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Thread: Full frame Glock choice

  1. #81
    Quote Originally Posted by steve View Post
    Some stuff I did way back in the day (2009 or 2010)

    Glock 17L

    Fed 115 +P+ JHP 1341 FPS 459 FPE
    Corbon 115 +P 1428 FPS 520 FPE
    Triton 115 +P 1477 FPS 553 FPE
    Win 127 +P+ 1291 FPS 470 FPE
    Gold Dot 124 +P 1293 FPS 460 FPE
    Fed 147 +P HST 1078 FPS 379 FPE

    Glock 34

    Corbon 115 +P 1418 FPS 513 FPE
    Triton 115 +P 1427 FPS 520 FPE
    Win 127 +p+ 1274 FPS 457 FPE
    FED 147 +P HST 1079 FPS 380 FPE

    Glock 19

    Fed 115 +P+ 1227 FPS 385 FPE
    Corbon 115 +P 1351 FPS 466 FPE
    Win 127 +p+ 1206 FPS 410 FPE
    Gold Dot 124 +P 1204 FPS 399 FPE

    S&W 940 9mm 2"

    FED Classic 124 1087 FPS 325 FPE
    Win 127 +P+ 1147 FPS 371 FPE
    As a 17L owner, really appreciate you sharing that velocity data.

  2. #82
    Quote Originally Posted by pastaslinger View Post
    No, the g34 gen 3 and 4 window is perfect as is. They removed the window on gen 5 though... sadly.
    Couldn't disagree more about the window ever being acceptable for serious uses beyond competition. Crud will inevitably find it's way in there and lockup the gun given the opportunity, I can assure you. This is why most all duty pistols are closed slides, the keep out debris. The 34/35 were designed for competition and later marketed as being 'tactical', which of course, is not a sound choice in general.

    The real reason the cutout is there is to not have to change anything with the design as the slide weighs identical to 17/22 pistols. Now the Gen 5 has more mass, so they've likely had to *sigh* change other parts in the design. it probably cost them a small fortune to redesign it the way it should have from the beginning....

  3. #83
    Heres another barrel length velocity test; sadly it does not include some of the more important SD ammo loads like the Gold Dot 124gr/ +p.

    JHP SD ammo is gaining ~ +50fps from G19/45-->G34 length.



    That doesnt sound like much, and at 10' likely makes no difference.

    Yet it becomes interesting when looking at 'effective range' ie the distance the bullet will still expand reliably through 4 layers of denim and penetrate 12"+.

    I do not know what that velocity is - its likely different for each bullet. But for discussion lets say 1100fps is that cutoff zone for the 124gr XTP. (I'm using the XTP because Hornady has provided the bullets G1 BC of .165.)

    https://bergerbullets.com/ballistics-calculator/

    @1258fps from the G34, the 124gr reaches its 1100ps (theoretical) minimum velocity at 65yds.
    @1204fps from the G19, the 124gr reaches its 1100fps (theoretical) minimum velocity at 46yds.

    Assuming 1050fps minimum

    @1258fps from G34, 1050fps @ 94yd
    @1204fps from G19, 1050fps @ 75yd

    So that seemingly useless +54fps could translate into an additional +19yds of effective range. Given the increased range and hit probability a RDS affords, I wouldn't turn down what is essentially free extra effectiveness. Free, in that a X300/TLR1 turns any Glock into a G34 length pistol. Might as well scoop up that extra performance if you're running that length of light.

  4. #84
    Quote Originally Posted by Thy.Will.Be.Done View Post
    Couldn't disagree more about the window ever being acceptable for serious uses beyond competition. Crud will inevitably find it's way in there and lockup the gun given the opportunity, I can assure you. This is why most all duty pistols are closed slides, the keep out debris. The 34/35 were designed for competition and later marketed as being 'tactical', which of course, is not a sound choice in general.

