Kyle Rittenhouse Trial.

[Borderland]

I'm curious. How did Gaige Grosskreutz get to testify? Did he have to testify if the defense wanted him as a witness? There were just too many important facts that could have been leveraged by the defense. I don't know any "medics" that would carry an unlicensed concealed pistol to a riot to render first aid.

The defense pretty much made it look like self defense with Grosskreutz's testimony. He's lucky he's still breathing and too stupid to understand that. Instead he looks for a paycheck.

Gaige Grosskreutz, who was shot by Kyle Rittenhouse during racial justice protests in Kenosha, Wisconsin last year, is suing the city, the county and several law enforcement officers, claiming they condoned the efforts of white nationalists to violently dispel demonstrators protesting a police shooting.

https://www.npr.org/2021/10/17/10468...in-jacob-blake

[hufnagel]

Those points are speculative on my part. But what other reason was he out there providing “rescue and first aid while protecting the business of Kenosha”? He is not a paid, or trained police officer, EMT, fire fighter etc. So while it is a supposition on my part, the only reason I can see him being out there is some type of hero fantasy. Mature decision making was not part of the process.

Being lucky and being skilled are not the same thing. Wow… he was skilled enough to make hits at contact distance? Three attackers, all coming head on, one at a time? And was able to evade a crowd after he popped the first three who were dumb enough to come at him? Yes, he was successful that night. But that was pure luck for the most part. If two or three ran up on him from different directions, one would have taken him to the ground. This kid is not Chuck Norris or Rambo.

I'm going to give you an opportunity to rebut the following, but it sure sounds like you're saying only those paid/contracted/authorized to do so, should do any defending of any kind. Such thinking would, to me, fly in the face of the concept of the militia, and in potentially in terms of self defense in general.

[Catshooter]

Those points are speculative on my part. But what other reason was he out there providing “rescue and first aid while protecting the business of Kenosha”? He is not a paid, or trained police officer, EMT, fire fighter etc. So while it is a supposition on my part, the only reason I can see him being out there is some type of hero fantasy. Mature decision making was not part of the process.

This kid is not Chuck Norris or Rambo.

So, the only time anyone should help his fellow man is either in the grip of a wild fantasy, or when their getting paid? Ok, Dr. Fauci, whatever you say.

Judging (yes, I'm judging!) from how many people stand around and record someone hurt/dying/in trouble and do not a fucking thing, this must be a fairly common attitude.

Disgusting.

I agree he's not Chuck Norris. Norris could take lessons from Kyle. Like to see you show the same courage at 17.

[hufnagel]

So, the only time anyone should help his fellow man is either in the grip of a wild fantasy, or when their getting paid? Ok, Dr. Fauci, whatever you say.

Judging (yes, I'm judging!) from how many people stand around and record someone hurt/dying/in trouble and do not a fucking thing, this must be a fairly common attitude.

Disgusting.

I agree he's not Chuck Norris. Norris could take lessons from Kyle. Like to see you show the same courage at 17.

It's hard to "judge" him, knowing i'm looking at him and the situation through 48 year old married father of a teenage boy eyes, knowing I couldn't make the choices he did at the current time. To me, I have more to lose.

[Joe in PNG]

There is a big difference between Normal Times, and times when you have a breakdown of law & order.

During Normal Times, gunning up and jumping in a disturbance that doesn't involve you is a Stupid Thing.

Then, there's circumstances where the normal apparatus of law & order breaks down. Major natural disasters, large scale rioting, and so on. During those times, you can't expect a proper response for the various emergency services, so survival means taking care of things yourself. And while rare, it's not unprecedented- the LA riots, post-Andrew Miami or post-Katrina New Orleans come to mind.

The question is if this was the latter situation. I would venture a tentative yes.

[Caballoflaco]

So, the only time anyone should help his fellow man is either in the grip of a wild fantasy, or when their getting paid? Ok, Dr. Fauci, whatever you say.

Judging (yes, I'm judging!) from how many people stand around and record someone hurt/dying/in trouble and do not a fucking thing, this must be a fairly common attitude.

Disgusting.

I agree he's not Chuck Norris. Norris could take lessons from Kyle. Like to see you show the same courage at 17.

I don’t see that he was actually helping anything. Did you see any of the videos of the “group” he was loosely affiliated with? His intentions are meaningless to me, it’s results that matter and best I can tell his being there didn’t actually accomplish anything except cosplay that got real and him becoming a defendant in a nationally covered trial. Shit still got burnt, stores still got looted and he’s already spent a not inconsiderable time locked up.



Having said that I do think those were legally justified shoots and he shouldn’t go to jail.

[43Under]

I don’t see that he was actually helping anything. Did you see any of the videos of the “group” he was loosely affiliated with? His intentions are meaningless to me, it’s results that matter and best I can tell his being there didn’t actually accomplish anything except cosplay that got real and him becoming a defendant in a nationally covered trial. Shit still got burnt, stores still got looted and he’s already spent a not inconsiderable time locked up.

Not to mention how much $ he/his family has no doubt already spent on his defense.

[Joe in PNG]

I don’t see that he was actually helping anything. Did you see any of the videos of the “group” he was loosely affiliated with? His intentions are meaningless to me, it’s results that matter and best I can tell his being there didn’t actually accomplish anything except cosplay that got real and him becoming a defendant in a nationally covered trial. Shit still got burnt, stores still got looted and he’s already spent a not inconsiderable time locked up.



Having said that I do think those were legally justified shoots and he shouldn’t go to jail.

I would agree with both points. It would appear to me that if the intention was to go Rooftop Korean during a breakdown of law & order, the smart thing is to stick to whatever place he intended to protect.

[HCM]

I would agree with both points. It would appear to me that if the intention was to go Rooftop Korean during a breakdown of law & order, the smart thing is to stick to whatever place he intended to protect.

I agree about his intention. I believe that is the "hero fantasy" gadfly was referring to. I believe his intentions were not entirely negative and helping in a mirror image of an "antifa street medic" role was part of his intention.

very much an example of "Good initiative, bad judgment" which puts him on equal footing with "Lefty" in intentionally placing themselves in the classic mix of Stupid People, Stupid Places, and Stupid Things. Rittenhouse traveling from another community vs being in his own community is also a negative for him. On balance, IMHO Rittenhouse should get more slack than "lefty" because he is only 17, nor does the SSS negate his claim to self defense.

[BehindBlueI's]

So has PF established that teenagers tend to be idealistic and not have a firm grasp on consequences? Maybe looking for purpose and identity?

Do none of you remember when you were invincible?