EDC ideas for places where everything is illegal

[vcdgrips]

Random thoughts from somebody who has visited NYC a number of times in the last 6 years for kids' school visits, camps/singing trips and matriculation.

AFAIK, pepper spray is ONLY legal if it was purchased in NY from an authorized dealer i.e. Pharmacies and Gun Stores. I am told there is a form and ID is required.

Out of context tools i.e. screwdrivers, box cutters, carpet knives etc. will be a cause for concern should they be deployed out of context.

The "need" for a coin purse to hold quarters re the subway, busses etc. made a lot more since 8-10 years ago. Given the explosion of magnetic strip transit cards and smart phone ability to proximity pay, they may be problematic as well.

In no particular order:

1. Look/act/be the part re dress and demeanor. i.e.
2. 3 S rule
3. ALWAYS be wearing comfortable shoes you can run and be sure footed in. I would go as far to say that after staying warm/dry, the next priority in NYC is comfortable shoes.
4. Keep your hands free. Ergo use a backpack/messenger bag/sling bag as appropriate
5. Wear headphone with sound off or low as it sends a visual cue that you are occupied
6. Wear sunglasses when appropriate so as to not be obviously making unintended eye contact.
7. Buy and carry NY approved pepper spray as it is better than nothing. Keep a copy of your receipt so you can document its NY approval.
8. I do not typically check bags so I will not be flying in w an NYC approved knife ( sub 4 inches, no exposed clips etc.) If I was going to live in NYC, I would know the knife laws stone cold and comply with them scrupulously.
9. Listen your little voice when it is time to go, not go at all, move on, get out, take the next train etc. When in any doubt, Lyft or Uber Out v taking the train.
10. NOBODY can or will take care of you better than you.
11. I concur that the right flashlight is a good thing
12. I concur re being conscious of impact mechanisms and by extension physical barriers in the environment.
13. With "crazy" folks, there is NOTHING you can say to talk them down, in the end, space is created because you move on, they move on, you both move on, they fixate on something or someone else or you will have to fully commit to doing whatever it takes to create the space for yourself.


slight drift-Given my background, midwest, ethnic mom, extremely diverse school/work environments, i tend to be highly civil re saying excuse me, yes ma'am, yes sir, young man, young lady, opening doors, giving up my seat on the train etc. I sometime wonder if that civility is taken as weakness. Particularly in a dense urban environment like NYC.

[blues]

slight drift-Given my background, midwest, ethnic mom, extremely diverse school/work environments, i tend to be highly civil re saying excuse me, yes ma'am, yes sir, young man, young lady, opening doors, giving up my seat on the train etc. I sometime wonder if that civility is taken as weakness. Particularly in a dense urban environment like NYC.

I no longer live in NYC but did for more than half my life, and I still have numerous family and friends there.

I do not think it's taken as a sign of weakness. I think NYers appreciate civility as much as anyone else, and maybe more so in some instances, despite appearances and popular culture to the contrary. That said, Mr. Murphy recognizes no geographic bounds, to my knowledge.

[curious]

I strongly suggest a cell phone.

All jokes aside, I think carrying a sharpened screwdriver is a HORRIBLE idea. Don't carry anything you can't reasonably articulate a reason for having. I don't know the laws there, but I'd bet you are in unfriendly territory there if you tee off on someone with a cane or light them up with a screwdriver and it comes about that you have absolutely no fucking reason for having a cane or a screwdriver.

If Pepper Spray is legal there, I'd suggest that. If not, the umbrella thing actually sounds like a decent idea if you can figure out somewhere to keep it.

Some implements however, are useless if you don't know how to fight. For instance, I could keep my keys on a carabiner, which could serve as an improvised knuckle duster, but I'll probably need to know how to box to make that work.

Here comes the big advertisement for physical fitness and a LEGITAMATE martial arts background that emphasizes hard contact, grappling and being able to control and finish someone against their will by forcing them into a situation that is impossible for them to overcome. Think Wrestling, Judo, MMA, Boxing, Muay Thai, or something like those. I shouldn't say MMA is a martial art, because MMA is a set of rules, although there are a number of schools that specialize in training MMA athletes and those places would be good to learn from.