    The real reason the cutout is there is to not have to change anything with the design as the slide weighs identical to 17/22 pistols. Now the Gen 5 has more mass, so they've likely had to *sigh* change other parts in the design. it probably cost them a small fortune to redesign it the way it should have from the beginning....
    Has the Gen 5 been a fix that should now be considered for defensive or duty purposes in your opinion/experience?

  5. #85
    Quote Originally Posted by Thy.Will.Be.Done View Post
    Couldn't disagree more about the window ever being acceptable for serious uses beyond competition. Crud will inevitably find it's way in there and lockup the gun given the opportunity, I can assure you. This is why most all duty pistols are closed slides, the keep out debris. The 34/35 were designed for competition and later marketed as being 'tactical', which of course, is not a sound choice in general.

    The real reason the cutout is there is to not have to change anything with the design as the slide weighs identical to 17/22 pistols. Now the Gen 5 has more mass, so they've likely had to *sigh* change other parts in the design. it probably cost them a small fortune to redesign it the way it should have from the beginning....
    How many times has this actually happened to you? I have carried a G34 a fair bit and have had no issues. I'm sure there's other people that carry ported pistols without problems. The same thing goes for comps, shit can theoretically get in the comp and cause an obstruction but this doesn't really happen either.

  6. #86
    Site Supporter JonInWA's Avatar
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    Years ago, anecdotally (that means 50th hand in all liklihood) I'd heard that a LEO had somehow gotten some change (as in coin(s)) lodged in the window, jamming things up. And there were multiple LEO agencies that issued or allowed them, including one or more state patrols, and I never heard of any issues with the guns or with the open window G34/G35.

    But c'mon. These things are generally, usually, most of the time in a holster, so I think it was really a non-issue.

    I had a Gen3 G34, with a great set of Warren sights on it. Good as it was, in my case it really didn't do anything that my Gen 3 G17 and/or Gen 3 G19 more than adequately covered, albeit with a greater slide length, so it went by the wayside. Someone got a great, well-maintained low round count gun-I hope they're enjoying.

    While I can at least see a potential accuracy increase with a G34 due to the longer sight plane with iron sights (although in my case it wasn't demonstrably more accurate or easier to acquire the sights than with my G17/G19), if you're going the RDS route, I really can't think of many good reasons to go with anything longer than a G19/G45 slide length.

    Good as my G34 was, I've had zero seller remorse in letting it go.

    Regarding the .45 ACP G41, a friend of mine, and avid G21 user (both for duty and IDPA) tried the G41, and found the G21 to be a gentler recoiling/shooting Glock. presumably due to the decreased mass of the G41 with the thinner/ lighter slide. He quickly went back to the G21.

    Best, Jon

  7. #87
    Quote Originally Posted by newyork View Post
    Has the Gen 5 been a fix that should now be considered for defensive or duty purposes in your opinion/experience?
    While I am a rather big nobody, I would say that it has at least the potential to be duty/defensive ready with the caveat that it runs well with your ammo for carry.

    Quote Originally Posted by pastaslinger View Post
    How many times has this actually happened to you? I have carried a G34 a fair bit and have had no issues. I'm sure there's other people that carry ported pistols without problems. The same thing goes for comps, shit can theoretically get in the comp and cause an obstruction but this doesn't really happen either.
    Even if it were the sort of failure that couldn't be reproduced reliably or happened at a very insignificant rate... I think many would agree any potential for decreased reliability is unacceptable here especially considering it's a feature that is completely unnecessary were Glock to have engineered it in the non-lazy way from the beginning. They actually have quite the history of bean counting which produces parts commonality at the expense of reliability so they can save money during production and not racking up R&D. Gen 4 Glock 9mm was a perfect example, using the same slide mass and recoil spring originally as the .40 Gen 4. This, of course, was an utter failure and was somewhat quickly addressed because of mass failures across wide base of users.

