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Thread: Why choose to SBR vs AR pistol?

  1. #21
    Quote Originally Posted by GyroF-16 View Post
    Speaking (writing) precisely - if a gun type and S/N is known, it can be traced to me if purchased involving a 4473.
    Or “LE has gun, can find my name”


    My concern is going on record that I own a particular gun- that is knowing my name, they can come up with a type and S/N, which is the reverse- “LE has my name, can find type and S/N”.

    Do I have that right?
    As far as the ATF goes, once they get a firearm and S/N, they start with the manufacturer, then the distributor, and then the dealer that sold the firearm. I am not aware of any process where the ATF can figure out the guns purchased by an individual based on the individual’s name.

    This may not be the case if a local jurisdiction or state has some sort of registry.

  2. #22
    Member TGS's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by rawkguitarist View Post
    It may feel like "conspiracy theories" but its not. The federal law enforcement agencies have a process that uses the 4473 form to easily find what you own if they want to know.
    As a fed, I'd really like to be let in on this secretive process.
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  3. #23
    S.L.O.W. ASH556's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by GyroF-16 View Post

    So- to the P-F brethren-

    - What motivated you to go the SBR route, or what kept you from doing it?
    - If SBR’d, how do you find the situation? Restrictions on use/travel?
    - if I SBR a lower, can I easily change uppers? Calibers (5.56 to 300 BLK)?
    - Does the process just involve submitting the E-form, and then getting the lower engraved once it’s approved? Or is there more that I’m not aware of?

    @GJM
    @ASH556
    @StraitR
    @Clusterfrack
    My SBR is on a Form 4. I got it before braces were invented. I like it and would do it again. I’ve never had the desire to swap calibers but have reconfigured the upper several times. No comment on the rest.
    Food Court Apprentice
    Semper Paratus certified AR15 armorer

  4. #24
    Quote Originally Posted by TC215 View Post
    Not what you own, what you’ve purchased (if it was purchased or transferred through an FFL).

    The ATF does the gun traces. They can be requested by any local, state, or federal agency.
    Thanks for the clarification of the federal agency that does the tracing. Of course I meant anything you own purchased with a 4473. The point is, in general what the average gun owner possess has a 4473 attached to it........
    Aaron D.
    EvoSec
    Evolution Security Podcast

  5. #25
    Quote Originally Posted by TGS View Post
    As a fed, I'd really like to be let in on this secretive process.
    Guys, I’m not in law enforcement. So if I use imprecise wording, sorry. I didn’t say it was secret. There is a tracing process that everyone is aware of. That’s all I’m referring to.
    Aaron D.
    EvoSec
    Evolution Security Podcast

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by rawkguitarist View Post
    Guys, I’m not in law enforcement. So if I use imprecise wording, sorry. I didn’t say it was secret. There is a tracing process that everyone is aware of. That’s all I’m referring to.
    It doesn't work the way you're portraying it as, however, and it's not "easy".

    There's no way for me to look up what guns you own. If I have a make/model/serial number, I can submit that to see who it was sold to. That's about it. There is no database that allows me to use your name as a search parameter for what guns are associated with it.
    "Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer

  7. #27
    To further expand on what a few others have mentioned, tracing a firearm only gets you to the first retail sale that took place via 4473. Then you’ve got to do actual investigative work like interviewing that buyer to find out who they sold it to, and then that next person to see who they sold it to and so on and so forth. If you bought a new gun from an FFL and, if I know the make, model, and serial number, I can contact the ATF and they’ll let me know that you were the first retail buyer and then I can come to you to talk about that gun. If you bought a gun face to face from an individual, or you bought a used gun from an FFL so that you aren’t the first retail purchaser of that firearm, submitting the make, model, and serial number to the ATF doesn’t get me your name.

  8. #28
    Deadeye Dick Clusterfrack's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Paul Blackburn View Post
    Easy button; for travel your CCW is your primary. That being said a 16" AR broken down and stowed in such away that it can be made ready quickly is legal almost everywhere. Not as cool but...has anyone here resorted to their a AR pistol, SBR, or carbine for self defense while traveling?
    I like to have an AR when I’m overlanding / camping in the backcountry, and smaller is better. Sometimes that activity involves crossing state lines.
    "You can never have too many knives." --Joe Ambercrombie
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  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by Clusterfrack View Post
    I like to have an AR when I’m overlanding / camping in the backcountry, and smaller is better. Sometimes that activity involves crossing state lines.
    So a couple things I found out and utilized:

    1. SBR from a commercial pistol or rifle donor doesn’t need a new serial number engraved. You use the factory number.

    2. When requesting interstate travel, you can request a large block of time. Consequently I currently have approval to take my SBR to all of the neighboring states for 12 months as I see fit.

    I use them for competition and requested travel to the neighboring state ranges for the duration of 12 months.

    Next winter I’ll submit the same forms via email with the dates updated.

  10. #30
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    Okay- so say I have an SBR’d lower.
    It I remove the stock, leaving a bare RE, is it a pistol, for purposes of carry under my CCW, and for crossing state lines?

    Which is to say, once the SBR paperwork is done, do I have to ask permission from the ATF to cross state lines with that lower in any configuration, or only if it’s configured as an SBR at the time?

    Also - @ASH556
    I’m curious as to the situation where a Form 4 would be used for an SBR.

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