Kyle Rittenhouse Trial.

[wvincent]

Snipped to get to the essence.

Mature decision making was not part of the process.

I believe @Glenn E. Meyer has espoused on this in the past, (something, something, insert big word, something not developed at that young age)

Kid should have been home, sneaking a beer, trying to get to third base with some hottie, whatever.
Not out rolling in the mean streets with a bunch of violent adults.

I think some folks are confusing tactical prowess with Lady Luck looking at Kyle and saying, "Aren't you just a little cutie pie? Have a drink on the house, heck, make it a double."

Because he sure was lucky that night. His poor tactics and lack of SA allowed him to get turned into a singleton in the middle of a riot. That ain't great tactics.

I'm not really sure of his true motives for being there, and we'll never know.

I will give him props for zero collaterals though.

[WDR]

I'm curious. How did Gaige Grosskreutz get to testify? Did he have to testify if the defense wanted him as a witness? l]

He is a witness for the prosecution. A rather poor one, it seems.

I hope the judge sees this whole thing for the sham it is, and dismisses the whole case.

I was at work the night this all went down, and watched about a billion videos and looked at the same number of still photos, almost in real time, and it really was a straight up self defense shooting. It never should have gone to court. The criminal complaint was written before the detectives even really collected evidence, as testified by one of them yesterday.

Was the kid foolish and naive? Should he have even been there? You can ask those sorts of questions if you like. None of that takes away his right to self defense.

[Tensaw]

O.M.G.! Just came across this. The hairdo really does tell all! Bwahahahaha!!!

[jh9]

So has PF established that teenagers tend to be idealistic and not have a firm grasp on consequences? Maybe looking for purpose and identity?

Do none of you remember when you were invincible?

I do. It turns out we were wrong about the "invincible" part. It's also a good argument against teenagers wandering around armed during a riot and left to their own devices because they routinely make poor decisions.

This whole thing seems to be a repeat of the Zimmerman shooting in that people are projecting best case / worst case onto people involved based on tribal affiliation. The whole "breakdown of law and order" thing would be a major point in his favor if he were in his own neighborhood. That would be firmly in the "rooftop Korean" category, and he'd be legally, morally and unquestionably in the right.

As it is, he gets to go through the wringer, probably gets a not-guilty verdict thanks to Grosskreutz and ends up a pariah like Zimmerman. Maybe if that happens enough times people will stop inflicting their amateur "help" in places where it does more harm than good. If someone is choking, a reasonable person might give them the Heimlich or slap them on the back. A reasonable person doesn't pull out their Benchmade and go for an emergency tracheotomy.

[BN]

I wonder how old all the guys at Concord were?

[HCountyGuy]

We in the 2A community have a high respect for the Rooftop Koreans of the 90s riots and constantly talk about how The People are the militia, yet many of us look down on Rittenhouse and his associates for choosing to protect Kenosha. What kind of double-standard fuckery is that? Given the circumstances facing our country at the time where such rioting and lawlessness was gaining a foothold in numerous major metropolitan areas some folks decided "Not in my neighborhood" and then rallied the troops to ensure their little slice of the world didn't devolve into a complete shit show comparable to what they were seeing play out across the country. Yet there are those of us who will dismiss that with "it's not their job/responsibility/etc". How fucking pretentious of us as a whole. Sure, some of them may have just been eagerly playing out hero fantasies or LARPing, but one could make similar statements about folks actually in LE/MIL and the statement wouldn't be any less childish or painting with a broad brush. It smacks of arrogance and we should be better than that. Hell, aren't hero fantasies how some recruiters hook applicants?

Spare me all the talk of Rittenhouse was 17 and shouldn't have been there. First off, none of the people there that night should have been there. Period. Full stop.

Rittenhouse may not have lived in Kenosha but had ties to it through his father and his own employment as a lifeguard in the town and hence had an interest in not seeing the town decimated. I don't care that he was 17 and may have held some naive notions about helping out during the chaos there. We've all been young with less than perfect decision making but I couldn't call his decision-making immature. By all the evidence the prosecution seems to be introducing (why are there two defense teams in this trial..?), it paints a picture that Kyle was genuinely interested in trying to help out even offering whatever medical assistance he was capable of providing. His age is irrelevant to me as we've all seen people far older conduct themselves in such a manner as to make 10 year olds look more mature in comparison. We've had people his age and younger go out and do incredibly heroic feats, even fought for our country throughout its history but want to brush him aside because of his age. He may not have had an appreciation for the gravity of the situation if things went bad as they did in his case, but he went there with good intentions while many others engaged in diffusion of responsibility and sat comfortably in their homes to later MMQB him when he was set upon by violent actors.

I will also dispute the idea that the outcome was purely based on luck. Rittenhouse demonstrated awareness, discipline and skill at arms in a volatile situation whereas we've seen instances far more tame in which trained professionals fucked up royally. While running away he falls down, is then immediately set upon by the more bold/violent among the pursuing crowd and only hits those actively attacking or attempting to attack him and even clears a malfunction in the process. He manages to get to his feet and continue de-assing the AO, without needlessly shooting anyone who didn't need shooting or even doing something as stupid as taunting the crowd. Now that's not to say there was no luck involved as he's fortunate Grosskreutz didn't get on-target in time or that there weren't more in the crowd dedicated to attacking him, but Kyle still did well given the shit sandwich he was given.

Rant over.

[TGS]

Rant over.

I think you're just going to need to accept that a significant portion of people think he's a dumbass for all the reasons that have already been laid out.

[jh9]

I wonder how old all the guys at Concord were?

Maybe the same age as the guys in the Whiskey Rebellion?

History is written by the victors. Always has been.

[WobblyPossum]

I’m willing to cut the kid some slack due to his age at the time. We all know 17 year old brains aren’t fully developed and they make more spontaneous decisions without really diving into the possible consequences than adults do. If Kyle had been a guy in his 30s, I would probably be one of the people talking about how he is an idiot who wanted to play hero. Kyle likely thought he was actually helping the situation.

When things went sideways, he did show impressive restraint and control. He didn’t just mag dump into the crowd. He only hit his assailants, not any of the uninvolved bystanders. He only engaged someone when a threat to his life could have been reasonably articulated.

Whatever happens with the trial, there’s a good chance his life won’t be great going forward. Even if acquitted, he’s going to be a pariah like George Zimmerman.

[Kanye Wyoming]

I’m willing to cut the kid some slack due to his age at the time. We all know 17 year old brains aren’t fully developed and they make more spontaneous decisions without really diving into the possible consequences than adults do. If Kyle had been a guy in his 30s, I would probably be one of the people talking about how he is an idiot who wanted to play hero. Kyle likely thought he was actually helping the situation.

When things went sideways, he did show impressive restraint and control. He didn’t just mag dump into the crowd. He only hit his assailants, not any of the uninvolved bystanders. He only engaged someone when a threat to his life could have been reasonably articulated.

Whatever happens with the trial, there’s a good chance his life won’t be great going forward. Even if acquitted, he’s going to be a pariah like George Zimmerman.

To the contrary, I suspect that at minimum, once he turns 21 he'll never pay for a drink.