Do not make the mistake of basing your fighting style on an "add on" martial art style. That is not going to help you against a dedicated attacker who is pressing the fight. I refer to some martial arts as an "add on" martial art because you need to know how to fight already if you want to use them. That sort of thing is the case with various forms of Tae Kwon Do, Aikido, and kung-fu. "Hand to Hand Skills" means you need to know how to fight. That means being able to react in the moment to a very dynamic and chaotic situation. That doesn't come from your sensei standing in front of you and saying "Attack me....NO....attack me like THIS" or some self defense guru who says it's all about eye pokes and groin shots but could never even land a leg kick or a straight right on a resisting opponent.

Like yeah, eye pokes and groin shots can work very well. But if you can't land a punch or a leg kick, what makes you think you can hit a smaller target than that in a stressful situation. You don't rise to the occasion. I think guys like Cecil and Paul and Craig have been preaching for years that you can add those things on to a foundation...but you cannot MAKE them your foundation. I can put a guy on the ground with an aikido wristlock because I know that if that fails, I can go immediately to a blast double.

That story of the dude who used a MMA hold to take down a knife wielding assailant is fucking wild, but that's the kind of martial arts you need. Yeah, he got cut badly. He could have died easily. What he did was both brave, and desperate but he defeated and HELD DOWN and armed assailant. That is fucking bananas.

When I was taking YMCA karate as a kid, I would occasionally think to myself about those exact type of situations. "Could I REALLY beat some dude in a fight? Could I bring myself to take down a guy with a knife and know I could do it? Can I land powerful, debilitating shots with speed? If I got the guy to the ground, do I have a way I can defeat him that doesn't include my usual bravado of just saying I would stomp his head or something?"

In the back of my mind, I knew the answer was "maybe...maybe not." because kata, front snap kicks and chambered punches and ridge hand strikes on a wave master were one thing...but we never sparred.

Now that I have been kickboxing with sparring frequently, and have gone up in rank in BJJ, I know for a fact that I could improvise/find a way in the moment to to funnel an attacker into a situation that would be to my benefit. I would maybe still get cut, and maybe still badly. But if desperate enough and brave enough, I have many times before, controlled the pace of striking exchanges against larger, stronger opponents, and have been able to take them down and easily control or finish them.

So yeah, get out the carabiner so you can open up cuts on the guy a little easier, or get the keys to put between your fingers, or the umbrella to daze him with some headshots...get the pepper spray so you can blind him, or groin strikes that you can deliver quickly and use footwork to dodge whatever counter he may have. You can dominate the fight with just a little extra advantage.

But you should learn how to do one thing that you'll never get from a single seminar or a day in training.

You should learn how to fight.

But if your body is too beat up for that, then I suggest you avoid the stupid people, places and times, get some pepper spray and figure out how to get the fuck away in a hurry and notify the cops.

Hence the cell phone.

ah, the exuberance of youth...

fisticuffs means i have failed at my overall situational awareness training and truly allowed someone to get way way to close to lay hands on me...nawl, i'll pass and just capitulate by throwing my money clip at my feet for them to have...oh ya i forgot i have a cane...hummm ~ there are 8 million stories in the naked city this is mine!!

as for the use of a cane...might check statutory definitions across the nation but mine only makes them illegal if they are all white & red.

regarding possession and use of pepper spray statutory guidance varies across the country as to amount, some as low as < 2oz, and legality to use in self defense situations...

now where did I leave my Shillelagh to continue my wandering all the while hummmn' to myself:

I love to go a-wandering, Along the mountain track, And as I go, I love to sing,

[mtnbkr]

I do not think it's taken as a sign of weakness. I think NYers appreciate civility as much as anyone else, and maybe more so in some instances, despite appearances and popular culture to the contrary.

I've only visited NYC as a tourist, but I found New Yorkers to generally be pretty polite and helpful in contrast to the stereotype. Sure they could be a bit direct and motivated, but I never found them rude or unhelpful.

