What caused the price of college to skyrocket was the introduction of government backed student loans...Originally Posted by Wise_A
What caused the price of college to skyrocket was the introduction of government backed student loans...
I think student loans may be part of the increase, but not the biggest part.
Wages in many areas/professions have been stagnant for the last several decades:
.....today’s real average wage (that is, the wage after accounting for inflation) has about the same purchasing power it did 40 years ago. And what wage gains there have been have mostly flowed to the highest-paid tier of workers......in real terms average hourly earnings peaked more than 45 years ago: The $4.03-an-hour rate recorded in January 1973 had the same purchasing power that $23.68 would today. https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tan...d-for-decades/
Here's the way I look at it: In 1972, I was buying gas for $0.36 a gallon in the Midwest (Lincoln, NE). A McDonald's hamburger was $0.28 and a Snickers bar was $0.10. A dozen eggs cost $0.52 and a gallon of milk was $1.20.
Fast forward to 2021: the 1973 purchasing power of $4.04 is equivalent to $23.68 today, a multiple of 5.9.
Again, looking at it from my perspective: In May 2021, the average Midwest price for gas was $2.92, or 8.1 times the 1972 price. A McDonalds hamburger costs $1.59, or 5.67 times the 1972 price. A Snicker's bar is $0.98 at WalMart, or 9.8 times the 1972 price. A dozen eggs costs $1.79, or 3.44 times the 1972 price. By the same token, a gallon of milk was $3.62 in July, 2021, or 3 times the 1972 price.
We can go on and on, but the gist is that aside from subsidized products such as milk and eggs, things are comparatively much more expensive for the average wage earner today than they were 50 years ago.
It just makes sense that the cost of education has risen comparatively, and that the average worker's wages hasn't kept up.
Adding nothing to the conversation since 2015....
Man, I missed last year's "Higher Education Conspiracy Conference"*. But at our meeting two years ago, when we cooked the books, we argued for days about how best to spend all our tuition dollars. Most of us voted that way use them to pay part of the light bill. We couldn't pay all the light bill, because we aren't getting enough revenue to cover lights AND internet AND athletic complexes.
Maybe things changed, declining enrollments are sure to help costs.
*It conflicted with my Global Warming Conspiracy Conference which thankfully we had. That one was almost canceled - again - because it nearly conflicted with the COVID-19 Nanotechnology for Human Control Symposium. It didn't though and I was able to go to both.
As someone who spent a large portion of his life in academia, I am a much bigger believer in incompetence than conspiracy. I saw a few ways money was spent at various universities I was a part of and I was not impressed. That is probably because my priorities are different than most people, though. I wanted to learn stuff and leave. It seemed like the university was bent on building a "lifestyle". New rec center, new dorms, new dining halls, tons of new art installations on campus, new admin buildings, all while I was an undergrad. I don't know if that was pure mismanagement, or all just chasing those enrollment numbers.
My wife has a Bachelors, I have an Associate and decided I wasn't interested in checking a box I disagreed with anymore (specific to my degree feild I think) just shy of my 4 year. Circa 2015.
We have no student loan debt, and never have. It drives my sister in law crazy. There are several things I think helped us "work" our way through college.
-We lived together off campus, just outside the "college" part of town. Room and board seems like it costs at least equal with tuition. There are exceptions to the mandatory "on campus" requirments. Find them and jump through the hoop. We searched high and low for a 1 bedroom that we could afford. It was not glamorus, but neither were we.
-We used Fafsa, Tap, Pell, and all that jazz. It's there. Apply. If you're not going to a school with a big name (we have SUNY degrees) and no room and board this could deal with most of the cost.
-Don't buy your books from the book store. Ever. There will be someone who just took that course, and needs to get rid of it. If you're lucky an off campus textbook store that isn't college affiliated exists. Facebook marketplace wasnt a thing when we were in school.
-Scholarships. My wife had 3 scholarships each semester. She found a large list of scholarships, and applied to everything that she was eligible for. 2 of these were for the entire 4 years, and she reapplied every semester.
-VA. I used a benefit called REAP that paid me directly every month. It was enough to more than cover our rent every month. It's a lesser known benefit that you can use instead of the GI bill, that pays you directly. After you use it up, you can still use your GI bill as long as the 2 combinced dont exceed X number of months. I had to go looking for my benefits and which was best for me. It doesn't happen for you.
