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Thread: To SBR or Not to SBR? That is the question.

  1. #61
    Member 23JAZ's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GyroF-16 View Post
    Clearly an experienced AR pistol shooter.
    I guess it’s handy that her staff handed her a braced pistol, though.
    Well, a pistol until sometime in August.
    She must have tens of rounds through that pistol.
    212

  2. #62
    Site Supporter Odin Bravo One's Avatar
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    Skill level is questionable at best, but experience-wise, I’ve watched numerous stocks come apart on everything from poodle shooting pop guns and assault rifles to belt-fed MG’s. In the 30 years since entering employment as an armed professional, lots of things have changed. Lots of things have not. Stocks have improved. Laws and words have been re-defined and reinterpreted. People still insist gear trumps ability.

    This is a stock…..By all current legal definitions.

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    This is a brace, using the same criteria.

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    Please, explain the features of the stock which make it superior to the brace.
    You can get much more of what you want with a kind word and a gun, than with a kind word alone.

  3. #63
    Quote Originally Posted by Nephrology View Post
    They feel weird and the hokey legal status thing was always a turn off.
    I agree, just always seemed funky. Though my motivation is low, I guess if I really cared I would put more effort into deciding if I really like/dislike braces.

    ETA: I am sure many of the braces are very good, but it seems like ATF has been acting like Lucy holding the football for Charlie Brown for the last decade, and they would probably actually do something just about the time I decided I really liked them and bought a bunch of them...

    Quote Originally Posted by Nephrology View Post
    I don't travel much out of state with rifles and filling out some paperwork when I finally leave this one is no big deal to me.
    When I read this at first I didn't agree, and then realized how our circumstances are geographically different. You live in the center of an expansive state, I live in the corner of a smaller one with good places to shoot and visit in IN/KY/TN. Out of state transport is one of the things that has always lowered my motivation on SBRs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nephrology View Post
    that said AR-15s are always better with two stamps, not just one
    And this is what would elevate my motivation on an SBR, don't want that can waving around out past a 16" barrel.
    But, this also makes me wonder about pin & weld. A couple years ago I sorta truncated what I have, and since I do not have so many guns I am pretty sure if I bought a can it would end up on the same gun 99% of the time anyway. I would probably be mainly interested in 300BO, though 9mm would be another area of interest, so I would probably end up with two cans anyway.

    Inside my personal priorities I am starting to think if I started with the 300BO I could verify everything was working the way I want while shooting it on my pistol lower, and then drill and pin it. Some day if I wanted to change it the pin could be drilled out, but pretty sure if I do what I want I would never end up changing it, I am pretty much monogamous...
    Last edited by mmc45414; 07-18-2022 at 02:15 PM.

  4. #64
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giving Back View Post
    Skill level is questionable at best, but experience-wise, I’ve watched numerous stocks come apart on everything from poodle shooting pop guns and assault rifles to belt-fed MG’s. In the 30 years since entering employment as an armed professional, lots of things have changed. Lots of things have not. Stocks have improved. Laws and words have been re-defined and reinterpreted. People still insist gear trumps ability.

    This is a stock…..By all current legal definitions.

    This is a brace, using the same criteria.

    Please, explain the features of the stock which make it superior to the brace.
    I have the utmost respect for your sacrifices and training for our country, sir.

    If this was a reply to me, I can assure you that I don’t believe gear is more important than ability.

    If you’ve seen any of my journals, you know that I train a lot.

    I misunderstood the context of your previous post.

    I often carry a 1” Taurus Snub revolver… because I can shoot that better than most people can shoot a full size semi.

    But I have no delusions that gear doesn’t matter.

    I also don’t care much about the ATF definition of stock versus brace. There are some very stock-able braces out there.

    And they are definitely better than some technical stocks performance wise. The retractable HK and MPX stocks come to mind.

    In the strict case of the Sig brace versus the Sig folding stock, they’re similar in weight, size and cost. I don’t like the twist on mounting that I’ve experienced with hard use with the brace. Braces by definition are supposed to allow some wiggle room in pivot angle to the forearm. Something I don’t personally want on a stock.

    I’d rather have a naked buffer tube than a floppy brace wing.

  5. #65
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    An example of why I would rather have a short Sig folding stock than a Sig brace for my home defense weapon.



    With enough practice it gets floppy and gets hung up on clothing and on random things interfering with my consistent mount. I’d rather have a naked buffer tube than an inconsistent floppy mount.

    But for an NFA stamp, I can get a stock that’s similar in size and weight but will never flop.

  6. #66
    Site Supporter Odin Bravo One's Avatar
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    I’m not here to convince anyone of shit.

    You do you.

    But until someone answers the question I posed in my quoted post, I remain unconvinced.
    You can get much more of what you want with a kind word and a gun, than with a kind word alone.

  7. #67
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    Quote Originally Posted by Giving Back View Post
    I’m not here to convince anyone of shit.

    You do you.

    But until someone answers the question I posed in my quoted post, I remain unconvinced.
    I tried to answer but apparently not to your satisfaction.

    Stock versus brace is an ATF semantic exercise.

    Especially since most users of braces use them as stocks and they’re designed to act like stocks.

    So let’s talk about shitty stock / braces versus “good” stock / braces.

    A shitty stock / brace would wiggle, wobble and give an inconsistent mount.

    I have a blade brace that I would take over a Sig brace. I’d take a buffer tube only over a Sig brace.

    A floppy brace wing is like a loose grip panel on a handgun. It’s not worth it for me.

    Plus gun games (USPSA / IDPA) require SBR so there’s that.

    A stock isn’t inherently better than a brace.

    But something that wobbles is shittier than something that doesn’t, regardless of what you call it.

  8. #68
    Site Supporter Odin Bravo One's Avatar
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    I can 100% guarantee I won’t be anywhere near your next gunfight, nor you near mine, so it matters none to me your justifications for your opinions. That’s the beauty of opinions. Everyone has them, and they’re generally worth what you pay for em……. Which is why I’m hesitant to share mine……I don’t want to drive the market value down more
    You can get much more of what you want with a kind word and a gun, than with a kind word alone.

  9. #69
    Site Supporter ccmdfd's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ccmdfd View Post
    Is August still the date? Thought they were going to publish something in June and then have the rules take effect in August but haven't seen anything.
    Washington Gun Law reporting they are expecting the new rules to come out in December.


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