Chris

[ubervic]

I think NYers appreciate civility as much as anyone else, and maybe more so in some instances, despite appearances and popular culture to the contrary. That said, Mr. Murphy recognizes no geographic bounds, to my knowledge.

I spent most of my childhood on Long Island then moved to the greater DC Metro area as a teenager. Relocated to NY, actually Manhattan, to run a retail store as the manager in the late '80s. During my entire time in NYC, I was continually impressed by the friendliness and decency of the dozens of random customers I'd encounter on a daily basis. NYers are not necessarily more rude than anyone else. Direct, yes, but not rude. There's a difference.

[JHC]

I no longer live in NYC but did for more than half my life, and I still have numerous family and friends there.

I do not think it's taken as a sign of weakness. I think NYers appreciate civility as much as anyone else, and maybe more so in some instances, despite appearances and popular culture to the contrary. That said, Mr. Murphy recognizes no geographic bounds, to my knowledge.

I hit the Big Apple a couple times for work and wandered about with co-workers enjoying food and drink and found the folks to be just delightful. Including wandering around Grennich Village and asking folks for directions and stumbling upon a shoot for a commercial to re-introduce the Indian motorcycle a good while before it actually hit the market.

[jeep45238]

Write in the rain note book (small soft back) and a Zebra F701 pen - practical for daily, and the steel pen is a great writing utensil while being a pretty nifty pokey thing. Sherriff and the court metal detectors didn't bat an eyeball.

POM spray, a similarly sized high candela/lumen flash light, and no pocket clips on anything.

[pastaslinger]

My current takeaways from this thread are pepper spray bought in NYC, and a flashlight (which is always a useful tool anyways). For flashlight, I'm hoping the surefire turbo series handhelds become available soon, but if not, then either the SF E2D defender, the Malkoff posted earlier, or maybe still the Cloud MCH.

I am also now interested in finding my the wilderness instructor belts. I think I sold them, but they have pretty hefty steel buckles and aren't specifically advertised as being a weapon like that other belt that was posted (I otherwise think that one is awesome).

It is fair to say staying away from trouble keeps you out of trouble, but at some level, things are unavoidable or unexpected which is why I try to carry when possible, even for places that I know are normally "safe" like Costco. Example, a few months back I was at the park in a neighborhood where the median home price is easily in the 7-8 figure range with a group of friends, and the group next to us that was minding their own business had a knife pulled on them by a guy high on meth. Why not be as prepared as legally possible? That day I thought we were swimming in the lake, so I stupidly only brought a pocket knife and the "what if" part of my brain regretted not carrying.

I think learning grappling arts and basic strikes also makes sense but I do not want to grapple with anyone if I can help it because even if someone is weak, it significantly preoccupies you and you're vulnerable to that person's buddy. Also, I have done some wrestling, BJJ, and judo before but let's just say that as I have gotten older, I am realizing my frailty a bit more from exercise/weightlifting injuries and I'm not going to pretend that I'm some registered ass kicker in the grappling arts.

[NH Shooter]

Someone mention flashlights? :-)

This one is a Malkoff M91T head on a MD4 body with a Lumens Factory tailcap. AOL = 7-1/2";




Same setup on a Malkoff MD3 body, which measures 6-5/8" long making it carry-on legal;




As I've mentioned before, either of the above ride comfortably unnoticed in the right-front zippered pocket of Duluth relaxed fit Foreman's pants. Both are built like hammers, the MD4 version is my preference.

[JCN]

That doesn't come from your sensei standing in front of you and saying "Attack me....NO....attack me like THIS" or some self defense guru who says it's all about eye pokes and groin shots but could never even land a leg kick or a straight right on a resisting opponent.

Like yeah, eye pokes and groin shots can work very well. But if you can't land a punch or a leg kick, what makes you think you can hit a smaller target than that in a stressful situation. You don't rise to the occasion. I think guys like Cecil and Paul and Craig have been preaching for years that you can add those things on to a foundation...but you cannot MAKE them your foundation. I can put a guy on the ground with an aikido wristlock because I know that if that fails, I can go immediately to a blast double.

In reading this, I thought that was a perfect analogy for many, many of the static firing line gun classes / instructors.