  8. #88
    I got my original g45 for duty use a month after they were released in 2018 (the top one). I got it milled about 2 years ago and have ran it in USPSA matches. My current department issues the MOS version(bottom one). I would probably go with the g45 in your situation because of the safariland compatibility. I've got a couple of g19's and g17's as well. I don't think the difference in a g17 and a g45 performance wise is significant enough to make me choose a 17 in your situation.
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  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Thy.Will.Be.Done View Post
    Couldn't disagree more about the window ever being acceptable for serious uses beyond competition. Crud will inevitably find it's way in there and lockup the gun given the opportunity, I can assure you. This is why most all duty pistols are closed slides, the keep out debris. The 34/35 were designed for competition and later marketed as being 'tactical', which of course, is not a sound choice in general.

    The real reason the cutout is there is to not have to change anything with the design as the slide weighs identical to 17/22 pistols. Now the Gen 5 has more mass, so they've likely had to *sigh* change other parts in the design. it probably cost them a small fortune to redesign it the way it should have from the beginning....
    My buddy thst carried a g34 on duty in an open holster for 10+ years didn't have any issues

    Not saying it can't happen. My new CR 920 has small windows which is a bit annoying but in the grand scheme not concerned

  10. #90
    Quote Originally Posted by JonInWA View Post
    Years ago, anecdotally (that means 50th hand in all liklihood) I'd heard that a LEO had somehow gotten some change (as in coin(s)) lodged in the window, jamming things up. And there were multiple LEO agencies that issued or allowed them, including one or more state patrols, and I never heard of any issues with the guns or with the open window G34/G35.

    But c'mon. These things are generally, usually, most of the time in a holster, so I think it was really a non-issue.

    I had a Gen3 G34, with a great set of Warren sights on it. Good as it was, in my case it really didn't do anything that my Gen 3 G17 and/or Gen 3 G19 more than adequately covered, albeit with a greater slide length, so it went by the wayside. Someone got a great, well-maintained low round count gun-I hope they're enjoying.

    While I can at least see a potential accuracy increase with a G34 due to the longer sight plane with iron sights (although in my case it wasn't demonstrably more accurate or easier to acquire the sights than with my G17/G19), if you're going the RDS route, I really can't think of many good reasons to go with anything longer than a G19/G45 slide length.

    Good as my G34 was, I've had zero seller remorse in letting it go.

    Regarding the .45 ACP G41, a friend of mine, and avid G21 user (both for duty and IDPA) tried the G41, and found the G21 to be a gentler recoiling/shooting Glock. presumably due to the decreased mass of the G41 with the thinner/ lighter slide. He quickly went back to the G21.

    Best, Jon
    Haha well I'm glad I don't carry change...

    The G21 does for sure shoot softly (possibly because the slide is slightly heavy). I love shooting them but the price of .45 acp is terrible.

    Quote Originally Posted by Thy.Will.Be.Done View Post
    While I am a rather big nobody, I would say that it has at least the potential to be duty/defensive ready with the caveat that it runs well with your ammo for carry.

    Even if it were the sort of failure that couldn't be reproduced reliably or happened at a very insignificant rate... I think many would agree any potential for decreased reliability is unacceptable here especially considering it's a feature that is completely unnecessary were Glock to have engineered it in the non-lazy way from the beginning. They actually have quite the history of bean counting which produces parts commonality at the expense of reliability so they can save money during production and not racking up R&D. Gen 4 Glock 9mm was a perfect example, using the same slide mass and recoil spring originally as the .40 Gen 4. This, of course, was an utter failure and was somewhat quickly addressed because of mass failures across wide base of users.
    Yeah but again, if I want a ported barrel (which I do) it is a convenience for me to have the slide window. I'd probably have to tune a recoil spring to a comp while my ported G34 runs perfectly with 115 gr range ammo and a factory rsa. I am willing to bet money that a G34 with a slide window will have fewer malfunctions than a Staccato or many other guns without a window. There are theoretical problems and there are actual ones.

    Remember that just a decade ago people also thought red dots on handguns were niche and/or dumb and more for competition... Look at where we are now.

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