looked.

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/937320439

@RJ - it has ambi controls. You can also go to a lefty-only control lever and the Compact levers work on FS if the oversized controls aren't necessary for use with gloves. It's probably the most modular fire control group on any pistol ever made. If you can change brakes on a Porsche, you can detail strip one of these. And get it back together right.

[bofe954]

This won't last, jump on it if you want a sub 1K 1911. Not sure if there is more than one, I am tempted myself.

https://www.kygunco.com/product/spri...rd-blem-refurb

Jumping on board.

I need want a 1911 to shoot in this competition: www.thepinshoot.com.

Here’s me last week, shooting it for the first time with a borrowed pistol:



The pins are 3 lbs something, at 21 feet. Most all are shooting 5” 1911s in .45ACP. Scoring is knocking the pin to the ground, 9mm doesn’t cut it.

A Glock 21SF is an option, but I have not shot one yet. I disliked the hinged trigger on my M&P 1.0 immensely. I don’t see buying another M&P unless S&W changes that. The 1911 I shot pointed well for me; I was able to get good hits, and the trigger was crisp.

I am a lefty, with size M hands. Based input on p-f, I’m looking a a Ruger SR1911 or a Springfield Garrison Loaded. I’d like to keep it around $1k or less.

The Ruger, based on positive reviews, great customer service stories, and satisfaction with several Ruger revolvers has me leaning that way. I would have to install an ambi safety, but absent that, the Ruger looks like the most affordable reliable 1911 that meets my needs.

[SecondsCount]

This won't last, jump on it if you want a sub 1K 1911. Not sure if there is more than one, I am tempted myself.

https://www.kygunco.com/product/spri...rd-blem-refurb

That's a solid option

[Robinson]

That's a solid option

Agreed.

[RJ]

I did want to take a minute and express my appreciation for all the suggestions and advice here in the thread. It really does give me some perspective, since I don't have a lot of rounds through 1911s at this point.

I also don't want to give the impression I'm "that guy" who asks what carry gun to get, is told "get a Glock 19 and case of ammo" and then ignores that and buys a High Point. Although I liked shooting the RIA basic model yesterday, after sleeping on it, I have some doubts. Seems like the odds of a $500 1911 running like a sewing machine, without some tinkering (which I'm neither really interested in nor have the knowledge to do, at this point) may not be as high as I'd like.

So, back to my $1k budget. "For my needs" (i.e. likely to run out of the box, nice overall appearance, customer service reputation, ubiquity, decent sights and lefty-friendly ambi-safety already fitted) I thought it over, and came up with the below, if I was going to purchase "today":

https://www.gunbroker.com/item/938022558

This is a Springfield Armory Loaded model, located in Crestview FL. It has an Ambi safety, tritium sights, mid-grade features. Doesn't look too bad, either. I mean, it's not a Wilson Combat or a SA TRP, but it's not a RIA, either.

[BN]

Rich, I have been reading this thread and I have some free advice.

You absolutely need an adjustable rear sight. You are trying to hit a very small target with a bowling pin. Most different weight and velocity ammo will hit at a very slightly different aim point.

You also need a pistol with a standardized front sight dovetail like a Novak. That way you can buy a bushel basket full of different front sights to put on and take off to replace with the newest front sight that you want to try, just as I have. It annoys me to no end that the different manufacturers use so many different dovetails.

What you should probably do is, ask @Mas what gun he loaned you. Then buy that exact model and send it to whatever gunsmith he had tune it and get it exactly the way you want it.

Adjust your budget upward and slow down on buying electronics for the camper to allow for it.

I shot Second Chance from 1981 through 1990. You'll probably need a couple shotguns next.