Alec Baldwin kills crew member on set with "prop gun"

[Joe in PNG]

It's been pointed out, repeatedly, that as a rule, most actors are not only massive idiots, but also tend towards being not exactly the most stable or sober people as well.

So, imagine handing a blank firing gun to a doped up Lindsay Lohan or cracked out Charlie Sheen for a safety check. Or to someone like Gwyneth "My Vagina Should Be A Scented Candle!" Paltrow, who would very likely manage to render any prop gun utterly useless in the process. Repeatedly.

That the normal Hollywood safety procedures has actually kept this group of utter idiots from fatal firearms accidents on an annual basis as they regularly point and shoot guns at each other means they are doing something right.

[DDTSGM]

She is broke (no blood to squeeze from that stone) and there seems to be significant evidence (her own admission, even) that she is not competent. The civil suits will go after the production company that hired her, using terms like "negligent entrustment."

Not harshing on you but I feel that it is important to point out that when she made those statements she was talking about her first time as head armorer, which was not on this movie.

The statement 'You'll never work in this town again' does seem to fit her situation, though.

[OlongJohnson]

Not harshing on you but I feel that it is important to point out that when she made those statements she was talking about her first time as head armorer, which was not on this movie.

Right. It was another movie that wrapped up shooting a few months ago. Here's how that went:

Before it starts, her: "I'm not sure I'm ready."
After it was over, her: "It went really smooth."
Everyone else, during it: Freaked out and paused filming because she handed an unchecked firearm to an 11-year-old actress.

I haven't seen any statements that she worked on any other shoots between that one and this one, so Rust was presumably her second time working, after demonstrating incompetence the first time.

[peterb]

I haven't seen any statements that she worked on any other shoots between that one and this one, so Rust was presumably her second time working, after demonstrating incompetence the first time.

I’m hoping that when the dust settles, there will be an NTSB-type report that goes several layers of “why?” deep into how this happened.

That’s something I respect about the investigation of aviation accidents. They don’t stop at “pilot error” — they want to know why the pilot screwed up, and how they ended up in that situation. Poor training? Outside pressure? Bad attitude? Done it previously with no consequence? Why did they think it was ok to do what they did?

And how many ways did the whole chain of safeguards break down? Fatal accidents are often a result of multiple failures.

If you start with the assumption that nobody wants to make a mistake that kills somebody, you need to go past “they screwed up” to really understand how it happened, and to help prevent it from happening again.

[CraigS]

VT1032 asked why there would be live ammunition on a movie set? I'd be very interested to know that also. Another question would be is there any way for blanks to somehow kill a person? Since it was supposedly one bullet that passed through the unfortunate woman's body and injured the man behind her it doesn't seem likely, but I have no experience w/ blanks.

[peterb]

Just based on the fragmentary and possibly incorrect information so far:

-Why were there live rounds on the set?
- Were live rounds properly identified and segregated?
-Why did the armorer think they should load a weapon with live rounds?
-Did the armorer know they were loading a weapon with live rounds?
-Were the three pistols on the cart a mix of “hot” and “cold”? Were they identified as such?
-Why did the AD assume the pistol he picked up was “cold”?
-Did the armorer know the proper protocol for handling weapons?
-Had the armorer been trained? How?
-If not, why were they working in that role?
…and so on

[Duelist]

VT1032 asked why there would be live ammunition on a movie set? I'd be very interested to know that also. Another question would be is there any way for blanks to somehow kill a person? Since it was supposedly one bullet that passed through the unfortunate woman's body and injured the man behind her it doesn't seem likely, but I have no experience w/ blanks.

Both of these questions were addressed earlier, but to re-cap: in general, no, live “there’s an actual bullet in the case with actual powder and primer that is intended to put holes in people” ammunition has no place on a movie set. Here are protocols for using that type of ammunition in filming under specific, rigidly controlled situations, but they are not used on normal sets, should *not* be the norm, and never in a gun that is being pointed at people because that’s just completely mind-numbingly stupid.

Live ammunition in “movie talk” might be termed a live blank that will go bang when the primer is detonated. Inert, dummy cartridges that are loaded and unloaded on camera will look like actual live rounds (with an actual bullet in the case), but should have no powder or live primer.

Brandon Lee was apparently killed when a gun with a “no-powder but live-primer” dummy cartridge was loaded in a gun, the bullet was lodged in the barrel of the gun during manipulations that set off the live primer (but the gun wasn’t checked thoroughly after) and then the same gun was loaded with blanks for another scene, and the powder charge from the blank propelled the bullet lodged in the barrel out and into the torso of Mr. Lee and caused a lethal injury. Any kind barrel obstruction could have potentially caused that injury, especially in the close proximity that many scenes are shot.

[nycnoob]

https://nypost.com/2021/10/24/halyna...or-fun-report/

Multiple sources connected to the production of the film told TMZ that the gun was fired at off-the-clock gatherings – which could explain how a live round found its way into the gun’s chamber.


Another source who was on set told the outlet that when cops arrived they found live ammo and blank rounds stored in the same area, where the fatal mix-up could have occurred.

[walker2713]

My sympathies are 100% with the deceased and injured victims and their families. Baldwin is an a$$hole of the first order and he’ll have to live with his “conscience” as we all do.

There are a gazillion questions and possibilities involved here….but for me it really boils down to this:

How and why did Baldwin point a firearm at another person and pull the trigger?

[Paul D]

The set armorer is Thell Reed's daughter? I suspect she not even Combat Master Lite or anything like her father when he was her age.