-We worked. My wife worked as a waitress at pizza hut all through college. She was damb good at it. Eventually she was a shift manager. Her actual wages went into a seperate account for our wedding, and her tips were our everyday use cash. Gas, buying stuff, etc. I worked a few different jobs, and took any oppurtunity the National Guard gave me to work or train. We paid bills and did stuff within moderation.
-We kept index cards with monthly expenses and income, and checked it regularly against our account. We drove crummy cars. No payments. We still use straight talk phones. We ate a lot of free pizza, and ate out alot. We could have made more if we had learned to cook sooner.
Can you still get a $600 one room apartment? Probably not. But we left college with a wedding account over 7k, and had plenty more than that in the bank to fund our move out of NY. We didn't just get out of college without debt, we dramatically increased our financial stability while there.
Can you work through college without parental support? Yes. But it doesn't look like it used to, probably requires a 2 person team, and it may require at least some savings to get into an apartment. It is not possible with a "college experience" mindset.
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Yeah housing is nuts though. We bought in 2019, refi to a 2.25% APR in 2020. Now our home would sell for 85K more than we have left on our loan. But the market wont really support a move. I have no idea how this will turn out. I know a number of people who are dying to get in over there head on a loan, because that long term failure is actually better for them in the short term then their ever increasing rent.
Last edited by Cory; 04-24-2022 at 08:15 AM.
Congrats, @Cory, from one SUNY guy to another. (Stony Brook in my case, back when dinosaurs still roamed the earth.)
I was fortunate as I had much of the cost defrayed by NY State Regents Scholarships, scholar incentives, as well as a private scholarship.
Don't know that I could handle the load put on young folks today who take on all that debt just to get a B.S.
There's nothing civil about this war.
That is awesome saving man..
I did pretty much the exact thing you did (minus the military thing) and still graduated with about 25k of student debt.
Don't get me wrong, that stuff all helps (I actually commuted to college so the room and board thing was moot)
But "pinching pennies" by buying my textbooks from classmates and hunting for scholarships and working a full time job, as well as not really doing anything fun, eating leftovers, driving a shit ass 1998 minivan in 2015...yeah that was not as helpful for me.
My parents made over 100k a year and most of the scholarships out there had a need criteria so I was basically automatically not eligible for most FAFSA shit.
And even with making 100k a year, Mom and Dad couldn't pay for each of the 6 kids to go through college. We got a little help, then we were on our own. I had considerable worries that I just wouldn't be able to pay for college a few years because I wasn't even eligible for loans through FAFSA.
I used to date a girl who lived just barely above the poverty line. She would get a shitload of money to pay for her tuition at a junior college and she could pocket the (sometimes considerable) difference. Only problem was she was inconsistent and never figured her life out or really took advantage of it, but I was jealous. If I could have gone to college, even a junior college, without paying tuition, I would have done damn near every degree program I could.
Now with the tuition assistance and scholarships I can get at my job, I could probably go back to school for basically free. Only problem is I don't want to go back to college just yet haha.
I paid my student debt off in two years and have considerable savings now thanks to a good job. The wife and I are looking at homeownership, having a fair down payment for the average house around us. We're still saving in hopes of a course correction on the real estate market.
But the idea of frugal living being able to pay for college...like nah the real thing that helps people afford college is stuff like FAFSA and scholarships and less so the minimum wage job that you realistically should only be doing part time while you're trying to study effectively.
Damn I wish rent was 600 bucks for a one bedroom around here tho
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It wasn't $600 around there either. It took us months to find a place. It was a hole.
My wife's parents kicked her out the day after her 18th birthday. She moved in with me, prior to deployment and my parents during deployment. She filed paperwork to be emancipated, and was declared an independent student. This allowed off campus living and made her parents income irrelevent.
@blues I went to SUNY Cobleskill. Cool.
I think the takeaway from both your stories is the same, and exactly what @Boom said earlier...
...working through college is not a realistic option for most people these days. That being the idea to pay for school primarily via work, not for an ancillary nature such as the idea of working through college to make ends meet/beer money/reduce debt or get a head start on life....to note for those who haven't been college aged individuals since the 1960s and think "kids these days just don't work", it's extremely common these days to have a job while in college for those purposes (whether it be through the work-study program or an outside job); it's possible you're just completely detached from reality in 2022 and just don't know what you're rambling about.
"Are you ready? Okay. Let's roll."- Last words of Todd Beamer
Many companies pay for the courses as long as a required grade is maintained. I have worked for 4 companies in Ky. that will pay for employees to go to college while employed. College will take longer to complete as it will be done while working a full time job but there is no debt over their heads after.
Working taxpayers do not owe anyone a free trip to college.
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