Effectiveness of common hunting ammunition for self defense?

[MandoWookie]

I don't know if this question has been asked before, but how do common hunting calibers perform in testing versus the common duty calibers?

I've seen 7.62×39 compared to 30-30, which is generally considered on the lower end of common game cartridges, but what about 30-06?
.243 Winchester? .308? I know some like .308 has 'tactical' loadings available, and .223 is also a common hunting round, but I'm specifically asking about loadings that are not marketed or intended for self-defense or duty use.

How do generic hunting loads compare to purpose specific tactical ammunition?

[Hambo]

I don't know if this question has been asked before, but how do common hunting calibers perform in testing versus the common duty calibers?

I've seen 7.62×39 compared to 30-30, which is generally considered on the lower end of common game cartridges, but what about 30-06?
.243 Winchester? .308? I know some like .308 has 'tactical' loadings available, and .223 is also a common hunting round, but I'm specifically asking about loadings that are not marketed or intended for self-defense or duty use.

How do generic hunting loads compare to purpose specific tactical ammunition?

IIRC Federal's bonded rifle ammo came from hunting ammo: Trophy Bonded. First up was .308 that was supposed to shoot to the same POA as Gold Medal Match. GMM was the sniper round of choice, but it failed pretty miserably when shot through glass. So don't expect cup and core bullets to be barrier blind. How .30-06 works on game is how it will work for defense.

[rd62]

I would think the biggest differences to be more along the lines of sealed case mouths, primers, and flash retardants than in the terminal ballistics. However anymore hunting ammo likely has similar if not the same attributes.

[Tannhauser]

If you’re shooting older cup & core type bullets, you might see differences with intermediate barriers.

I’ve shot a fair number of deer with all sorts of title cartridges, including some cartridges that would cross over into the “tactical” sphere - 7.62x39, 6.8 SPC, .309, various 6.5s - and from my totally untrained post mittens during field dressing I have to think any hit to center mass of a human with a hunting caliber & hunting bullet is going to be extremely effective at stopping the individual hit.

[Elwin]

Similar to Hambo’s point, I think I specifically remember GKR mentioning in one of his stickies that the 62gr Speer .223 round marketed as “tactical” is the same bullet as the Federal Fusion load, which is a bonded hunting load and pretty easy to find. Even better, Federal also makes Federal Fusion MSR in the black rifle calibers, which is Fusion with a flash suppressant. That’s what’s in my AR’s first mag, and I’m getting more whenever it shows up local again.

As for “non-tactical” calibers, I’m sure rifles gonna rifle regardless. A 30-30 will do the job just as well as anything else with similar ballistics. Over-penetration will be a thing with high velocity calibers, but that’s a thing with .308 as well.

[okie john]

As for “non-tactical” calibers, I’m sure rifles gonna rifle regardless.

A lot of common hunting cartridges either are military cartridges developed before World War One or are based on one of them. They were designed when horses and mules were still used to pull supply wagons, artillery pieces, field kitchens, ambulances, etc., so a principal requirement was the ability to kill horses and mules several hundred yards away. Because of the laws of land warfare, they had to do it with FMJ ammunition. Today, modern soft-point bullets make them excellent choices for deer, bear, elk, moose, and other soft-skinned game.

All of those cartridges are more alike than different. Most newer hunting cartridges match them with "improvements" usually driven more by marketing than anything meaningful. The 308 Winchester can duplicate nearly all of them, and cartridges based on them are more like their parent cartridges than not. They'll work for self-defense if you shoot them well, but recoil, blast, and overabundant terminal performance become a problem.


Okie John

[WDR]

How do generic hunting loads compare to purpose specific tactical ammunition?

Generic hunting loads with cup and core bullets are probably going to perform well enough for defense use in most common "hunting" cartridges, outside of barrier penetration (glass and steel mostly) becoming an issue. Over penetration is likely, unless hard barriers are hit. Some cartridges, like heavy bullet .30-06... are probably going to penetrate like hell either way.

"Tactical" loads are most likely bonded or monolithics, and generally have far better terminal performance through harder barriers... and also are more likely to over penetrate.

I can tell you Speer Gold Dot .223 works about the same as Federal Fusion in the same caliber. I've shot game with both.

[El Cid]

FWIW when the feebs wanted a .308 duty round for gas guns they tested a bunch and found the best was the Remington 150gr CLUB. It is bonded hunting round.

[Mitch]

I’ve shot deer and pigs with Barnes tsx, hornady sst, federal fusion, and federal whitetail (I think, whatever the cup and core OG deer hunting bullet is).

There’s plenty of monolithic and bonded hunting bullets. So hunting ammo may be a misnomer for what you’re asking. I think I know what you’re getting at though so here’s my (limited) experience.

Bonded and monolithic bullets penetrate better and generally stay in one piece. Cup and core don’t. The 180 grain cup and core bullet I shot a pig with lodged in the opposite shoulder and when we dug it out it weighed less than 180. I can’t remember exactly how much but I still have it and can weigh it if you’d like. I think it was around 160.

Most animals have a pretty strong survival instinct. The ones I shot with a 5.56 yelped and went off to find a place to lay down and die (generally not too far away). The ones I shot with a 308 fell right in their tracks. One was hit good and died right there in short order. One was a real bad hit (she was on the move, probably shouldn’t have shot her) but she still went down. Got up and ran off bleeding pretty good and was finished off with a headshot when I tracked her down. The two deer shot with a muzzleloader (45 cal bullet, 250 grain probably going 1800 fps or so) went down in 20-50 yards.

In short, rifles kill things real well. If things went sideways and I had to use 55 gr fmj 5.56 I wouldn’t be worried about my ammo. Hell my friend shot a hog with m193 and it didn’t react much differently than the one I shot with a Barnes tsx in 5.56.

There are graveyards of people killed with 9mm fmj. If you’re using a rifle you’ll be fine.

[Tannhauser]

I’ve shot deer and pigs with Barnes tsx, hornady sst, federal fusion, and federal whitetail (I think, whatever the cup and core OG deer hunting bullet is).

There’s plenty of monolithic and bonded hunting bullets. So hunting ammo may be a misnomer for what you’re asking. I think I know what you’re getting at though so here’s my (limited) experience.

Bonded and monolithic bullets penetrate better and generally stay in one piece. Cup and core don’t. The 180 grain cup and core bullet I shot a pig with lodged in the opposite shoulder and when we dug it out it weighed less than 180. I can’t remember exactly how much but I still have it and can weigh it if you’d like. I think it was around 160.

Most animals have a pretty strong survival instinct. The ones I shot with a 5.56 yelped and went off to find a place to lay down and die (generally not too far away). The ones I shot with a 308 fell right in their tracks. One was hit good and died right there in short order. One was a real bad hit (she was on the move, probably shouldn’t have shot her) but she still went down. Got up and ran off bleeding pretty good and was finished off with a headshot when I tracked her down. The two deer shot with a muzzleloader (45 cal bullet, 250 grain probably going 1800 fps or so) went down in 20-50 yards.

In short, rifles kill things real well. If things went sideways and I had to use 55 gr fmj 5.56 I wouldn’t be worried about my ammo. Hell my friend shot a hog with m193 and it didn’t react much differently than the one I shot with a Barnes tsx in 5.56.

There are graveyards of people killed with 9mm fmj. If you’re using a rifle you’ll be fine.

No psychological stops with wild animals. They will go until physically unable.